thought and question on DeMatteis Spider-Man run (SSM & ASM)

[RonG]

JMD's Spectacular Spider-Man run (178-200) is probably my favorite short-term Spider-run and while recently re-reading it, I thought that the (then-parallel to SSM) plotline in ASM with Peter's parents had a thematic connection with JMD's 'The Child Within' - JMD bringing up Peter's trauma regarding his parents, while a short while later they turn up in ASM.

Of course, JMD's run is concluded with #200, and that's where his run gets a curious 'post-script'.
After JMD goes to ASM he first deals with the climax of Spidey's search for the mastermind behind his parents' "new death" and finds that person to be Harry (pre his death / redemption in #200). Basically, ASM #389 & 390 deal with Peter's renewed anger towards Harry, even after they made peace in SSM #200.

I understand that this plot thread gets dealt with in SSM Annual #14 and I was interested to read your feedback and input on this issue and 'Harry's last plot' plotline, as relating to JDM's SSM run.
Also, any thoughts on JMD's later ASM (during the Clone Saga)run?

[RonG]

One thing regarding SSM Annual #14 -
I can't seem to understand its placement in chronology:

the storyline that goes from 'Lifetheft' to 'Pursuit' to 'Shrieking' ends with Peter angry with Harry and into his 'I'm the Spider' phase, which lasts well into the beginning of the Clone Saga.
SSM Annual #14 shows Peter still angry (and ends with him making peace with the Osborns), while no mention of the Clone or what he goes through with 'The Spider' - this came out before Peter pulled himself together, but the events don't line up.. or am I missing something?

[RJT]

One thing regarding SSM Annual #14 -
I can't seem to understand its placement in chronology:

the storyline that goes from 'Lifetheft' to 'Pursuit' to 'Shrieking' ends with Peter angry with Harry and into his 'I'm the Spider' phase, which lasts well into the beginning of the Clone Saga.
SSM Annual #14 shows Peter still angry (and ends with him making peace with the Osborns), while no mention of the Clone or what he goes through with 'The Spider' - this came out before Peter pulled himself together, but the events don't line up.. or am I missing something?

I haven't reread the annual for a couple of years, but my memory of it is that it fits sometime before "Lifetheft"/"Pursuit", even though it was released a few months after that storyline. Given the fact that the story was co-plotted by DeMatteis and Tom Lyle and scripted by Ann Nocenti and another person that I can't remember without the issue in front of me, I always thought it was something that might have been intended for earlier (possibly DeMatteis started plotting it before he left the book following Maximum Carnage--it feels like it fits in shortly after Spectacular 200) and by the time it was drawn JMD didn't have the time to script it.

[RonG]

I haven't reread the annual for a couple of years, but my memory of it is that it fits sometime before "Lifetheft"/"Pursuit", even though it was released a few months after that storyline. Given the fact that the story was co-plotted by DeMatteis and Tom Lyle and scripted by Ann Nocenti and another person that I can't remember without the issue in front of me, I always thought it was something that might have been intended for earlier (possibly DeMatteis started plotting it before he left the book following Maximum Carnage--it feels like it fits in shortly after Spectacular 200) and by the time it was drawn JMD didn't have the time to script it.

Annual #14 specifically deals with Peter dealing with and forgiving the Osborns (Liz and Normie) for what Harry did & revealed in ASM 389-390 (about a year after SSM 200).
Also, SSM 200 ends on a 'positive note', at least for Peter and Harry's relationship.. which then comes undone due to what Harry did (before, only to be revealed later) in AM 389, so Annual 14 can't be right after SSM 200..

[Mister Mets]

My short answer is that the Spectacular Spider-Man run is really good. The Harry Osborn arc might be the best mega-arc in the Spider-Man comics.

His Amazing Spider-Man was okay. There were way too many crossovers, but these were the best chapters of the crossovers.

For any of his fans, I'd recommend his Marvel Team-Up, much of which is followed up on in Spectacular Spider-Man.

[Spidey_62]

His later 90s Spectacular Spider-Man post clone saga run is really good, too.

[HypnoHustler]

Yeah. I also think JM’s early 90s Spec run is one of the best and most underrated Spidey runs of all time (even though I’m not crazy about the Buscemi artwork as others). Nothing more I can add that hasn’t already been said, just that I love it (but I lost my back issues a while ago, and now I can’t seem to track down the run in trade or on comiXology unfortunately. Marvel is nuts for not collecting this).

His ASM run is a mixed bag, mostly because of editorial forcing contrived clone saga plot developments on him, but he makes the most of it and understands Ben Reilly the best of all the writers during that time. Still, there’s some pretty silly issues here and there. His work before that, from the end of Pursuit to the I-am-the-Spider craziness is…. well…. let’s just say JM was going for something deep and didn’t quite pull it off. Peter’s six month mental breakdown in the books is both hard to take and exhausting to read. It’s overwrought and clearly intended to copy the grim and gritty tone of ‘Dark Knight’ and the Image books… but that doesn’t work with Peter (maybe in shorter and slightly more restrained doses like ‘Back in Black’ with JMS a decade later). The spider cocoon was probably the nadir of this era. As misguided as this era was, at least JM somewhat gets his psycho babble… when DeFalco and Mackie try to incorporate the grim Peter in their books it seems even more out of place. That said, there’s gorgeous artwork from Bagley throughout. Probably even prefer it to his USM art, and it’s miles ahead of his output now. So that alone makes it worth it. Also, his ‘Lost Years’ and ‘Redemption’ minis are awesome and definitely worth picking up from this time.

JM also had a short run on Spec in the late 90s after the clone saga ended. It’s good, not great. There’s some compelling issues, especially Spec #250 when Norman returns. He also shows he can do comedy with his ‘Legion of Losers’ issues (and they’re genuinely funny). There’s also a decent Chameleon storyline. But other than that, nothing too memorable from this era. Luke Ross’s pencils are decent as well; some aren’t a fan (they think it’s too cartoony to fit with JM), but I think he did well.

So, those are my thoughts.