Arrow

[Kalen O.]

Any more than a pilot handing Sara a picture of his daughter on Lian Yu and asking her to look out for the girl if she got off, and that daughter being Sin? Coincidences are abound on this show

Umm, no. That's not remotely the same thing, because that bit explains why Sara sought out Sin and took her under her wing in the first place. It wasn't a coincidence, it was a plot point.

[kalorama]

Any more than a pilot handing Sara a picture of his daughter on Lian Yu and asking her to look out for the girl if she got off, and that daughter being Sin? Coincidences are abound on this show

Well, within the actual context of the story, that's not really a coincidence. Sara had no prior knowledge or relationship with Sin. The two ended up together because Sara kept her promise to the father and set out to find her after she returned to the U.S..

[Beantownbrown]

I want to see H.I.V.E. in season 3 and Lex. And PLEASE have Roy NOT wear his funky red hoodie. That dude wore it in every episode he was in.

[90'sCartoonMan]

In the off-season, I decided to go back and watch some early New Girl. Katie Cassidy plays a recovering alcoholic. Guess there's no way for me to escape Arrow!

But it wouldn't it be genius if they revived Arrow twenty years from now and had Stephen Amell playing Mike Grell's Ollie but in more of a mentor role? I'm not suggesting anyone is thinking that far ahead, but who knew that John Wesley Shipp would be involved with a Flash show again? It's one of those things that's just a nice tease but it's not as crazy as it once was to think about DC's cinematic universe stretching into 2030 now...

I kind of like that. Actually, they don't even need to do a spin-off for that. Well, they could, but what if that's what they have in mind for the final season? What if they've already done their five years of island flashbacks and in the last season, they want to have present day as a flashback, the last days of The Arrow? Along with that, they also have a story in 2030, where Connor is discovering the truth about his parentage and learns that Starling City needs the Arrow again. Mentor Ollie, new Arrow Connor, and the series ends with passing on the mantle.

Wow, that would be almost as sweet as Christopher Reeve's appearances on "Smallville." Emphasis on "almost."

Yeah, it wouldn't equal up. I'd say Justin Hartley meeting Stephen Amell's Arrow would be the equivalent of the time Dean Cain was on Smallville.

Now that the Mirakuru arc has been wrapped up, do you suppose the show will return to a more down to earth approach with no meta powers, or will it continue to add more and just go nuts? I can't help but remember when Diggle said "What's next, vampires?" I think that with Barry Allen running around at warp speed in nearby Central City it will be hard to keep from continuing to go the meta route in Starling.

I don't think they'll go with VAMPIRES, but once you let the meta genie out of the bottle, you can't really put it back in.

From the looks of the 5-minute Flash trailer, Meta-Humans are a brand new phenomenon, caused by the particle accelerator going boom. Dark energies leaking into our world or some such techno-babble. I'm expecting this to give Laurel her comic book power.

That could work...although considering some of the big name DC heroes are alien species or from hidden, super powered civilizations on Earth, there'd have to be other explanations for them. If they show up.

And PLEASE have Roy NOT wear his funky red hoodie. That dude wore it in every episode he was in.

Yeah, it's probably REALLY funky at this point!

[Kensei]

Yeah, it's probably REALLY funky at this point!

Oh, he probably washes it. The same could be said for Ollie's suit if nobody ever does their laundry. Now that he has the mask though, Roy really does need an official costume.

[Kensei]

I finally just watched the 5-minute Flash trailer for the first time. Wow, wow, and double wow! Weather Wizard as his first big bad, fighting tornadoes, an eventual showdown with Prof. Zoom apparently who killed his mother- what's not to like? The new suit design is fine with me and Gustin looks like he's slid very easily into the role of Barry. And this isn't totally off topic since there is at least one "Arrow" crossover where it looks like Barry goes to Starling City to get advice from Oliver, who actually gives him the idea for what to call himself. I hope Barry and Felicity get at least one more exchange together too.

BTW there is also a shorter teaser trailer out there too, just for laughs, which shows the two heroes out in a rural setting, Oliver somberly and slowly drawing an arrow and preparing to shoot at a target on a tree as the Flash races across miles of countryside getting closer and closer. Oliver fires, Flash blows past him at lightning speed, then passes the arrow in flight, and catches it just before it can hit the tree. Flash then lets out a "WHOO-HOO!" and Oliver just looks at him and says "Showoff." Funny stuff.

[brucekent12]

Really enjoyed the finale, it was great.My only disappointment was that Sara left. Big Caity Lotz fan, hope she returns for some more episodes next year!

[VolcanikTiger86]

Any more than a pilot handing Sara a picture of his daughter on Lian Yu and asking her to look out for the girl if she got off, and that daughter being Sin? Coincidences are abound on this show

More of a plot point, it would annoy me more that she wait like 4 years to do it if i was going to get angry about it.

I kind of like that. Actually, they don't even need to do a spin-off for that. Well, they could, but what if that's what they have in mind for the final season? What if they've already done their five years of island flashbacks and in the last season, they want to have present day as a flashback, the last days of The Arrow? Along with that, they also have a story in 2030, where Connor is discovering the truth about his parentage and learns that Starling City needs the Arrow again. Mentor Ollie, new Arrow Connor, and the series ends with passing on the mantle.

I can dig that but I would introduce maybe Artemis to be his 'BlacK Canary/Love Interest', I also think it would be awesome for Connor and 'Love Interest' to run out and see Ollver, Sara/Laurel and Felicity watching over them, i think it would be a sweet scene.

And this isn't totally off topic since there is at least one "Arrow" crossover where it looks like Barry goes to Starling City to get advice from Oliver, who actually gives him the idea for what to call himself. I hope Barry and Felicity get at least one more exchange together too.

BTW there is also a shorter teaser trailer out there too, just for laughs, which shows the two heroes out in a rural setting, Oliver somberly and slowly drawing an arrow and preparing to shoot at a target on a tree as the Flash races across miles of countryside getting closer and closer. Oliver fires, Flash blows past him at lightning speed, then passes the arrow in flight, and catches it just before it can hit the tree. Flash then lets out a "WHOO-HOO!" and Oliver just looks at him and says "Showoff." Funny stuff.

Agreed I think that Felicity could split time between the two but that would annoy all the Olicity fans.

Really enjoyed the finale, it was great.My only disappointment was that Sara left. Big Caity Lotz fan, hope she returns for some more episodes next year!

I would say that she will be back without any difficults if they want the mantle passed to Laurel then Sara has to come back and die, for me it would be stupid for Laurel to be the Black Canary when Sara is alive and kicking, i hope Sara returns and is made a regular in Season 4

[Kensei]

I would say that she will be back without any difficults if they want the mantle passed to Laurel then Sara has to come back and die, for me it would be stupid for Laurel to be the Black Canary when Sara is alive and kicking, i hope Sara returns and is made a regular in Season 4

If it turns out that Lotz only signed a contract for one season (as Summer Glau apparently did), I could see her being written out without having to appear again by having Nyssa or some other representative of the League of Assassins coming to tell Oliver, "We regret to inform you the Canary died heroically on her last mission." I hope it doesn't happen though.

[VolcanikTiger86]

If it turns out that Lotz only signed a contract for one season (as Summer Glau apparently did), I could see her being written out without having to appear again by having Nyssa or some other representative of the League of Assassins coming to tell Oliver, "We regret to inform you the Canary died heroically on her last mission." I hope it doesn't happen though.

Not to fuel the fire because I'm right there with you, but it would explain why she left to rejoin the league especially when she said in 'Heir to a Demon' that she couldn't take any more killing, hopefully Lotz will return i haven't found anything to indicate that she has other projects for next year. I wonder if i should do a poll and see who wants Laurel to be Black Canary and who wants Sara to keep the mantle or people who don't care.

[Slade Wilson]

I finally just watched the 5-minute Flash trailer for the first time. Wow, wow, and double wow! Weather Wizard as his first big bad, fighting tornadoes, an eventual showdown with Prof. Zoom apparently who killed his mother- what's not to like? The new suit design is fine with me and Gustin looks like he's slid very easily into the role of Barry. And this isn't totally off topic since there is at least one "Arrow" crossover where it looks like Barry goes to Starling City to get advice from Oliver, who actually gives him the idea for what to call himself. I hope Barry and Felicity get at least one more exchange together too.

The trailer is from the Flash Pilot, Oliver makes a very short appearance (just the scene we see in the trailer) which was confirmed recently by Amell himself. I wouldnt expect Felicity to pop up. Besides I think their thing is over, which was kind of acknowledged by Felicity in "The man under the hood" when Cisco and Caitlin told her about Iris (which as we all know is meant to be Barrys wife someday).

By the way the Arrow EPs have indeed said that Arrow Season 3 will get away from metahuman stuff and return to the more grounded, realistic style of Season 1. They only did the metahuman stuff in season 2 as a means to be able to introduce the Flash into their world. Now that Flash gets his own show , Arrow will return to its grounded roots while Flash will deal with the scifi and metahuman stuff. They also want to do this because they want to make both shows stylistically as different as possible.

They have also said that they intend to give each season on Arrow a very different feel and that with Season 3 they want to make it very different from Season 2.

So yeah dont expect them to develop the show further into scifi and metahuman stuff on Season 3 and expand the range of the DCU on the show even more into the more comic book-ey stuff. Its gonna be quite the opposite.

[boredmonkey]

I have so far not seen any criticism of some obvious weak plotlines...(I have not read the previous posts)
1.. season,1 was all about meryln taking revenge for his wife's murder..they made it seem like he was some devoted best hubbie who lost his soulmate.. but in season 2 his affair with moira and him being Thea's dad and his indifference to Tommy so far but suddenly thinking of family when he learnt that thea is from him?? what the hell?! it seriously diminished his villiany/motivation. whatever it is he is doing.
2..and coming to thea is she the most stupid character on the show? and what now she is going to be fighter like Cheshire?? but for what reason? seriously apart from being the main character's whiny sister what has she done? she never confronted her brother or bf for the truth..she simply up and left..people are getting killed and her complaint was everyone lies to me wah!! and in the end she joins the biggest liar and douche to become "tough"? what the hell..
3.. why didn't anyone investigate merlyn in season 2 ? I mean they dug up so much dirt on moira but nothing on him..not even checking for his body..not the police or arrow.. and is moira knew about her son's secret why didn't she tell him about merlyn being alive sooner? the guy blows up half the city and no one completes or even begins an investigation on him??
4..when did Slade fall in love with shado? was it when he was in constant pain and dying from bomb injuries.. you know when he wasn't even aware of what was happening?? and why is Oliver responsible for her death????? how can u be responsible when the killer would kill u anyway after he got what he wants? so fucked up? and how many people did Slade kill after the island to finance his revenge? didn't nobody think of that? Waller was ready to bomb the city but in the end she just locks him up?? he probably has so many enemies who want to hurt him for his killings and they probably have a better justified revenge than this loser?
5.. killing is no more arrow style OK..but why kill the count and let Slade live? instead of showing him do unnecessary workouts and shooting bouncing tennis balls it would be a better show of skill if he saved felicity without killing the count..I mean wouldn't deadshot shoot of his fingers or the weapon and show his skill ? unnecessar stupid drama..u decide to stop killing but haven't thought of non lethal tactics? what incompetence is this?
6..Isabel rochev..why give her so much screentime when all she is is a thug for Slade? and also since she is dead arrow can easily take over his company right? or will they pull a meryln and nobody finds her body and acts like she washed her hands of this company?

[Slade Wilson]

I have so far not seen any criticism of some obvious weak plotlines...(I have not read the previous posts)
3.. why didn't anyone investigate merlyn in season 2 ...

4..when did Slade fall in love with shado...

5.killing is no more arrow style OK..but why kill the count and let Slade live?...

6..Isabel rochev..why give her so much screentime when all she is is a thug for Slade? and also since she is dead arrow can easily take over his company right? or will they pull a meryln and nobody finds her body and acts like she washed her hands of this company?

Damn. I had written a very lengthy and detailed reply where I addressed all of your points but after splitting it into two parts (reply was too long for one post) I accidentally clicked on "Reply to this thread" instead of posting quick reply.

the result is that now my entire reply to your first two points is completely lost and I wrote so much about that subject (about 7000 characters) that I really cant re-write all that, sorry.

I still have my reply to the points 3-6 though since I copied that before posting so you´ll still have plenty to read but I am afraid we´ll have to skip your first two points about Merlyn and Thea. Sorry for that, I am really angry myself that I lost all that stuff.

So here are my replies to your points 3-6:

3. No one investigated Merlyn because everyone thought he was dead. Yeah his body wasnt found but that is not surprising in all the chaos during the earthquake at the end of Season 1. He was officially declared dead. You dont investigate someone who is declared dead. And since there was absolutely no sign of him ever since that would put him back on Olivers radar, he had no reason to suspect he was alive. Also remember this is a TV show about a comic book not a documentary. As my best friend would say "You cant look for logic at every turn. Thats why we call it fiction".

Moira didnt tell Oliver about Merlyn for the same reason she didnt tell Thea about her true father - fear. then Oliver and Moira were on the outs and that wasnt exactly the best moment to tell him either. Also she believed she had Merlyn under control with her threat about Ras al Ghul and didnt believe that he would be a threat to Arrow anytime soon. And when the moment finally was right to tell him, they were assaulted by Deathstroke.


4. Oh the subject of Slade...now we get to my favorite part :P Slade was already in love with Shado by the time of season 1. You can already see glimpses of that when he is training with her near the end of Season 1. It becomes very clear when he watches Oliver and Shado in the water together that he is hurt by that and subsequently tells Oliver that "women are a distraction" which was basically Slades way of telling him "Stay the hell away from my woman, kid"

Also you always try to rationalize everything so much. Love is never really rational and neither is pain. Trust me I speak from experience. Of course it wasnt Olivers fault that Shado died. Everyone in his right mind knows that. If Shado hadnt been killed, then Sara would have (I would have preferred that to be honest). Slade however is not in his right mind. the woman he loved but never was able to have was killed due to the choice made by a man who not only was his friend but also had Shado. Slade never had Shado and the man who did threw her life away to save the girl , with whom he betrayed his actual girlfriend with. Add to that the mirakuru in him and it is absolutely no wonder that Slade snapped. Imagine the woman you love gets executed point blank right after you were finally able to tell her how you feel. That alone does a number on you, believe me. And then the fact that she was killed because the guy who had become a brother for you sacrificed her for another girl that you couldnt care less about? And then your friend even lies to you and pretends like he had nothing to do with it instead of telling you straight away what really happened.

Those intense levels of pain and heartbreak mixed with feelings of betrayal and enormous rage lead to a place where rationality no longer applies. If you ever fall deeply in love and have that love ripped away from your life (I have) then maybe you´ll understand that level of pain and rage someday.

Yes Slade killed a lot of people after he got off the island. I dont know how well you know the character of Deathstroke but in the comics Deathstroke is an elite mercenary and assassin, the best in the world. He is very selective of his clients and has amassed enormous wealth over only a few years because he is very highly paid for his jobs by his clients which includes even governments.

And of course Waller would not kill Slade. Do you even know Amanda Waller? She would never kill someone who is far too valuable to destroy. She wanted to bomb the city because of Slades Mirakuru army which was completely out of control and was about to become a threat for the entire nation. She locked Slade up partially because Oliver did not want him killed and she and Oliver have a past history but also because Waller most definitely does not want to destroy a valuable weapon like Deathstroke. In the comics Slade has worked for governments and he will in fact join the new Suicide Squad in July and Waller also approached him about the Squad at the end of Batman: Arkham Origins so its really no surprise that Waller would not want to destroy Slade. he is a powerful weapon that can still be of great use to her. And Amanda Waller never wastes something like that. Plus the whole point of the Finale and of Season 2 was to take down Slade without killing him. So if Waller would kill him in the end that would betrayed the whole point of the story here.

Also? He is goddamn Deathstroke the Terminator! You dont kill off the "scariest badass on the planet" (Directly quoted from Deathstroke #1, 2011). I would have stopped watching Arrow for good if they had killed off Slade to be honest. He is my favorite character and one of the biggest badasses in the DC Universe. You dont kill those kind of characters or at least you shouldnt.

5. Oliver killed Vertigo because he had no choice. The guy literally had a deadly dose of Vertigo at Felicitys throat. if he had stopped him in a non-lethal way, the probability of Felicity getting killed was far too high. There are some people with whom you dont take any chances. Felicity is one of them. As Oliver later said "There was no choice". Was it the right choice? That is a whole different question. But you also need to remember that Oliver is on a constant journey towards the superhero he is meant to be. he is NOT the Green Arrow yet so he will not always make the right choice and will stumble here and there on his journey. maybe it was the wrong choice to kill Vertigo but it was Olivers to make in that moment and it only reinforced the importance of taking down Slade in a non-lethal way if he wants to be a hero and not a simple vigilante who is out for blood (no pun intended lol). If anything then Olivers choice to not take the easy way out this time and take down Slade without killing him proves how far he has come since he killed Vertigo.

6. Well yeah isabel was a bit of a mess despite her being played beautifully by Summer Glau to perfection. The fact is that the EPs of Arrow didnt really know what to do with her halfway through the season because she had served her purpose but they didnt want to lose Summer like that and decided to make her into the first Ravager (also because Summer Glau ´s greatest strength lies in portraying kick ass characters) which seemed like a perfect fit for Summer. But then they had trouble giving her a good place in the storyline and ran out of time to explore her properly. they couldnt keep her around for Season 3 because they wanted to conclude the Mirakuru story in Season 2 so they got rid of her as quick as possible in the end to focus on the main clonflict between Oliver and Slade.

Its a shame and her death was actually the biggest letdown of Season 2 for me. If at least least she had gone out like Summer Glau is supposed to go out in a role like this - in an epic fight. Its a shame that she was essentially just a very special henchwoman for Slade (and we never really got any answers about her history with Slade and why he cared for her - which really pissed me off) but at least she could have gone out on a high note in an epic battle with Nyssa and Sara. But they even denied her that.

I still hope that Rose Wilson (Slades daughter who became the 2nd Ravager in the comics) will show up and become the new Ravager, which will give Isabels legacy more of a purpose and then maybe Rose and Slade can take on the League of Assassins to avenge Isabels death. Its very unlikely that we will ever see that happen but it would be very cool and give Isabels role more meaning.

You raise a good question about Queen Consolidated. I wondered myself what happens now with the company. We do know that Oliver doesnt get it back, the EPs already confirmed that in Season 3 he will still be without his company and money. So we´ll have to wait and see what they do with the company instead.


To finish this up, I got a question for you - if so many of the plotlines and characters anger you so much are you sure Arrow is the right show for you? I mean no offense you just seem extremely angry and raging about the show and maybe in the long run you wont be very happy with this show.

[Kensei]

Thea gets so much criticism as being just the annoying little sister. But you know, an annoying little sister is a perfectly legitamite thing to be. They exist in real life all over the place. I have a friend who I call my little sister and it's not just a term of endearment as she thinks it is because she annoys the stuffing out of me. Still love her, though. That's how I see Thea.

[Slade Wilson]

On a funnier note , I just stumbled upon some truly hilarious Arrow memes that brought tears to my eyes because I had to laugh so hard lol