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  1. #481
    Incredible Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ultradav View Post
    Wasn't that era one of the highest selling periods in Superman history though? It couldn't have been that impenetrable.
    Part of One of my collections

    20210831_191305.jpg

    Compare that to a modern action comics volume

    Action Comics Vol. 1: Path Of Doom
    Collects: Justice League #52 (New 52), Action Comics Rebirth #957 to #962
    .
    .
    .
    Action Comics Vol. 2: Welcome to the Planet (Rebirth)
    Collects: Part of Justice League #52, Action Comics #963 to #966

    And whats collected in Superman Vol 1 and 2 is totally seperate story. Much simpler to collect. As monthly's or as a trade.
    Last edited by Menacer; 08-31-2021 at 07:43 PM.

  2. #482
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperX View Post
    That was the golden years for superman, we had a never ending ongoing story where superman was front and center alwasy, plus his whole family had comics of their own. Nobody who actually lived thru that time and actually bought SUPER comics at thst time would ever consider it a confusing failure.

    Superman fans now would LOVE thst much coming out.
    Yeah, the triangle era is very warmly regarded in most Superman fan circles. They put numbered triangles on the covers to make it easier to follow. It wasn't as complicated as you think you follow, no more than just reading the books you buy the week you buy them is.


    As someone who went back and read that stuff that I missed, it wasn't hard to follow then and even easier now that we have the internet. I also have it collected and it's fine that way.

    If the argument is that one narrative with one team is cleaner, sure, but that's not what they wanted to do. There are benefits and shortcomings to each approach and the round robin continuing narrative has lots of merits-- the weekly series 52 is proof of that.

    I refuse to hear someone tell me one collection of a trade is easier to collect than another if they're both in print. There's no difference. All the work is done for you at point of purchase.

    As for collectors? As one, I ask "who cares?" These are stories first, and so long as the narrative at the time is compelling, what I have to do to store them is secondary. Are we really pretending us nerds don't get off on reorganizing and cataloging our collections? I do, even if it takes forever because I keep cracking books open and reading them again.

    I admit the current Black Label books being huge drives me nuts because it's hard to find a place for them, but if the story rules, I don't much care.
    Last edited by Robanker; 08-31-2021 at 08:16 PM.
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  3. #483
    Fantastic Member ultradav's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    Part of One of my collections

    20210831_191305.jpg

    Compare that to a modern action comics volume

    Action Comics Vol. 1: Path Of Doom
    Collects: Justice League #52 (New 52), Action Comics Rebirth #957 to #962
    .
    .
    .
    Action Comics Vol. 2: Welcome to the Planet (Rebirth)
    Collects: Part of Justice League #52, Action Comics #963 to #966

    And whats collected in Superman Vol 1 and 2 is totally seperate story. Much simpler to collect. As monthly's or as a trade.
    Now it's hard sure, but back then it was pretty easy and the sales reflect that. In some ways it was easier because the story continued every week, versus having to wait a month.

  4. #484
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    I take recommendations. I read about 100 trades per year.

    What would you suggest I check out?
    Doom patrol - Morriston
    Shade - milligan
    The filth- Morriston
    Invisibles- Morriston
    Swampthing- Moore
    Ms Tree - Collins
    Northlanders- Wood
    Hitman - Ennis
    Preacher- ennis
    Extremist - milligan
    Enigma - milligan


    Those are a few books that are nothing at all like DC publish today. I'm sure people can think of many more.

  5. #485
    Incredible Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iron chimp View Post
    Doom patrol - Morriston
    Shade - milligan
    The filth- Morriston
    Invisibles- Morriston
    Swampthing- Moore
    Ms Tree - Collins
    Northlanders- Wood
    Hitman - Ennis
    Preacher- ennis
    Extremist - milligan
    Enigma - milligan


    Those are a few books that are nothing at all like DC publish today. I'm sure people can think of many more.
    Ill add them to my list.

    But basically none of these are a traditional dc superhero book. Which is more what I was talking about.

  6. #486
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    Ill add them to my list.

    But basically none of these are a traditional dc superhero book. Which is more what I was talking about.
    Well no they wont be doing anything different now as opposed to be previously if you define DC's output as only being "traditional books". That was the point of what they did for a period of time - they pushed the envelope as to what a superhero book could be and provoked and challenged readers while at the same time they published a lot of quality work outside that genre.

  7. #487
    Incredible Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iron chimp View Post
    Well no they wont be doing anything different now as opposed to be previously if you define DC's output as only being "traditional books". That was the point of what they did for a period of time - they pushed the envelope as to what a superhero book could be and provoked and challenged readers while at the same time they published a lot of quality work outside that genre.
    I hear what your saying. Ill slowly add these to the rotation.

    I am always leary of anyone claiming "back in my day" sort of stuff...

    I dont doubt the books are good i ultimately feel each decade produces fantastic art in music, comics, film, tv, etc etc and its a bit of a misnomer to claim x period just did it so much better then the present.

    In my experience nostalgia is huge factor in people making these types of claims. Since i do journey back all the time

  8. #488
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    Ill add them to my list.

    But basically none of these are a traditional dc superhero book. Which is more what I was talking about.
    The Doom Patrol is a superhero team.

    There's also Morrison's Animal Man, which plays with out-there concepts, but is still a "traditional" superhero book.

    There's also the Giffen/DeMatteis Justice League, which is very much a traditional superhero team. John Byrne Superman. George Perez Wonder Woman. Wolfman/Perez New Teen Titans. Giffen/Levitz Legion of Superheroes. Pick your poison.

  9. #489
    Incredible Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Goblin of Sector 2814 View Post
    The Doom Patrol is a superhero team.

    There's also Morrison's Animal Man, which plays with out-there concepts, but is still a "traditional" superhero book.

    There's also the Giffen/DeMatteis Justice League, which is very much a traditional superhero team. John Byrne Superman. George Perez Wonder Woman. Wolfman/Perez New Teen Titans. Giffen/Levitz Legion of Superheroes. Pick your poison.
    Ive read volumes of Wolfman Teen Titans. Like its fine and all. I enjoyed it. But was also instantly forgotten and heavily of its period. So dated from my perspective.

    I also own Animal Man. Morrison is certainly a favorite of mine. Though while this book had that weird quality Grant has... for me it was a good read. But again, like I've read modern works that have done more for me, and certainly read better from Grant.

    I'll add the rest to my rotation.

    Again some great stories. But I feel like I've read plenty from all decades that I feel are spectacular. Including modern stuff.

    Fun to dig in the past though

  10. #490
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    Ive read volumes of Wolfman Teen Titans. Like its fine and all. I enjoyed it. But was also instantly forgotten and heavily of its period. So dated from my perspective.
    Uh, not really. It's still heavily cited as one of the best runs on a DC title of all time and the stories have been adapted and re-adapted numerous times. We literally just had a Judas Contract animated adaptation a few years ago.

    Again some great stories. But I feel like I've read plenty from all decades that I feel are spectacular. Including modern stuff.

    Fun to dig in the past though
    Again, nobody is saying the 80s and 90s were the highest points in DC's publication history. What they are saying is you shouldn't declare the modern era as the "best" simply because it's more modern.

  11. #491
    Incredible Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Goblin of Sector 2814 View Post
    Uh, not really. It's still heavily cited as one of the best runs on a DC title of all time and the stories have been adapted and re-adapted numerous times. We literally just had a Judas Contract animated adaptation a few years ago.



    Again, nobody is saying the 80s and 90s were the highest points in DC's publication history. What they are saying is you shouldn't declare the modern era as the "best" simply because it's more modern.
    Didnt mean forgotten by the world. I meant it was forgettable for me. Tho judas contract is on my shelf and waiting to be read.

    Each decade has great books

    But as far sheer volume of good material. Thats now

    Never has there been more good movies, more good tv, more options, more stuidos creating stuff, more books being written, more amazing comic artists, writers.

    Ultimately it's my opinion but while the 40s, 50s or 60s etc may have had classic movies, songs, bands, tv shows etc for sheer volume of entertainment today wins. There are endless quality programs.

    And I feel the same about comics. Sure I was born and the 80s so 80s and 90s tv, movies and comics have a special place, particularly the stuff that has risen to the top.

    But im a now kinda person, i dont wanna end up being a 40, or 50 or 60 year old who cant stop talking.about the golden years of entertainment or comics as something that happened 50 years ago.

    I try to read everything new and old with the child like excitement.

    And so I tend to enjoy most of what I experience.

    For me I dont wanna be trapped in some old decade. I wanna naturally be relevant and current. WHILE STILL APPRECIATING PAST GREAT MATERIALS.

    When I'm in the comic shop now. Opposed to when I was a kid. Its really apparent to me that there are so so so so many more creators. Just on the basis of volume alone I feel modern streaming or books or comics, just has more good stuff.

    OF Course I know plenty will disagree with this. But I enjoy the new and the old. BUT I'm really excited for more new stuff!

  12. #492
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    Nobody is saying you should be anything you're not. But that's a cliché. Most people who extoll past runs aren't people who just don't like anything that's coming out now. The fact is just that, yes, there are some really great classic runs out there that should be read, especially if one wants a good understanding of a certain character.

    If you're a Batman fan, you should read stories like Year One, Killing Joke, Long Halloween, Dark Victory, DKR, Venom, Knightfall/Knightquest, etc. because those stories inform so much of Batman's lore that they essentially create a foundation for the character.

    And I'm sure fans in the 80s thought that they were living in the "golden age of comics entertainment" between Wolfman/Perez NTT, Levitz/Giffen Legion, Giffen/DeMatteis JLI, Frank Miller's Daredevil, Alan Moore's Watchmen and Swamp Thing, Morrison's Doom Patrol and Animal Man, Claremont/Byrne X-Men, Byrne's Fantastic Four and Superman, Perez's Wonder Woman, Gruenwald's Captain America, Walt Simonson's Thor, etc. etc. etc. all being on the shelves at that time.

    They probably thought that they had surpassed every other era before them and that comics were at their peak. After all, comics did sell SIGNIFICANTLY more in the 1980s than they do currently.

    Every decade in comics has great things to offer and fans in every decade think that THEY are living in the best time to be a fan.
    Last edited by Green Goblin of Sector 2814; 09-01-2021 at 09:10 PM.

  13. #493
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    I hear what your saying. Ill slowly add these to the rotation.

    I am always leary of anyone claiming "back in my day" sort of stuff...

    I dont doubt the books are good i ultimately feel each decade produces fantastic art in music, comics, film, tv, etc etc and its a bit of a misnomer to claim x period just did it so much better then the present.

    In my experience nostalgia is huge factor in people making these types of claims. Since i do journey back all the time
    Yes I wouldn't say better - people will decide for themselves what is enjoyable for them. I would say some of the past output was very different though.

  14. #494
    Incredible Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iron chimp View Post
    Yes I wouldn't say better - people will decide for themselves what is enjoyable for them. I would say some of the past output was very different though.
    And you could be right. That decade may have and likely did produce stuff totally unique to that time and have its own voice.

    But serious question. My comic shop has not just marvel and dc but sub publishers and mountains of semi independent.... do you sample all the vast new stuff?

  15. #495
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    And you could be right. That decade may have and likely did produce stuff totally unique to that time and have its own voice.

    But serious question. My comic shop has not just marvel and dc but sub publishers and mountains of semi independent.... do you sample all the vast new stuff?
    I do indeed. But again the new independent stuff is very different from the older independent stuff - in general the shelves are a lot tamer and more safe than in 80s and early 90s.

    Lot of genres gone from the monthly shelves, lot of art styles gone, lot of content gone too.

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