At this point, "New 52" isn't that bad at all.

[Bruce Wayne]

So where's the Watchmen or Sandman or Nu52? Nu52 was a creative black hole. It had maybe 10 tolerable titles with the other 80% being mediocre trash.

Those books were written by multiple authors.

That's the editor's job to keep them on the same page. The fact Idelson continually failed at his job just demonstrates how mismanaged everything was bts. The excuses just further shows how bts everything was a complete mess due to Didio forcing anyone that was competent and who disagreed with him out of editorial

[skyvolt2000]

So where's the Watchmen or Sandman or Nu52? Nu52 was a creative black hole. It had maybe 10 tolerable titles with the other 80% being mediocre trash.

Cases can be made for some of those books. Not all but some of them.
Also it was some of the editors who chased more folks off book than Dan, Johns or Lee.

Those three did not put Gail Simone and Ethan Van Sciever on a book both did NOT want to do-Firestorm.
Those three did not chase John Roszum off Static Shock nor insulted MARC BERNARDIN to the point he left comics.

While it is on those three to set the tone of what was cannon and what was a legit starting point-they could not be held accountable for what individual editors did. Unless they told them to do that.

Wally, JSA, killing John Stewart and excluding former Batgirls-okay.
What was done to Static, Jaime and others-no.

[HsssH]

So where's the Watchmen or Sandman or Nu52? Nu52 was a creative black hole. It had maybe 10 tolerable titles with the other 80% being mediocre trash.

I hope you are aware that Watchmen and Sandman (asides of first few issues) were not part of DC universe.

[wonder39]

Why dont people know earth 52 is a thing?

Attachment 113046

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Attachment 113047

Thank you!

[Agent Z]

I hope you are aware that Watchmen and Sandman (asides of first few issues) were not part of DC universe.

They are talking about books produced during the New 52 era not which ones were in continuity.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

The problem is the "decent" stories were buried under a mountain of horrible stories and mismanaged titles. Nostalgia for New 52 has a certain selection bias here where the terrible stuff is overlooked and what is considered decent or good is exaggerated to the point of claiming that it represents the whole selection of New 52. For every Batman or Action Comics, there was a Savage Hawkman/Grifter/Deathstroke/Hawk and Dove/Superman/Ravagers/Firestorm/Justice League International/Birds of Prey/Detective Comics/Blackhawks/Stormwatch.

Quoted for truth

[ERON]

I hope you are aware that Watchmen and Sandman (asides of first few issues) were not part of DC universe.

I believe they mean books published during the New 52 that were on Watchmen or Sandman's level of acclaim, not those titles specifically.

[HsssH]

It doesn't really make sense to compare things like that. What DC is doing in-continuity does not have a direct relationship with what DC is doing out-of-continuity.

But if we really want to go that way lets throw out couple of examples: Dial H for Hero, Multiversity.

[iron chimp]

It doesn't really make sense to compare things like that. What DC is doing in-continuity does not have a direct relationship with what DC is doing out-of-continuity.

But if we really want to go that way lets throw out couple of examples: Dial H for Hero, Multiversity.

Dial h bring a Karen berger book

And Morrison being a Karen berger recruit.

Dial h was a nice book but its not going to be remembered as a classic because it was rushed to completion before cancellation and it has some brutally rough art in one issue (Number 8 maybe?)

[ducklord]

The poster who noted that, at any given moment, most of the comics being produced by DC are varying degrees of "meh" or "crap" (depending upon your tastes) isn't wrong. Most of everything kind of sucks.

I think a more salient question with regards to the New 52 is, how much of the good stuff that came out of it genuinely required a line-wide reboot (ie chucking everything that came before) to facilitate it?

Multiversity? It ignored Earth-0 entirely, so that's a no.
Dial H? Doesn't seem like it.

Basically, was this reboot necessary to get to the good stuff?

[InfamousBG]

The poster who noted that, at any given moment, most of the comics being produced by DC are varying degrees of "meh" or "crap" (depending upon your tastes) isn't wrong. Most of everything kind of sucks.

I disagree with that. I love many of the comics being produced by DC right now. I am just praying they don't pull another big "crisis" on us and ruin it all over again.

[Coco Loco]

The poster who noted that, at any given moment, most of the comics being produced by DC are varying degrees of "meh" or "crap" (depending upon your tastes) isn't wrong. Most of everything kind of sucks.

I think a more salient question with regards to the New 52 is, how much of the good stuff that came out of it genuinely required a line-wide reboot (ie chucking everything that came before) to facilitate it?

Multiversity? It ignored Earth-0 entirely,i so that's a no.
Dial H? Doesn't seem like it.

Basically, was this reboot necessary to get to the good stuff?

I’ve always found that line of thinking problematic. It reduces every comic published post-reboot to a referendum on the reboot. One wouldn’t suggest, I don’t think, that the salient question about comics published post-COIE was whether they could only have been published in the new continuity. (Many could not have, but many fit in either continuity.). New 52 was a marketing plan - it’s justified by whether it sold comics and drew attention to DC’s output. The comics published during the New 52 era, which of course is now over and thus finite, can surely be judged on their own merits or lack thereof.

[Coco Loco]

It doesn't really make sense to compare things like that. What DC is doing in-continuity does not have a direct relationship with what DC is doing out-of-continuity.

But if we really want to go that way lets throw out couple of examples: Dial H for Hero, Multiversity.

Sweet Tooth, Sheriff of Babylon, Injustice - all published during that time. None of them had anything to do with the New 52, of course, but neither did Watchmen have any bearing on the DC continuity of that time.

[ducklord]

I’ve always found that line of thinking problematic. It reduces every comic published post-reboot to a referendum on the reboot. One wouldn’t suggest, I don’t think, that the salient question about comics published post-COIE was whether they could only have been published in the new continuity. (Many could not have, but many fit in either continuity.). New 52 was a marketing plan - it’s justified by whether it sold comics and drew attention to DC’s output. The comics published during the New 52 era, which of course is now over and thus finite, can surely be judged on their own merits or lack thereof.

I think it's an interesting, if not necessarily the best, question to ask.

In the case of COIE, since it was a very soft reboot, the question was mostly moot, since, as you noted, most of the continuity wasn't chucked into the bin.

For the New 52, however, it was an explicit 90% hard reboot. So I think it's worth asking if a) if the good stuff required the reboot, and b) if the good stuff was worth the reboot?

I mean, when you get right down to it, how much of the New 52 output in general needed a line-wide reboot to tell those stories?

[ducklord]

I disagree with that. I love many of the comics being produced by DC right now. I am just praying they don't pull another big "crisis" on us and ruin it all over again.

I realize I'm being overly mean (I myself loved just about everything DC was putting out in the mid 80's at one point), but it's okay to admit that, even in times that we love what a company is putting out, there's probably a lot of it that's actually rather mediocre.