At this point, "New 52" isn't that bad at all.

[krazijoe]

Once the Pandora mini hits New 52 will be over.

[blunt_eastwood]

But again, if the New 52 was that "altered timeline," the fact that it has been altered back means that the New 52 is over, not that we're in a continuation of it. That altered state has come to an end. And by the looks of things, there are actually not many elements from the New 52 that have been carried over.

If you'd like to put a concrete ending on it, then it'd likely be Doomsday Clock

Okay, but that unaltered timeline is still different than the Pre-Flashpoint one correct?

[Restingvoice]

Okay, but that unaltered timeline is still different than the Pre-Flashpoint one correct?

Yes because now it's as if characters like Jon Kent and Duke Thomas existed during Post Crisis events

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

Okay, but that unaltered timeline is still different than the Pre-Flashpoint one correct?

Yes, because there was still several years' worth of comics that introduced new characters and concepts into the DCU. However, the current timeline is still a lot more like the Pre-Flashpoint timeline than the New 52 timeline. So, we can't in all good faith call it "New 52 plus" because if anything, the New 52 elements would probably be the "plus" not the main part.

[HsssH]

I think that New 52 plus is easier to explain even if it is less accurate.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

I think that New 52 plus is easier to explain even if it is less accurate.

It's not just less accurate, it's inaccurate. If anything, we're in a "Pre-Flashpoint plus" state of continuity, since most writers are now acting as if Flashpoint never happened and the DCU in 2011 just kept going along.

[witchboy]

It's not just less accurate, it's inaccurate. If anything, we're in a "Pre-Flashpoint plus" state of continuity, since most writers are now acting as if Flashpoint never happened and the DCU in 2011 just kept going along.

Here's a way of looking at it.
If someone wanted a run of comics recommended for the origins of the modern day Superman, which would make more sense to suggest, John Byrne's run or Grant Morrisons? You can of course repeat that exercise with most of the big characters and I think it'll work out that the post Crisis comics are more relevant to where we are now than the early New 52.

[ducklord]

Once the Pandora mini hits New 52 will be over.

Now that's just mean.

In hindsight, the symbolism of using a character named "Pandora" to usher in the New 52 turned out to be a little on-the-nose.

[Vordan]

Here's a way of looking at it.
If someone wanted a run of comics recommended for the origins of the modern day Superman, which would make more sense to suggest, John Byrne's run or Grant Morrisons? You can of course repeat that exercise with most of the big characters and I think it'll work out that the post Crisis comics are more relevant to where we are now than the early New 52.

Maybe a bad example considering Morrison’s concepts have been getting a lot of attention lately (as they just recently wrote a mini that helped set up PKJ Action), while Byrne’s run contains a lot of concepts that are explicitly non-canon (Krypton, the birthing matrix, etc).

[witchboy]

Maybe a bad example considering Morrison’s concepts have been getting a lot of attention lately (as they just recently wrote a mini that helped set up PKJ Action), while Byrne’s run contains a lot of concepts that are explicitly non-canon (Krypton, the birthing matrix, etc).

Ideas yes, but which version of the character feels closest to what would be the background of Clark today? It's not the man who dated Wonder Woman and flew around in a t-shirt. Allowing for all the many tweaks to continuity from Crises, I feel like Byrne's Superman is more or less the past of the current Superman.

[Saithor]

So I read this thread...up to about page 25 before I stopped because it was mostly the same five people yelling at each other while Greta cackled in the background in between what I assume were hits of Cocaine. So, I'm about 25, been reading DC comics for about ten years. Lots of different continuities. I generally enjoy most of what I read but I'd be lying if I said the majority of the New 52 was something I enjoyed when my readings finally caught up with it. It caught several books I enjoyed and canceled them, eliminated several characters I enjoyed, while leaving some stuff completely untouched for some reason. Some it just twisted in horrible ways. Thanks for making Zatanna Constantine's girlfriend and pretty much nothing else DC! There were some good stuff, there was a lot of bad stuff, I'm not sure why people are arguing that it should be considered the primary continuity when so much of when it retconned in return got changed back before or after Didio got kicked out.

I'm also confused about this idea that complaints about the New 52 was restricted to these boards because uh...I was around the internet at that time. Not in comics sites. In casual sites. It was getting trashed. A lot. I'd say the biggest impact it had on discourse I saw was memes about Trucker hats and complaints about Clark-Dianna.

[FFJamie94]

As someone who wasn't reading DC at the time but can only look back in retrospective... it seems to have had a few good ideas which were bogged down by poor editorial.
It had some great runs (Snyder's Batman, Lemire's Green Arrow, Morrison's AC) but, like most comics, a lot of it seems to have been either forgotten or not looked at too fondly.

I'll say in retrospective, it was decent, but was thrown off course by having no actual plan.

On that note, I may have to pick up forever evil at some point.

[MajorHoy]

. . . On that note, I may have to pick up forever evil at some point.

Nobody has to do that.

Really.

[Serkenobi]

I've never thought that New 52 was a bad age. Ok, it wasn't perfect, it's true, but had good collections:

Green Lantern: Geoff Johns put end to his "baby" and Venditti took all that legacy, respecting it and creating good stories.

Wonder Woman: Azzarello "revived" the amazon and brought out an interesting collection. Later, in my honest (and probably controversial vision) opinion, Meredith Finch improved the work of Azzarello doing the only thing that Azarello failed: giving Diana humanity. Azzarello made efforts to giving humanity to the gods (as Hera), but forget to did the same in the character of Diana. Meredith was successful in create one of the most humans Dianas that i have ever read.

Harley Quinn: Amanda Conner and Jimmy Palmiotti took a character that only had one collection in solitary, and created a new, powerful and independent Harley Quinn who transformed in one of the most popular DC characters.

Yeah, there was some "black sheeps" (as Teen Titans), but in general, i think New 52 was a good age.

Regards!

[BohemiaDrinker]

Maybe a bad example considering Morrison’s concepts have been getting a lot of attention lately (as they just recently wrote a mini that helped set up PKJ Action), while Byrne’s run contains a lot of concepts that are explicitly non-canon (Krypton, the birthing matrix, etc).

Those concepts were non-canonical waaaaay back in post-Crisis. Birthright was at the point of release the official canon version. Then it was Loeb's. Then Johns'.

Post-Crisis had a lot of retcons, really.