At this point, "New 52" isn't that bad at all.

[Alpha]

Wonder Woman: Azzarello "revived" the amazon and brought out an interesting collection. Later, in my honest (and probably controversial vision) opinion, Meredith Finch improved the work of Azzarello doing the only thing that Azarello failed: giving Diana humanity. Azzarello made efforts to giving humanity to the gods (as Hera), but forget to did the same in the character of Diana. Meredith was successful in create one of the most humans Dianas that i have ever read.

What exactly do you mean by giving Diana humanity and in what way would you say that applies to the Finch run?

To be clear, I only read the first arc and the Dr Poison story

[Serkenobi]

What exactly do you mean by giving Diana humanity and in what way would you say that applies to the Finch run?

To be clear, I only read the first arc and the Dr Poison story

Part of my analysis is present in those arcs. Maybe you didn't appreciate in the same way, so i am going to specify with particular examples, why i consider that the Finch's Diana is more human than Azzarello's Diana (I haven't found the spoiler label to prevent this kind of information to people that want to read these arcs. If anyone explain me, i will be grateful).

Diana is a "perfect" heroine. In general (yeah, i know there are some exceptions) she doesn't hesitate, she is confident, she doesn't have any doubts or moral debates and she always achieve the correct answer or solution to any problem.

But the life is not as simple, even if you are a demigod with a lot of power. Precisely Azzarello's Hera evolution in a character more human, was because she began to question all. Was she doing the right thing, making the corrects decisions? Which were the consequences of her acts? You don't see any of this in Diana, she had a clare and well defined objective, with no doubts or hesitation, her goals were simple: investigate, find answers and fight. No more, she only must to worry about god's world, not the human's world.

Well, what happen with Meredith Finch in charge? Diana wants to create a democratic system in Themyscira, an island with thousands years of monarchy.



She wants to integrate men in the island (equality, all can live in the island).



She wants to protect also the earth and spread her message of peace at the same time that she is dealing with the charge of godness of war, role that is opposite to her principles. Complicate to manage, even with superpowers.

She is not omnipresent, she is not omnipotent, she can't be in two places at the same time. She must make choices, choices with consequences. Terrible consequences.



Part of the amazons are conservatives, aren't agree with the modern vision of Diana and don't want any changes, trying to execute a coup d'état.

https://i.imgur.com/opf78Xw.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/pVJpt6m.jpg

Because Diana is dealing with human world, she can't prevent those events and she later discover how nearly all men were killed.

https://i.imgur.com/EeKeF1h.jpg

She failed, she feels frustrated, because she wanted the best for everyone, but she can't achieve, she can't do it. In her wish of help everyone... Disregarded what was happening in her own home. She made choices and those choices had terribles consequences, so she suffers. A lot.

At last, Diana is represented how she is: human. A human that make choices, some better, some worse and must face to them, with pain and sadness. She tried her best, but wasn't enough. Cruel but real as the same life.

On top of that, the equilibrium it is breaking: the godness of peace is getting mad (trying to kill her), because the peace need the war and the war need the peace to exist both (like Yin and Yang). And Diana doesn't want to extend the war in the world.

https://i.imgur.com/Jx9wdhK.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/497O0vT.jpg

So she has three problems to deal: Themyscira, Human's world and God's world. Not as simple as in Azzarello's run, no?

The Meredith's run is the only where i remember reading a Diana having nightmares because all of this explain before:

https://i.imgur.com/LE5ty18.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/ba8anOQ.jpg

For all these reasons, i consider that Meredith's Diana is one of the most humans Wonder Woman that i have ever read. I expect i had clarified my stance.

Regards!

[Menacer]

Anyone who writes off new52 as some giant line wide fail is suspect to me.

Go thru this list. 1 to 24 have consistently shown up on must read lists.

24 of 52 titles is pretty great


Hmm dont know how to make this link work but you can probably find this list on google pretty quick
chrome_screenshot_1648273120203.jpg

Screenshot_20220325-224053_Gmail.jpg

https://chrxpthr.***********/ranking...ve-9996fe5988b


Those that claim 52 was just all awful are biased and have lost any objectivity... its fine to admit your prejudice... but its a bit immature to write off an entire era spanning like 5 years and say its all shit...

Its disrespectful to the fans of that period and its disrespectful to all the creators of that era.

Go review the list. Its hard not to see that 24 of those 52 titles are great reads.

[Alpha]

For all these reasons, i consider that Meredith's Diana is one of the most humans Wonder Woman that i have ever read. I expect i had clarified my stance.

Regards!

Okay that's fair. I suppose I haven't payed much attention to the run since.

That characterization seems pretty standard as far as Wonder Woman stories (which to me isn't a great thing since I find that most Wonder Woman writers don't make her feel like an actually enthusiastic and lovable human being). But I understand your point and it seems valid

[Restingvoice]

Those concepts were non-canonical waaaaay back in post-Crisis. Birthright was at the point of release the official canon version. Then it was Loeb's. Then Johns'.

Post-Crisis had a lot of retcons, really.

I've read birthright and secret origins but which one is Loeb?

Oh so that's why Byrne had Superman debuted at 25 but he's only about 38 in John's run

[Rod G]

Anyone who writes off new52 as some giant line wide fail is suspect to me.

Go thru this list. 1 to 24 have consistently shown up on must read lists.

24 of 52 titles is pretty great


Hmm dont know how to make this link work but you can probably find this list on google pretty quick
chrome_screenshot_1648273120203.jpg

Screenshot_20220325-224053_Gmail.jpg

https://chrxpthr.***********/ranking...ve-9996fe5988b


Those that claim 52 was just all awful are biased and have lost any objectivity... its fine to admit your prejudice... but its a bit immature to write off an entire era spanning like 5 years and say its all shit...

Its disrespectful to the fans of that period and its disrespectful to all the creators of that era.

Go review the list. Its hard not to see that 24 of those 52 titles are great reads.

I agree with you 100%.

[brandnewfan]

New 52 was actually mostly good to great, with some really bad titles.

What caused it to fail was incompetence and inconsistency. Nobody knew what stories had happened or hadn't happened. Some well liked characters had disappeared or were changed so much as to be unrecognizable (a big no-no for established characters like Wally West). And DC seemed to have a major inability to employ A+ talent across the board, making the bad titles really bad; don't get me wrong, New 52 definitely had A+ talent, but it also had F- talent. Also editors were too heavy handed on some books, leading to the title just totally sucking.

But it brought it a lot of people back to comics. It wasn't a failure.

[SuperX]

I liked it and didn't like it at the exact same time.I wish they would have kept or made it a actual part of the ongoing history we have now. Just make things work, do the mental gymnastics if you need to, but somethings shouldn't be handwaved away.

[BohemiaDrinker]

I've read birthright and secret origins but which one is Loeb?

Wasn't even a proper origin. HE just started using a silver-agey Krypton on Supes books 'cause he wanted to.

Oh so that's why Byrne had Superman debuted at 25 but he's only about 38 in John's run

Nah, that's sliding timeline; staple of superhero shared universes. Basically, time is wonky and heres age are set. Problems arise, we turn a blind eye.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

I've read birthright and secret origins but which one is Loeb?

Oh so that's why Byrne had Superman debuted at 25 but he's only about 38 in John's run

Superman For All Seasons

[Garrac]

*Reads the title of the topic*

No

[MajorHoy]

*Reads the title of the topic*

No

Hey, I'm a long-time (previous century) DC reader, and I was buying/enjoying more DC titles during the New 52 then I have been for at least the past couple of years.

[Restingvoice]

Wasn't even a proper origin. HE just started using a silver-agey Krypton on Supes books 'cause he wanted to.



Nah, that's sliding timeline; staple of superhero shared universes. Basically, time is wonky and heres age are set. Problems arise, we turn a blind eye.

Oh so there's no mention in the newer origin comics itself at what age he became Superman?

[Yohei72]

Those that claim 52 was just all awful are biased and have lost any objectivity... its fine to admit your prejudice... but its a bit immature to write off an entire era spanning like 5 years and say its all shit...

Are you suggesting comics fans tend to have extremely strong dislikes and resentments that are out of proportion to the subject at hand?

[Menacer]

Are you suggesting comics fans tend to have extremely strong dislikes and resentments that are out of proportion to the subject at hand?

Honestly this seems to be people in general. Not just comics fans.

Some how people develop their identity around things they like... and even more so things they dislike or hate...

People love to hate stuff... bit of a conundrum