The Justice Leagues - Legacy, History and Room For Improvement

[HsssH]

I don't think that its that big of a deal. Superman was blue in Rock of Ages and story didn't suffer from that at all.

[phonogram12]

Granted, although I was around for the JLI roster, I really didn't start reading a JL book until Morrison came on board. But I have to agree that it seems as if the main continuity JL is more known for it's rosters and the writer's that work on the team than any actual stories. People know the Satellite Era, the Detroit Era, the JLI, and the Big 7, Morrison, Meltzer, Snyder, Bendis, Englehart. From the past 30 years, there's the aforementioned Tower of Babel and even Identity Crisis, but neither seem as genre defining as the aforementioned Days of Future Past, Kraven's Last Hunt, or Born Again.

I think I have to agree with the consensus that the team's most memorable stories tend to be Elseworld's like Kingdom Come and The Nail.

[atomicskull]

The Justice League is still your "Grandfather's Team" They need to break out of that. This is why i gravitate more towards The Avengers and the X-Men. They aren't as holier-than-thou as the League.

[atomicskull]

I didn’t say that the JL had no notable stories. I brought attention to the JL existing for 61 years and the agreed on top 4 runs and adaptions. Satellite Era, JLI, 90s JLA Morrison/Waid/Kelley and Bruce Timm’s JL/JLU animated series.

New Frontier is an amazing story and far better origin than the Gardner Fox Silver Age origin, or Geoff Johns’ New 52. But it’s elseworlds and not in continuity.

Kingdom Come is DC’s “Civil War” (Avengers). But it is also elseworlds and not in continuity. Just like Injustuce, Earth One, Timm’s Gods and Monster’s JL, and Frank Miller’s takes on the JL are elseworlds and segregated from the main canon. Meaning they are of no consequence to the main line books and events. Thus they can be ignored.


Tough situation to have so many cool and interesting stories be relegated to AU. While the main continuity isn’t always firing on all cylinders with notable runs.

I listed the big 4 that everyone agrees are the best the League had to offer. What else would suggest belongs in the top 5?

Johns’ New 52 run
Hitch’s Rebirth run
Scott Snyder’s run
The Detroit Era
Meltzer’s run
Robinson’s run
The original Gardner Fox years
Etc

If this was listing the top Avengers runs, I could confidently get to a top 10. With the JL. I struggle to get to a top 5.

I feel like people on here are PURPOSELY missing your point. It's very telling when folks I talk to can't name at least five iconic Justice League storylines. Can't name any Justice League villains. So many X-Men and Avengers stories come to mind. For a team that's considered "the greatest" they sure lack A LOT of things.

[Johnny Thunders!]

I think the Avengers do have a ton of great runs as do the X-Men, but "Days of Future Past" keeps getting mentioned and really that's just a two issue event. There are quite a few great two issue stories from the 60s through the 80s. I would check out every JSA team up from the 60s through the 80s to name a few including the Darkseid event where George Perez stepped in after Dick Dillin passed.

[BatmanJones]

I feel like people on here are PURPOSELY missing your point. It's very telling when folks I talk to can't name at least five iconic Justice League storylines. Can't name any Justice League villains. So many X-Men and Avengers stories come to mind. For a team that's considered "the greatest" they sure lack A LOT of things.

I’m not missing their point and I’m certainly not “purposely” missing it. I just disagree with it. Is that okay? Can people disagree without being assigned some sort of malicious intent?

[atomicskull]

I’m not missing their point and I’m certainly not “purposely” missing it. I just disagree with it. Is that okay? Can people disagree without being assigned some sort of malicious intent?

I apologize for offending you.

[atomicskull]

I think the Avengers do have a ton of great runs as do the X-Men, but "Days of Future Past" keeps getting mentioned and really that's just a two issue event. There are quite a few great two issue stories from the 60s through the 80s. I would check out every JSA team up from the 60s through the 80s to name a few including the Darkseid event where George Perez stepped in after Dick Dillin passed.

But that "two issue event" has stood the test of time. I can't really say the same for any Justice League stories. Does anyone truly care about The Nail, Rock of Ages or Throne of Atlantis? Hell Tower of Babel felt more like a Batman story than anything.

[Johnny Thunders!]

I have reread Days of Future Past and all the Claremont/ Byrne Cockrum X Men recently but I’ve also reread Morrison’s JLA and Morrison’s JLA holds up just as well so I care. And the Morrison stuff as a whole was more rereadible. I think New Frontier, Kingdom Come, and even Final Crisis still hold up.

Edit:
I am rereading Bronze Age JLA and some of the villain designs do lack something. Look up the Society of Supervillains issues, there is plenty of Bronze Age goofiness but I am enjoying them more or as much as lots of same era X Men and Avengers. Of course I am old.

[Doctor Know]

I feel like people on here are PURPOSELY missing your point. It's very telling when folks I talk to can't name at least five iconic Justice League storylines. Can't name any Justice League villains. So many X-Men and Avengers stories come to mind. For a team that's considered "the greatest" they sure lack A LOT of things.

It feels like that. I keep asking for that fifth great JL run, and no one has provided me an answer. At this point, I think I'm just going to have to list Johns' JSA run from 1999-2008 as the 5th place. The JSA has been a companion and frequent ally of the League since the Silver Age. Plus, I feel Johns run on JSA has largely been forgotten nowadays. It deserves exposure and praise. It's not what I want, but it's the best I've got.

But that "two issue event" has stood the test of time. I can't really say the same for any Justice League stories. Does anyone truly care about The Nail, Rock of Ages or Throne of Atlantis? Hell Tower of Babel felt more like a Batman story than anything.

Honestly, I think the naming of the arcs and the prompting of them by DC could go a long way to increasing the JLs profile in the general public.

At this point, the JL stories that have the most exposure are:

JLA Tower of Babel, which more people know as JL Doom. From the animated adaptation. No issues there.

Flashpoint. Because of the CW show, DCAU movie and upcoming DCEU movie.

Injustice: The popular games series, that gets referenced throughout pop culture, and on all CW shows. Not to mention an upcoming animated movie.

Throne of Atlantis. A story that has been adapted 3 different times since it debuted in 2013. DCAU movie of the same name, the plot of Aquaman solo DCEU, and it was shoved into the new DCAU JSA WW2movie. For no reason and it's really out of place.


Of the other notable JL stories I think have a shot of going big.

If Z. Snyder gets his JL 2. JLA Rock of Ages and Justice League of America "Apokolips Now! (#183-185)" are the source material he's inspired by from what we saw in BvS and JL.


The New Frontier, as I've said repeatedly in this thread. Is the best origin for the JL and does a solid for Martian Manhunter and Hal Jordan. The fact that it's a period piece adds more to it's charm. DC should promote it more and get it's name out there.


Kingdom Come - This should be DC's "Days of Future Past". Both JSA "Thy Kingdom Come" and Justice League Generation Lost (with the JLI) alluded that Kingdom Come (Earth 22) would become their future if things in the present didn't change. Easy enough to folded into the potential futures of the existing JL. With the multiple LOSHs, variants of Batman Beyond's reality and time travel shenanigan's in general.


No Man Escapes The Manhunter and the parts of Millennium that have noting to do with the New Guardians. The JL animated series did a good adaptation of this story. The series changed it to X'anshi. The planet John failed to save in Cosmic Odyssey. GL in and the League in a cosmic court and needing his innocence proved by his friends. A la Trial of Jean Grey by the Shi'Ar and the Trial of Reed Richards after he saved Galactus' life. Would be a nice change of pace. Before all the robot smash starts.



There are other hitters in the JL's annuals, but the best the could do is get more exposure. So people know they exist.
JLA New World Order - JL animated series Secret Origins

JLA Earth 2/Crisis on Two Earths/Forever Evil with the Crime Syndicate. Honestly, with all the evil variants of the real JL. I can't see people caring about an actual evil version beyond the novelty of them being differnt people. People do like CSA stories though.

JLA Obsidian Age - This kind of story would be a lot better with the JL Dark. Keep the time travel mechanics and expand the roster of the ancient world to include the Amazons (Diana/Hippolyta), Khandaq (Black Adam), Egypt (Doctor Fate, the Hawks and Blue Beetle Scarab). All of which existed in the age of antiquity. Showing how Atlantis was sunk during a full scale war between tribes, with a League there as participants would be cool.

52's WWIII. Not to be confused with JLA's WWIII. An Arabic nation and a one "super" man army (Black Adam) against the world. After scientists in the US orchestrate to have his family killed. Black Adam is the closest thing DC has to Dr. Doom, who is the sovereign of his own country. Plus the ending Fate, Shazam (Billy) and Zatanna use to stop Adam is phenominal.


There are others I think have a shot of making it to a wider audience, but I'll have to type them up later.

@Everyon: Feel free to add your stories you think should be known to the general audience and casual fan.

[TheBatman]

I feel like people on here are PURPOSELY missing your point. It's very telling when folks I talk to can't name at least five iconic Justice League storylines. Can't name any Justice League villains. So many X-Men and Avengers stories come to mind. For a team that's considered "the greatest" they sure lack A LOT of things.

People aren't missing the point...the point is something that can easily be disagreed with.

JL may have a legacy problem in YOUR eyes...but there are people who don't share that view. Rightly so.

Some of you guys try to act as if teams like The Avengers have it so much better. They really don't, in my opinion.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

I don't think that its that big of a deal. Superman was blue in Rock of Ages and story didn't suffer from that at all.

Most writers aren't Morrison

[Agent Z]

But that "two issue event" has stood the test of time. I can't really say the same for any Justice League stories. Does anyone truly care about The Nail, Rock of Ages or Throne of Atlantis? Hell Tower of Babel felt more like a Batman story than anything.

Yes. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean other people don't.

I also fail to see how Tower of Babel is more like a Batman story when the entire League is focused on heavily.

[atomicskull]

Yes. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean other people don't.

I also fail to see how Tower of Babel is more like a Batman story when the entire League is focused on heavily.

Confused about where all the sensitivity is coming from. I never said I didn't like these stories. I just don't think they hold up against the superior X-Men and Avengers stories. There's a reason why those stories get talked about even in 2021.

Folks are really taking all of this to heart. Let me bow out of this thread. Thank you for expressing what has been on my mind for years, Doctor Know.

[TheBatman]

@Everyon: Feel free to add your stories you think should be known to the general audience and casual fan.

Question 1: What X-Men or Avengers stories are actually known to the general audience, most of whom probably never picked up a comic book at this point, or most casual fans?

Question 2: You said you could easily name 10 top Avengers runs. What are they, and are they runs that casual fans and the general audience would know?

Confused about where all the sensitivity is coming from. I never said I didn't like these stories. I just don't think they hold up against the superior X-Men and Avengers stories. There's a reason why those stories get talked about even in 2021.

Folks are really taking all of this to heart. Let me bow out of this thread. Thank you for expressing what has been on my mind for years, Doctor Know.

People aren't being sensitive. They are disagreeing with you. This is the second time you've made this type of post in this thread. It seems you can't help but make some type of jab at people who disagree with you, so maybe it's for the best that you bow out.