How would changing the sex or race, or both, of an X-character change *them*?

[Gray Lensman]

Eye colors are weird... But it's more support for Laura having Sarah's DNA. AFAIK, mtDNA won't cut it.

Yeah. For another case, no one knows how anyone gets hazel colored eyes, they aren't part of the basic eye color gene set, but are a weird combination of genes elsewhere on the sequence that haven't all been identified yet. The primary gene only provides for brown, blue, and more recently (in an evolutionary sense) green- which is actually a mutation of the blue eyed gene.

Yes, X-Men fans, if you have green eyes, then you are a mutant.

[From The Shadows]

If he’d been born without the blue, I suspect he would be caucasion, but his parents ethnicity is basically just ’fantasy’. And his upbringing is Roma.
But he doesn’t get white privildge.

When he was created, Len, Chris and Dave were also aware that just being German was also problematic (like Peter being Russian) as ‘75 is much closer to the end of WWII than we are now.

Attachment 113515

Actually, there is a theory that Raven may be Native American due to her name being Raven.

[From The Shadows]

Kurt Really si a withe man.

Mystique has already seen herself as she is with her powers nullified, and she is a white and red-haired woman

Actually, I think thats up for debate and why she shapeshifted as a white guy with black hair like Mr. Raven and a white woman with black hair as simply Raven, the red hair was her mutation. I am pretty sure that used to ber the case. There have been retcons or writers that don't know their mutant histrory.

[Psyknight]

You wouldn't have to change her race for Storm to be latinx tho

Gina Torres for Storm!

[Sylarmax]

Actually, there is a theory that Raven may be Native American due to her name being Raven.

Raven is white with red hair and blue eyes (or green the latter I must review, but she has light eyes) she has already seen mystique at least 3 times with her powers canceled.
and she has these characteristics, so that theory is completely discarded, because the true ethnicity of Mystique has been known for a long time.

[Sylarmax]

Actually, I think thats up for debate and why she shapeshifted as a white guy with black hair like Mr. Raven and a white woman with black hair as simply Raven, the red hair was her mutation. I am pretty sure that used to ber the case. There have been retcons or writers that don't know their mutant histrory.

No not really, and I'm sticking to 616, canon, not movies or anything like that.
In the Earth 616 comics, Mystique has been seen with her powers overridden.
And she does not have black hair, she has red hair, light eyes and white skin, so the red of her hair is not because of her powers, she is a natural redhead.


As I said there are 3 stories where this has been shown, and it is canon. Mystique is a white woman with light eyes and red hair, she is not a Native American, she is Caucasian.


It bothers me to look for the material, but you can easily find it, in the story that the High Evolutionary annulled the power and gene x of all mutants, we saw for the first time the true appearance of Mystique.


And that is not in discussion, it is canon and it has already been shown several times.

[Sylarmax]

In fact, I changed my mind because I have those comcis on hand.
LOL


Mystique there is no room for doubt for theories, because her ethnicity was already revealed in canon, and they have shown her several times with her powers totally canceled from her, she is Caucasian and a natural redhead.

[kevinism]

So I guess I’m not fully sure what youre meaning. So let me elaborate a bit if maybe I said something wrong. Redhead is a phenotype that is most commonly associated within the populations of Ireland and some of the UK. A redhead is not the same as a ginger, which is what I assume you are talking about with “genetic defect” the ones who are associated with “lack of soul”. While they do seem similar they are not the same thing. But most redheads originate from a specific geographical location. Gingers I think can come about from different means but I’m not totally sure

I hope that makes that a bit more clear. I called the woman in the picture BIPOC which means biracial person of color. At no point did I reference a one drop rule. She is a part of more than one culture. Anyway hope they clears up my meaning

That is 100% not what BIPOC means.

[From The Shadows]

No not really, and I'm sticking to 616, canon, not movies or anything like that.
In the Earth 616 comics, Mystique has been seen with her powers overridden.
And she does not have black hair, she has red hair, light eyes and white skin, so the red of her hair is not because of her powers, she is a natural redhead.


As I said there are 3 stories where this has been shown, and it is canon. Mystique is a white woman with light eyes and red hair, she is not a Native American, she is Caucasian.


It bothers me to look for the material, but you can easily find it, in the story that the High Evolutionary annulled the power and gene x of all mutants, we saw for the first time the true appearance of Mystique.


And that is not in discussion, it is canon and it has already been shown several times.

I said it was a theory about the NA ancestry. I guess i should specify again. Canon? Only to you. I just told you what happened. All my years of reading comics Raven as a normal human was nothing but a dark haired woman in both male AND female form for years. NO matter what writer did what later. The red hair stuff came later. Most likely a retcon and since people rewrote characters tons I am picking and chosing and I choose the dark hair version. I even remember what you were talking about and I found it dumb. I am pretty sure you can find an old one with her hair described as black when she was a child. No biggie.

The Singer Films actually got this part right when Mystique lost her mutant gene and was left by Erik.

[Sylarmax]

I said it was a theory about the NA ancestry. I guess i should specify again. Canon? Only to you. I just told you what happened. All my years of reading comics Raven as a normal human was nothing but a dark haired woman in both male AND female form for years. NO matter what writer did what later. The red hair stuff came later. Most likely a retcon and since people rewrote characters tons I am picking and chosing and I choose the dark hair version. I even remember what you were talking about and I found it dumb. I am pretty sure you can find an old one with her hair described as black when she was a child. No biggie.

The Singer Films actually got this part right when Mystique lost her mutant gene and was left by Erik.

]

And I just said that that theory is completely out of the question, and no surprise long before the terrible Fox movies, in canon SHe is redhead


Before that Mystique had never been seen with her powers nullified, the first time we saw her with her powers completely nullified we saw her like this white and red-haired, and all the times that she has lost her powers we have seen her like this in the same way, redhead, NEVER with black hair.


And I don't think Fox's version proves your point.
from mystique native america .... when Rebeca Romin is OBVIOUSLY white, and if you say it because of her black hair?
WTF are there no Caucasians with black hair?
, because more than half of Spain and Italy can tell you otherwise lol.
in fact the Lebanese and some other Arab countries more than 80% have super black hair and dark eyes, and surprise they are white Caucasian.


Not all Caucasians should be light-eyed blondes, I just want to make that point clear.


Mystique in canon is:

[Sylarmax]

The black hair Mystique thing That is false (much less that she was a man lol), Mystique can transform into the physical appearance she wants, and the gender she wants ... we should not be arguing that obvious point, but it is definitely a woman, and a white and red-haired woman that is the only canon, it is not that it was modified, and it is not my problem if you like her to be redhead or not, the canon is the canon and period AND SO IT IS, she had never seen each other really with her powers canceled NEVER, the first time it happened she saw that she really is a redhead, it is not that that changed, it is that it was the first time her true human form was seen, whether you like it or not.


By the way I'm a Mystique fan so I know exactly what I'm talking about.

[From The Shadows]

And I just said that that theory is completely out of the question, and no surprise long before the terrible Fox movies, in canon SHe is redhead


Before that Mystique had never been seen with her powers nullified, the first time we saw her with her powers completely nullified we saw her like this white and red-haired, and all the times that she has lost her powers we have seen her like this in the same way, redhead, NEVER with black hair.


And I don't think Fox's version proves your point.
from mystique native america .... when Rebeca Romin is OBVIOUSLY white, and if you say it because of her black hair?
WTF are there no Caucasians with black hair?
, because more than half of Spain and Italy can tell you otherwise lol.
in fact the Lebanese and some other Arab countries more than 80% have super black hair and dark eyes, and surprise they are white Caucasian.


Not all Caucasians should be light-eyed blondes, I just want to make that point clear.


Mystique in canon is:

I dont even like the terrible FOX films but i know they got this right. Fox actually listened sometimes. I said it was changed. Stop telling me otherwise. Dont you think there was CANON before those 90's images? And if I remember about the Wolverine comics of the 2000's flashing back to the late 1800s Raven specified her black hair is what she had when she was a child and the startling red hair was her mutation. I even remember what you were talking about as I said in my last post and I remembered them as wrong proably due to prior stiories. So showing me scans will do nothing because I remember those instances. The writer was wrong or the colorist. We will have to agree to disagree. Its not like comic writers never made mistakes or changed previous canon before. :-(

ETA: Yes she morphed and I explained why she chose black hair that was originally why she was called Raven.

[marhawkman]

I said it was a theory about the NA ancestry. I guess i should specify again. Canon? Only to you. I just told you what happened. All my years of reading comics Raven as a normal human was nothing but a dark haired woman in both male AND female form for years. NO matter what writer did what later. The red hair stuff came later. Most likely a retcon and since people rewrote characters tons I am picking and chosing and I choose the dark hair version. I even remember what you were talking about and I found it dumb. I am pretty sure you can find an old one with her hair described as black when she was a child. No biggie.

The Singer Films actually got this part right when Mystique lost her mutant gene and was left by Erik.

Part of what I like about this set of discussions is studying just how much stuff is the original character concept, vs how much stuff was later additions.

It's like the thing with Blink's ethnicity. It never got brought up in the first decade or so of the character's history. Literally didn't even get talked about. Then two writers do two completely different things with it. The movies cast Fan Bingbing as Blink and made Blink Asian. But a later Exiles comic book had it that her parents were black people living in the Bahamas... who left the Bahamas because of anti-mutant hatred.

[Sylarmax]

I dont even like the terrible FOX films but i know they got this right. Fox actually listened sometimes. I said it was changed. Stop telling me otherwise. Dont you think there was CANON before those 90's images? And if I remember about the Wolverine comics of the 2000's flashing back to the late 1800s Raven specified her black hair is what she had when she was a child and the startling red hair was her mutation. I even remember what you were talking about as I said in my last post and I remembered them as wrong proably due to prior stiories. So showing me scans will do nothing because I remember those instances. The writer was wrong or the colorist. We will have to agree to disagree. Its not like comic writers never made mistakes or changed previous canon before. :-(

ETA: Yes she morphed and I explained why she chose black hair that was originally why she was called Raven.

It is that you are in a mistake, she can take the appearance whatever she wants, the question is and the only truth is that when her powers have been annulled she has ALWAYS BEEN REPRESENTED AS RED HAIR, always.


It is not a question of agreeing or not, the canon is what it is, period.
not in dispute since Mystique was seen as a natural redhead.


At no time has it been hinted in the comics that she is a Native American, and I am a fan of her and have read all of her appearances of her.
But I dare you, look for some scans of Mystique 616 with her powers nullified from her and shown with black hair.


I insist bring scans that prove your point ... the canon is the canon, and it has already been seen in different books (not one) to Mystique without powers and in all of them she is a redhead.
I emphasize in different books.


Bring at least one where Mystique is deprived of her powers and "has black hair" I insist, even if that were true, which is not the case, it does not prove that she is Native American, surprise Caucasian people also have super black hair and dark eyes.


And how I said that theory was completely discarded, the canon is this, and I go back and repeat it the first time we saw Mystique without her powers we saw her already redhead, CANON NO THEORY.

[Sylarmax]

Part of what I like about this set of discussions is studying just how much stuff is the original character concept, vs how much stuff was later additions.

It's like the thing with Blink's ethnicity. It never got brought up in the first decade or so of the character's history. Literally didn't even get talked about. Then two writers do two completely different things with it. The movies cast Fan Bingbing as Blink and made Blink Asian. But a later Exiles comic book had it that her parents were black people living in the Bahamas... who left the Bahamas because of anti-mutant hatred.

And what is version 616 is?
Asian?
black?
biracial?
White ?


I think she agrees more with a white or Asian woman, if I must be honest I say because of some of her physical characteristics, although she could also be biracial.