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  1. #286
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderfan001 View Post
    Same, she is just relevant enough that her death will have some impact atm but no where near where she will be missed.She doesn't have enough fans to enrage w/ a fridging thing and if done well could be great.

    I mean they set her thing up w/ overdrive which I think is how they will get a panel but I'd rather they off her and then also have Overdrive grieve and help people in her memory.
    Or maybe we could go a few anniversary issues and a few years without a useless death

  2. #287
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMaker1610 View Post
    2 things first:
    1- Bro, that was a ruthless jab at Slott hahahahah
    2- They REALLY got me with the "GWEN" reveal, I was almost ready to smash my PC to pieces lmao
    Same man, I was think "WHAT", and then it was Sarah, which made me even more annoyed since Sarah makes even less sense.

    Months ago, back when ASM#55 came out, I decided to drop Spidey for a while again, 'cause Last Remains was a boring, slow trainwreck, then yesterday I decided to catch up with IH and ASM, and the annoying thing about ASM is that, the stories became interesting again after Last Remains, I was legit enjoying Spencer's writing, again, thinking that hey, maybe it can be fun for a while now, then this fucking Sinister War happens.

    I noticed that Spencer's quality drops noticeable whenever the story is about Teresa and Kindred, while Kindred was alright early on, that's because he was just a menacing threat saying "Hey Peter, I still exist and will torment you soon enough!", then Last Remains happens and, yeah... Teresa, the whole "You might be Girl-Chameleon!".

    Admitedly, I laughed my ass off when Teresa smashed the Clairvoyant, because she decided to not confirm who she is, not unlike what Peter did in the original Clone Saga when he decided to not see the test results that confirms if he's a clone or not, they kinda have this similarity, though they did it for different reasons, since Peter was sure that he wasn't a clone because he moved on and started to love MJ, while Teresa actively doesn't want to confirm the truth and decides to live as "Teresa Parker", even if she's not sure if she really is.

    Back to Kindred, what the ****, why's Kindred Sarah now? What about all the clues that pointed out at Harry before? What about Mysterio saying that Harry kicked him out of hell? Did Mysterio have therapy with himself to believe that Kindred was Harry now? Because apparently we're using Mysterio's magic therapy to explain plot holes, 'cause this whole "Oh, MJ actually didn't talk with Gwen about Gwen's affair with Norman and having his kids, it was magic therapy making her think she did" and "Oh, Norman didn't actually **** Gwen, you guessed it, magic therapy" hell, maybe this story will say that OMD never happened and it was just mysterio putting the entire fucking planet in magic therapy to torment Spidey some more, maybe aunt May being shot was a therapeutical bullet all along too.

    Another problem is how the "Sinister War" feels kinda inconsequential, kinda like the whole "Order of the Web" did little in Last Remains... Basically Spencer's making a story bigger than it needs to be, again.

    Whenever Kindred takes center stage, the quality, fucking, drops, and it's annoying, 'cause Spencer can handle Spidey's stuff well enough aside from this, even if he does screw up in other ways.

    Another annoyance I had when catching was the new suit, it's super powered, and, fucking Norah's people came up with it? Seriously? What's next? aunt May's gonna build a time machine? Sheesh...

    At the very least, between this annoying nonsense, we have nice character moments, Spencer's at his best when he has the characters talking about who they are, and interacting with each other, so at least we had good stuff, and as much as this story got annoying, I think the character who benefited the most from his in MJ, too bad she's not around much, but whenever she does, well, he gets her, so that's great.

    Also did anyone from this part of the forum get banned between ASM#55 and now? 'Cause twice I've left for a while, then came back, and noticed someone had been banned, it's kind of an unsettling coincidence lol.
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 09-19-2021 at 12:53 PM.

  3. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by xpyred View Post
    Or maybe we could go a few anniversary issues and a few years without a useless death
    Exactly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Same man, I was think "WHAT", and then it was Sarah, which made me even more annoyed since Sarah makes even less sense.

    Months ago, back when ASM#55 came out, I decided to drop Spidey for a while again, 'cause Last Remains was a boring, slow trainwreck, then yesterday I decided to catch up with IH and ASM, and the annoying thing about ASM is that, the stories became interesting again after Last Remains, I was legit enjoying Spencer's writing, again, thinking that hey, maybe it can be fun for a while now, then this fucking Sinister War happens.

    I noticed that Spencer's quality drops noticeable whenever the story is about Teresa and Kindred, while Kindred was alright early on, that's because he was just a menacing threat saying "Hey Peter, I still exist and will torment you soon enough!", then Last Remains happens and, yeah... Teresa, the whole "You might be Girl-Chameleon!".

    Admitedly, I laughed my ass off when Teresa smashed the Clairvoyant, because she decided to not confirm who she is, not unlike what Peter did in the original Clone Saga when he decided to not see the test results that confirms if he's a clone or not, they kinda have this similarity, though they did it for different reasons, since Peter was sure that he wasn't a clone because he moved on and started to love MJ, while Teresa actively doesn't want to confirm the truth and decides to live as "Teresa Parker", even if she's not sure if she really is.

    Back to Kindred, what the ****, why's Kindred Sarah now? What about all the clues that pointed out at Harry before? What about Mysterio saying that Harry kicked him out of hell? Did Mysterio have therapy with himself to believe that Kindred was Harry now? Because apparently we're using Mysterio's magic therapy to explain plot holes, 'cause this whole "Oh, MJ actually didn't talk with Gwen about Gwen's affair with Norman and having his kids, it was magic therapy making her think she did" and "Oh, Norman didn't actually **** Gwen, you guessed it, magic therapy" hell, maybe this story will say that OMD never happened and it was just mysterio putting the entire fucking planet in magic therapy to torment Spidey some more, maybe aunt May being shot was a therapeutical bullet all along too.

    Another problem is how the "Sinister War" feels kinda inconsequential, kinda like the whole "Order of the Web" did little in Last Remains... Basically Spencer's making a story bigger than it needs to be, again.

    Whenever Kindred takes center stage, the quality, fucking, drops, and it's annoying, 'cause Spencer can handle Spidey's stuff well enough aside from this, even if he does screw up in other ways.

    Another annoyance I had when catching was the new suit, it's super powered, and, fucking Norah's people came up with it? Seriously? What's next? aunt May's gonna build a time machine? Sheesh...

    At the very least, between this annoying nonsense, we have nice character moments, Spencer's at his best when he has the characters talking about who they are, and interacting with each other, so at least we had good stuff, and as much as this story got annoying, I think the character who benefited the most from his in MJ, too bad she's not around much, but whenever she does, well, he gets her, so that's great.

    Also did anyone from this part of the forum get banned between ASM#55 and now? 'Cause twice I've left for a while, then came back, and noticed someone had been banned, it's kind of an unsettling coincidence lol.
    Kindred is still (a version of) Harry. Sarah and Gabriel Stacy were basically clone husks made to be used as vessels for Harry's hell-tainted essence to anchor itself to the material plane. At least, that's my understanding of it, and I'm sticking with that until issue 74 comes out and proves me wrong.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  4. #289
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    Kindred is still (a version of) Harry. Sarah and Gabriel Stacy were basically clone husks made to be used as vessels for Harry's hell-tainted essence to anchor itself to the material plane. At least, that's my understanding of it, and I'm sticking with that until issue 74 comes out and proves me wrong.
    Yeah that makes sense, I did notice these line from Sarah when I was reading:

    https://i.imgur.com/a2GdkoD.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/LP4DOwU.jpg

    Saying Sarah's just a vessel and refering to Sarah and Gabriel as "they" instead of "us", but I ended up ignoring it out of annoyance at Sarah showing up again, and the magic therapy didn't help...

    Honestly, unless ASM#74 makes actual use of Sarah/Gabriel reveal, this might actually not do anything for the story itself besides basically using duct tape to "fix" Spidey by removing Sins Past from ASM 'cause Spencer forgot to do it earlier.

    This is also really, really asking for a Xorneto situation to happen on Spider-Man lol.

    Oh well, even if this isn't Sarah, it's kinda up in the air if this really is Harry after all, 'cause we have Kindred, Harry's corpse, and a living non evil Harry (Supposedly, when Peter went to prove to Liz that Harry was a villain again, they found Goblin gear, which Peter explicitly points out that Harry isn't Green Goblin again), so who knows, and if this is Harry, why he didn't use his own corpse to resurrect is anyone's guess, besides fucking with Carlie and the "other" Harry I guess...

    Basically the story decided to become even more convoluted all of a sudden, and possibly decided to do that just to remove Sins Past while adding little substance to the story itself, though maybe ASM#74 may prove me wrong, the fucking magic therapy will annoy me for a while anyways, regardless if Kindred is Harry or not lol.

    Also worth pointing out we see someone's burying Sarah and Gabriel, might be Harry, but face's covered, and I'm wondering now what the hell Gabriel and Sarah are, like, are they clones of Gwen and Norman now? Y'know, like Conner Kent is one of Supes and Lex? 'Cause at the very least, Gwen's DNA has to be there, would be damn weird for her and Sarah to be unrelated with that uncanny similarity, unless it's like that actress pretending to be aunt May all over again...

    And hey, speaking of that actress, I guess we can now say that random actress had Mysterio's magic therapy done on her .

    Edit: Thinking of it, maybe Kindred is actually spoilers:
    Ned Leeds, would explain his random "I wasn't dead all this time" nonsense
    end of spoilers
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 09-19-2021 at 03:08 PM.

  5. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Yeah that makes sense, I did notice these line from Sarah when I was reading:

    https://i.imgur.com/a2GdkoD.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/LP4DOwU.jpg

    Saying Sarah's just a vessel and refering to Sarah and Gabriel as "they" instead of "us", but I ended up ignoring it out of annoyance at Sarah showing up again, and the magic therapy didn't help...

    Honestly, unless ASM#74 makes actual use of Sarah/Gabriel reveal, this might actually not do anything for the story itself besides basically using duct tape to "fix" Spidey by removing Sins Past from ASM 'cause Spencer forgot to do it earlier.

    This is also really, really asking for a Xorneto situation to happen on Spider-Man lol.

    Oh well, even if this isn't Sarah, it's kinda up in the air if this really is Harry after all, 'cause we have Kindred, Harry's corpse, and a living non evil Harry (Supposedly, when Peter went to prove to Liz that Harry was a villain again, they found Goblin gear, which Peter explicitly points out that Harry isn't Green Goblin again), so who knows, and if this is Harry, why he didn't use his own corpse to resurrect is anyone's guess, besides fucking with Carlie and the "other" Harry I guess...

    Basically the story decided to become even more convoluted all of a sudden, and possibly decided to do that just to remove Sins Past while adding little substance to the story itself, though maybe ASM#74 may prove me wrong, the fucking magic therapy will annoy me for a while anyways, regardless if Kindred is Harry or not lol.

    Also worth pointing out we see someone's burying Sarah and Gabriel, might be Harry, but face's covered, and I'm wondering now what the hell Gabriel and Sarah are, like, are they clones of Gwen and Norman now? Y'know, like Conner Kent is one of Supes and Lex? 'Cause at the very least, Gwen's DNA has to be there, would be damn weird for her and Sarah to be unrelated with that uncanny similarity, unless it's like that actress pretending to be aunt May all over again...

    And hey, speaking of that actress, I guess we can now say that random actress had Mysterio's magic therapy done on her .

    Edit: Thinking of it, maybe Kindred is actually spoilers:
    Ned Leeds, would explain his random "I wasn't dead all this time" nonsense
    end of spoilers
    Hmm, maybe. My bet is that the not-dead, not-evil Harry we've been seeing since the end of One More Day and the beginning of Brand New Day turns out to be a clone of some kind.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  6. #291

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    Let's just assume Mephisto owns everyone's souls, it's the only way to make the slightest bit of sense from this convoluted situation.

    Hell, after reading #73 I'm pretty sure I felt mine leave my body too.

  7. #292
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    Hmm, maybe. My bet is that the not-dead, not-evil Harry we've been seeing since the end of One More Day and the beginning of Brand New Day turns out to be a clone of some kind.
    Yeah, Harry saying "I never came back" can sound like he's a clone, not Harry after resurrecting.

    Hopefully it's not some random hobo Mysterio did some magic therapy to think he's Harry for the sake of shitty twists.

    Also, this situation of "Harry is captured while someone else is pretending to be him (maybe)" reminded me of Spectacular cartoon, where after Harry returned, Norman kidnapped him so Norman could be Green Goblin and no one would suspect of him, and if Kindred isn't Harry (Though he likely is), then it's basically the same thing being done, but if Kindred is Harry, I gotta wonder why Harry was kidnapped to begin with, and why Carlie was even put on the same cell as him.... Maybe the kidnapping was to prevent anything from happening to Harry once Kindred revealed himself I guess, no idea why Carlie was put there with Harry.

    Quote Originally Posted by PanicPixieDreamGirl View Post
    Let's just assume Mephisto owns everyone's souls, it's the only way to make the slightest bit of sense from this convoluted situation.

    Hell, after reading #73 I'm pretty sure I felt mine leave my body too.
    That's okay man, your soul didn't actually leave your body, Mysterio just did some magic therapy on you to make you think it did .

  8. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by xpyred View Post
    Or maybe we could go a few anniversary issues and a few years without a useless death
    Ofc, Again the death would mean we don't have Carlie having an unnecessary B-C slot in ASM going forward.

  9. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderfan001 View Post
    Ofc, Again the death would mean we don't have Carlie having an unnecessary B-C slot in ASM going forward.
    And again, what’s the point of killing a character when we can just write them off? Back in the precious 70’s and 80’s that fans enjoyed so much, characters were written off and just never heard from again. Who gives a damn if fans “hate” Carlie. She’s only hated because of how OMD played out. I bet if she was introduced another way and was helpful to Peter in the same capacity that Jean Dewolff was or that one officer from JMS’s run, Peter wouldn’t hate her so much. I don’t even think about Carlie enough to want her dead for the sake of “stop taking a B, C or D level spot away from someone else.” It makes no sense. And no, I’m not Pro Carlie or OMD or whatever but this senseless killing off of characters just for them to come back within months or years is exactly why comic deaths suck.

  10. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by xpyred View Post
    And again, what’s the point of killing a character when we can just write them off? Back in the precious 70’s and 80’s that fans enjoyed so much, characters were written off and just never heard from again. Who gives a damn if fans “hate” Carlie. She’s only hated because of how OMD played out. I bet if she was introduced another way and was helpful to Peter in the same capacity that Jean Dewolff was or that one officer from JMS’s run, Peter wouldn’t hate her so much. I don’t even think about Carlie enough to want her dead for the sake of “stop taking a B, C or D level spot away from someone else.” It makes no sense. And no, I’m not Pro Carlie or OMD or whatever but this senseless killing off of characters just for them to come back within months or years is exactly why comic deaths suck.
    Then write her off....
    And when I say dead, w/ her current popularity level her death may just stick.If she spends another decade in ASM she may be relevant" enough to be part of the "dying and coming back thing", not a high bar as it is.

  11. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by xpyred View Post
    And again, what’s the point of killing a character when we can just write them off? Back in the precious 70’s and 80’s that fans enjoyed so much, characters were written off and just never heard from again. Who gives a damn if fans “hate” Carlie. She’s only hated because of how OMD played out. I bet if she was introduced another way and was helpful to Peter in the same capacity that Jean Dewolff was or that one officer from JMS’s run, Peter wouldn’t hate her so much. I don’t even think about Carlie enough to want her dead for the sake of “stop taking a B, C or D level spot away from someone else.” It makes no sense. And no, I’m not Pro Carlie or OMD or whatever but this senseless killing off of characters just for them to come back within months or years is exactly why comic deaths suck.
    To be honest very few people care about Carlie one way or another. Why? She is not on the popularity level of Felicia, Original Gwen, Betty or even Liz ( let alone MJ). She also is not controversial like Aunt May, Theresa, Nora or Cindy. So if she stays or is written out of the book, very few (if anyone) will care. Unless: She is fridged, then you will start to see complaints about her getting killed off. Why? Not because of her specifically, but because she is a female character. I say let her live and let the next writer make the choice to use or not use her.

  12. #297
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xpyred View Post
    And again, what’s the point of killing a character when we can just write them off? Back in the precious 70’s and 80’s that fans enjoyed so much, characters were written off and just never heard from again. Who gives a damn if fans “hate” Carlie. She’s only hated because of how OMD played out. I bet if she was introduced another way and was helpful to Peter in the same capacity that Jean Dewolff was or that one officer from JMS’s run, Peter wouldn’t hate her so much. I don’t even think about Carlie enough to want her dead for the sake of “stop taking a B, C or D level spot away from someone else.” It makes no sense. And no, I’m not Pro Carlie or OMD or whatever but this senseless killing off of characters just for them to come back within months or years is exactly why comic deaths suck.
    Yeah, killing characters is something that you have to be careful with, while it does bring drama, it also makes the main character's world smaller, and you have to ask if that price is worth paying.

    That's part of the reason I don't like Flash's death, he was a fun Venom, and the barely tapped into his potential as Anti-Venom before being killed off, not to mention he was a good support character even without the whole Venom part, losing him is a big loss, and that sucks.

    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    To be honest very few people care about Carlie one way or another. Why? She is not on the popularity level of Felicia, Original Gwen, Betty or even Liz ( let alone MJ). She also is not controversial like Aunt May, Theresa, Nora or Cindy. So if she stays or is written out of the book, very few (if anyone) will care. Unless: She is fridged, then you will start to see complaints about her getting killed off. Why? Not because of her specifically, but because she is a female character. I say let her live and let the next writer make the choice to use or not use her.
    Aunt May being on the same "controversial" list as Cindy? For real now?

    At her very worst aunt May was little more than cheap drama for Peter (Like how Ditko used her for most of his run on ASM, though ASM#18 does give that nice "We Parkers are tough" speech), that's really not as bad as Cindy's rape pheromones, which have been gone for years anyways and nowadays she doesn't even show up around Peter much.

    Also Carlie isn't controversial anymore, she was widely disliked to the point her breaking up with Spidey is seen as one of Spider-Island's high points, and even if we ignore the part about her being hated because she came after OMD ('cause we all know fans are gonna dislike any other woman for coming after that), she was still a poorly made love interest who basically stole traits from Peter's previous love interests, and yet, somehow still managed to have more informed attributes than anything, and was overpraised by everyone (Even characters who haven't met her or would have not reason to care about her, like Felicia being weirdly supportive of Peter dating someone in Big Time), to the point she looks like Gwen's second coming (And I certainly like to call her Gwen 2.0 sometimes lol).

  13. #298
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    Honestly I don't think Aunt May is ever going away, not after the nonsensical trouble they went through to bring her back from a perfect death story.

    But I can no longer understand Peter's motivation for not telling her his identity. He already knows she can take it, because she did, and it made both their lives better. There's nothing left to mine from the tension of her being in the dark.

  14. #299
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Yeah, killing characters is something that you have to be careful with, while it does bring drama, it also makes the main character's world smaller, and you have to ask if that price is worth paying.

    That's part of the reason I don't like Flash's death, he was a fun Venom, and the barely tapped into his potential as Anti-Venom before being killed off, not to mention he was a good support character even without the whole Venom part, losing him is a big loss, and that sucks.



    Aunt May being on the same "controversial" list as Cindy? For real now?

    At her very worst aunt May was little more than cheap drama for Peter (Like how Ditko used her for most of his run on ASM, though ASM#18 does give that nice "We Parkers are tough" speech), that's really not as bad as Cindy's rape pheromones, which have been gone for years anyways and nowadays she doesn't even show up around Peter much.

    Also Carlie isn't controversial anymore, she was widely disliked to the point her breaking up with Spidey is seen as one of Spider-Island's high points, and even if we ignore the part about her being hated because she came after OMD ('cause we all know fans are gonna dislike any other woman for coming after that), she was still a poorly made love interest who basically stole traits from Peter's previous love interests, and yet, somehow still managed to have more informed attributes than anything, and was overpraised by everyone (Even characters who haven't met her or would have not reason to care about her, like Felicia being weirdly supportive of Peter dating someone in Big Time), to the point she looks like Gwen's second coming (And I certainly like to call her Gwen 2.0 sometimes lol).
    “Controversial” does not necessarily mean bad. Obviously May and Cindy are not the same, but there is a lot of questions about May’s continued presence in Amazing and her de aging to Marissa Tomei in MCU. Both of which are controversial. Carlie is like a character you find on some lame soap opera, and if she was written out of the book, almost no one would miss her. The one thing I do NOT consider her is Gwen 2. That is reserved for Felicia like on the cartoon (I believe Otto was the villain) and Felicia was basically substituted for Gwen.

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    I think deaging May is a lot less controversial than it is, it never made sense that the Aunt of a 15 year old was the right age to be his grandmother, never mind 10 years later where having her aged up even more would be too much even for a Universe as unrealistic as Marvel. De-aging her is the only way to keep her around while being a constant in Peter's life. I still think killing her off is honestly the best move Marvel could make regarding her, not only is her story done, but she basically never lets the Character move on. I think having her pass gracefully and peacefully is the best way for her Character to go. Amazing #400 was probably the best issue you could have done with May in the 90's.

    Bendis had the right idea with Ultimate Spider-Man by making her act and appear around 50.

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