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  1. #61
    Astonishing Member Prime's Avatar
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    I know i mentioned the game already..but did any if you played DBZ Kakarot?

  2. #62
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prime View Post
    Basically this is the game a Superman game should take inspiration from. Now, DBZ Kart still needed a bit more polish, but it had the right idea
    DBZ Kart could be a fun experience .

    Either way, the way I see it, there are 3 big obstacles when making a Supes game, and they're all about his powers, flight, speed and invulnerability.

    While DBZ Kakarot was mentioned a few times, it's also worth pointing out that DBZ is a world where about every enemy can fly, so that doesn't affect the combat, you can fly, so can your enemy, and Supes has a lot of villains who can't fly, specially if he ends up fighting random mooks, while stolen tech can be excused to give them flight, all of them would be silly, and if you can just fly when your opponents can't, that is a huge advantage you have and can make the combat boring.

    Speed, that is a problem combined with flight, and it's not really combat related, the problem is that Supes can fly and fly fast, so a game with high end graphics could struggle to load other areas if he ends up being able to fly too fast, and his super speed ends up being used only for fast travel, then it's honestly, lazy.

    Invunerability, that's related to when he fights random mooks, 'cause, should they be able to even hurt Supes? 'Cause if they can then he's gonna look like a chump, if you make a plot excuse about Supes being weak then the producers are just being lazy, and if everyone has something like Kryptonite bullets it just looks silly.

    The game based on Superman Returns had the right idea when implementing this (I think it was that game? Not sure...), Supes doesn't have an HP, but Metropolis does, and if Metropolis takes too much damage, you lose, so using that is creative, could even have random mooks attacking civilians so you have to worry about protecting everyone while also stopping the villains, though this "civilians get attacked" is a very dangerous idea 'cause it could become an obnoxious mechanic real fast.

    So yeah, while I think this idea of "Superman is too strong" is stupid, that is kinda the case of you try to adapt him to a video game, 'cause again, random mooks can't just be able to hurt him, he's gonna look less "Super" in a game like that, his fligh can give a huge disadvantage against anything that doesn't fly, and his speed can make loading other areas complicated... Those aren't impossible obstacles to overcome, but they are obstacles, and if Supes were to get a Triple A game, then those obstacles are too big for those hacks with no creativity who make interchangeable Triple A trash.

  3. #63
    Extraordinary Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    I'd employ a Fables-like reputation system that'd impact how the world responds to you; a high rep and people cheer when you pass and SCU try to help you in your battles, a low rep and people throw bottles and the SCU attack you. Your reputation would impact the storyline and what vendors/factions you can access; Cadmus will sell to a shady Superman, but not a do-right one, while the SCU won't sell to a shady Superman but will do business with a righteous one.
    Love this aspect.

  4. #64
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Well, like I said; Elder Scrolls-esque open world sandbox. You'd be able to explore all of Metropolis, if not the world/solar system/galaxy (depending on how much dataspace I can swing). I'd like to make the entire solar system open to player exploration but I wouldn't sacrifice other gaming aspects for it like Minecraft and Megaton did. In any case, these bigger, out-of-city spaces wouldn't be critical to the game since not all character builds could reach them.

    .......

    Trash mobs wouldn't deal much, if any, damage to you but how you handle them would impact your rep. Some enemies would be armed with kryptonite weapons, or would just be powerful enough to hurt you. You'd have a health bar, but it'd only matter for some battles. So do you stop the mugging with super speed and a flick of the wrist, or do you throw a car at the bad guy? It's all about problem solving and building your rep in one direction or the other, and the threat of physical defeat would only apply half the time.

    Like I said, this would push a current console or PC to the edge, but there's nothing here that we haven't already seen in games. It'd be a big ass download but it's not beyond the realm of possibility either.
    That's fantastic! Seriously, that's the game that needs to be made!
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  5. #65
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    It'd take a massive amount of work to build even a rudimentary version of the DCU in that sort of game engine.
    If you were crazy enough to try and include stuff like Rann, Thanagar, Oa, the Reach, the Vega system, and all the other wild stuff out there in DC cosmic, yeah....I doubt that's possible. Far as I know, the games that don't have map limits randomly generate the landscape as you move. They might have a very rough framework (big city here, ocean there) but that's it.

    I think a Super game could maybe pull off the solar system; you render Metropolis properly, provide a basic framework for the rest of earth (NYC roughly here, Shanghai roughly there) and the solar system (planet here, asteroids there) and that's it. Maybe a couple ruins on Mars, or the Watchtower on the moon. But that's still ambitious as hell, and while I think it's possible on a technical level I'm not sure it's financially sound; that's a lot of programming and dataspace to soak up yknow?

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime View Post
    I know i mentioned the game already..but did any if you played DBZ Kakarot?
    I have not but I've seen it mentioned here several times. What about it makes people think it'd provide a good framework for Clark?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning Rider View Post
    Love this aspect.
    Quote Originally Posted by JAK View Post
    That's fantastic! Seriously, that's the game that needs to be made!
    Aw, y'all are too kind.
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

    ~ Black Panther.

  6. #66
    Superman and Wonder Woman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
    I think the best route is to go with a Tell-Tale style of game, aka the two Batman seasons they did. Make it an interactive story, with branching paths based on decisions you make. Superman can then be as powerful as the story needs him to be.

    I would die for an awesome open world Superman game, but I don't think it's possible. Other characters are easy - Batman stays in Gotham, Spider-Man doesn't leave New York, etc - but if I'm Superman in an open world then I get stuck with artificial boundaries that are impossible to avoid but also kill any sense of "Be Superman" (to paraphrase Rocksteady). If I'm Superman, why can't I leave Metropolis? Why can't I fly into space? Obviously the answer is hardware limitations, but in-game there's no way to do it and to have fun.

    When it comes to the argument of "just depower him some for the game", I then ask what is the point of making a Superman game if he's depowered? If I want to play with 1938 powers, there are other games for that power level. And I don't want to play a Superman game where he has to "earn back" his abilities. If he has no abilities, then I could go play something else.

    A procedurally generated world/universe could work if Superman was off planet. But eventually you need him on Earth. And the tech just makes for too many fake boundaries. Interactive stories like Tell-Tale (or something similar) would be the way to go, in my opinion.
    Superman in 1938 had the strength of "10 Samsons". Not just one Samson whose strength come from God himself, but 10. So, if Jerry Siegel is stating he had the strength of 10 Samsons, we can guess Superman himself has always been infinitely strong since 1938. I also just realized that Siegel did a play on Strength of ten men.

  7. #67
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
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    It's not a Superman game, specifically, but this topic reminds me of my days at the ScruffyDragon MUGEN boards - I actually reworked Hannibal's original Superman he'd done (the Kal-Elvis name stuck at the time, that was me), and I did a lot of sprite reworking and the voice, too (I'm also the announcer, lol).

    Good times, feels like a billion years ago! (14, so quite awhile!)

    Supermanmarquee2.jpg

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    Last edited by JAK; 09-20-2021 at 09:27 PM.
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  8. #68
    Spectacular Member cam18's Avatar
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    It would take some innovation but I think Supes has a great game in him where they don't have to nerf him but don't break the game open.......on another note DC dropped the Ball not having more games throughout the years for Flash,Green Lantern and Wonder Woman in particular prior to the MCU they had more name recogntion then alot of the popular MCU characters outside of Spiderman and Hulk.....

  9. #69
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    If you were crazy enough to try and include stuff like Rann, Thanagar, Oa, the Reach, the Vega system, and all the other wild stuff out there in DC cosmic, yeah....I doubt that's possible. Far as I know, the games that don't have map limits randomly generate the landscape as you move. They might have a very rough framework (big city here, ocean there) but that's it.

    I think a Super game could maybe pull off the solar system; you render Metropolis properly, provide a basic framework for the rest of earth (NYC roughly here, Shanghai roughly there) and the solar system (planet here, asteroids there) and that's it. Maybe a couple ruins on Mars, or the Watchtower on the moon. But that's still ambitious as hell, and while I think it's possible on a technical level I'm not sure it's financially sound; that's a lot of programming and dataspace to soak up yknow?
    Well a lot of it could be randomly filled in. You have known locations and,.... the other stuff.

  10. #70
    Ultimate Member Vordan's Avatar
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    You could do maps of different locations, but you can’t simulate an entire planet yet. The tech isn’t there. Wouldn’t you need a computer the size of infinity to simulate infinity anyway ?
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

  11. #71
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    You could do maps of different locations, but you can’t simulate an entire planet yet. The tech isn’t there. Wouldn’t you need a computer the size of infinity to simulate infinity anyway ?
    Just use repeating environments like they used to do in old cartoons. I'm sure nobody would notice the repetition...

  12. #72
    Ultimate Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    Just use repeating environments like they used to do in old cartoons. I'm sure nobody would notice the repetition...
    Lol as a kid I never noticed they copy pasted the same 3-5 buildings to build Metropolis in the Superman Returns game, so maybe you’re right.
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  13. #73
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    You could do maps of different locations, but you can’t simulate an entire planet yet. The tech isn’t there. Wouldn’t you need a computer the size of infinity to simulate infinity anyway ?
    Actually you don't need to generate an entire planet at once.Only what's visible needs to be generated.Seriously people need to check out no man's sky..
    "I swear to devote my life to the destruction of piracy, greed, cruelty and injustice! And my sons, and their sons, shall follow me!"

  14. #74
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Actually you don't need to generate an entire planet at once.Only what's visible needs to be generated.Seriously people need to check out no man's sky..
    This is what I've been saying, we could easily have a Superman game that allows us to explore the entire earth, the entire solar system, or the entire galaxy. The old limitations don't apply like they once did.

    Haven't played No Man's Sky, but it's on my radar and is a game I keep meaning to check out. Keep forgetting to mention it here, but it's graphics are way better than Minecraft or Megaton Rainfall, which just helps prove that you don't have to sacrifice every other aspect of gameplay to achieve a limitless map.

    Honestly, getting the powers and combat right, and creating a challenge while still making the player feel like Superman, are bigger challenges than the map size.
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

    ~ Black Panther.

  15. #75
    Ultimate Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Procedural generation “could” do that but it can not match the depth of hand placement like the Arkham series version of Gotham.
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

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