"The Batman 2022", was it a good Riddler?

[RasAld]

I'm not so sure. Riddler is supposed to be arrogant and a narcissist. He also suffers from OCD, he feels the compulsion to demonstrate his intelligence to Batman, even if it's to his own detriment. This didn't feel like riddler, just a generic serial killer with riddles. I prefer the Riddler in Batman TAS (a sophisticated intellectual) or Batman forever (manic).

[phonogram12]

Do I think The Batman featured A good version of The Riddler? Sure. Did if feature THE good version of The Riddler. I'm less inclined to agree even though I really enjoyed the movie.

I think the problem with a lot of villains like The Riddler and The Penguin is that most movie adaptations want their villain to seem like a genuine threat. You generally don't get that as much with criminals who are just interested in ego or who want to line their pocket. Hell, with heist movies you even find yourself rooting for the criminals.

[superduperman]

This movie would have been better as the third movie in the Nolan trilogy. There, I said it.

[Morgoth]

Depends on what point of view to look at. From the point of view of the source material, Dano, in fact, did not even play the Riddler, but some kind of mash-up of Calendar Man and Holiday, also inspired by Seven and Zodiac. On the other hand, this isn't the first time a character in a movie is completely different from the comics. For that matter, for example, Ledger and Phoenix didn't play the canonical Joker.

[exile001]

If you're asking "is this a valid interpretation?" then yes it absolutely is. The core of the character is there even if he's not going about it in a comic accurate way.

In live action we've only really ever had the same version of the Riddler, a wacky goofball with an underlying sinisterness (to varying degrees). Everyone has done a version of Gorshin's Riddler.

I'm more than happy for a different version, it makes the character more interesting and adds to longevity.

[InfamousBG]

Was this the version from the main comics line that has been going on for years? No. Was this the Riddler everyone wanted to see? I am now guessing yes. He was incredible.

Going in I had odd expectations for THe Riddler with a mask and just killing people. By the middle of the movie though I fell in love with him. By the end I thought it was perfectly done.

We are not always going to get the character in the comics that goes to the big screen. They have to change the character to go with the flow and tone of the film.

Now if we are talking 1966 Riddler from The Batman tv series...wow I love him. Like really loved the Riddler back then.

Paul Dano's Riddler was fantastic though. Perfect for the tone of the movie.

[Spencermalley935]

This movie would have been better as the third movie in the Nolan trilogy. There, I said it.

It does feel like what probably would have happened if Nolan chose not to come back and WB brought in a new director or at least something close to it.

The villain would still be the Riddler as WB wanted, Catwoman would most likely still be brought in as there's no way they'd let the series be a sausage fest, Bruce would have the typical "Batman forever" ending and there might have even been a Robin easter egg (Not like the one in Rises, something like a news broadcast about Haley's circus)

[InfamousBG]

This movie would have been better as the third movie in the Nolan trilogy. There, I said it.

I am not sure that I even come close to understanding that statement.

[superduperman]

I am not sure that I even come close to understanding that statement.

I see the third movie in the Nolan trilogy as more the studio pressuring them to put Bane in and making it the back breaking story. I feel like the franchise would have been better if they had used the classic villains more organically. Sort of like the Raimi Spider Man movies. The studio pressured him to put Venom in the third one even though he didn't really want to. This version of the Riddler fits the Nolan Batman perfectly. The Riddler leaves clues at the scene of dead bodies for the Batman forcing Bruce out of retirement. This sounds like the third movie we should have gotten.

[InfamousBG]

I see the third movie in the Nolan trilogy as more the studio pressuring them to put Bane in and making it the back breaking story. I feel like the franchise would have been better if they had used the classic villains more organically. Sort of like the Raimi Spider Man movies. The studio pressured him to put Venom in the third one even though he didn't really want to. This version of the Riddler fits the Nolan Batman perfectly. The Riddler leaves clues at the scene of dead bodies for the Batman forcing Bruce out of retirement. This sounds like the third movie we should have gotten.

Maybe. I am no fan of Nolan's third Bat film by any means but I am not sure he would have went this route like they did in this film. This was kind of as dark as you can get with a Batman film. Nolan did not even come close as to his films being anything like The Batman. I was very skeptical going to see The Batman. I went back 6 times to see it in theaters because I thought it was that good.

Outside of 1989 Batman, The Batman is a best Bat film in the last 40 years. There a said it. I loved the first 2 Nolan films but come on Bale in that Bat suit was a joke. He looked awful and dont even get me going on the voice.

[godisawesome]

I personally don’t like this version of Riddler - but I appreciate the functionality of this version as an antagonist, if that makes sense.

To me, it’s biggest issue is that it’s clearly insecure about the Riddler’s previous appearances and reputation, and is still stuck thinking it has to compete against Joker on a 1-to-1 ratio, rather than realizing Riddler has more success when he contrasts with the Joker as a more rational villain. Dano goes 100% after the “serial killer Key and Peele would parody” type of performance and the character’s such an irrational and delusional nut job that about five seconds after Joker starts talking to him, we know who the bigger, more in-control villain is. Whether it’s being colorful nd funny or just plain crazy, those are Joker’s areas of expertise, and as long as Riddler is out against him in either category, he’ll end up being a bit of an also ran as a character…

…but as a gimmick, this film nailed what can make Riddler a great challenge - but as the gimmick, not as the character. His riddles are great, the idea he’s uncovered a conspiracy and is exposing it through his crimes, and that you have to figure out what he knows and try to beat him to the punch while he’s ahead of you, all that’s good. The film is at its strongest when Riddler instigates investigations and challenges; it’s at its weakest when he’s supposed to be crazy mastermind, even though there *is* some applicability with him as an incel terrorist.

Personally, I think it would have been better if Riddler were presented as an ice-cold and cruel manipulator of his followers, who is actually pursuing a more rational objective, like trying to steal the Renewal fund, and had his cunning upgraded instead of his crazy.

Like, imagine if it turned out the murders and attacks were conducted by members of his followers he’s directing through brutally accurate tweaking of their neuroses, and he regards them all as pathetic but useful, and catching him was something that required Bruce changing the game after realizing that.

[Spencermalley935]

I see the third movie in the Nolan trilogy as more the studio pressuring them to put Bane in and making it the back breaking story. I feel like the franchise would have been better if they had used the classic villains more organically. Sort of like the Raimi Spider Man movies. The studio pressured him to put Venom in the third one even though he didn't really want to. This version of the Riddler fits the Nolan Batman perfectly. The Riddler leaves clues at the scene of dead bodies for the Batman forcing Bruce out of retirement. This sounds like the third movie we should have gotten.

Nolan was the one who chose Bane, not WB. WB wanted Nolan to use the Riddler. Nolan explicitly said the reason he chose Bane was because he was fascinated by a character who could present both a physical and mental challenge to Batman. There was no "studio interference" whatsoever.

[Spencermalley935]

Maybe. I am no fan of Nolan's third Bat film by any means but I am not sure he would have went this route like they did in this film. This was kind of as dark as you can get with a Batman film. Nolan did not even come close as to his films being anything like The Batman. I was very skeptical going to see The Batman. I went back 6 times to see it in theaters because I thought it was that good.

Outside of 1989 Batman, The Batman is a best Bat film in the last 40 years. There a said it. I loved the first 2 Nolan films but come on Bale in that Bat suit was a joke. He looked awful and dont even get me going on the voice.

Bale is still my go-to live-action Batman at least for now. People can whine until the cows come home about the "Batman voice" but he nailed the most important part of the character, Bruce Wayne and honestly I don't see how he was anymore a "Joke" in the Bat Suit than Pattinson was.

[InfamousBG]

Bale is still my go-to live-action Batman at least for now. People can whine until the cows come home about the "Batman voice" but he nailed the most important part of the character, Bruce Wayne and honestly I don't see how he was anymore a "Joke" in the Bat Suit than Pattinson was.

Keaton is my Batman. Bale can be your Batman. He was a great Bruce Wayne I just thought he looked awful in the suit. Maybe it was just the suit itself. The cape looked like a silk black sheet. Say what you want about Pattinson but he looked great in the suit, his voice was his own and he was a wonderful Batman. He was also in the suit, on screen longer than any other Batman in any other film. Keaton and Val have both stated they did not come back to play the role because the suits were awful to wear (as well as many other reasons not to come back). Affleck has said the same.

Also what is all this "Black Only" suits? Why every version (outside of Affleck) do the suits all have to be black?! I have wondered this for years.

I loved the Nolan movies (the 3rd was just ok). It was a different take at a different time. I saw The Dark Knight I think like 10 times in theaters I think.

[Spencermalley935]

Keaton is my Batman. Bale can be your Batman. He was a great Bruce Wayne I just thought he looked awful in the suit. Maybe it was just the suit itself. The cape looked like a silk black sheet. Say what you want about Pattinson but he looked great in the suit, his voice was his own and he was a wonderful Batman. He was also in the suit, on screen longer than any other Batman in any other film. Keaton and Val have both stated they did not come back to play the role because the suits were awful to wear (as well as many other reasons not to come back). Affleck has said the same.

Also what is all this "Black Only" suits? Why every version (outside of Affleck) do the suits all have to be black?! I have wondered this for years.

I loved the Nolan movies (the 3rd was just ok). It was a different take at a different time. I saw The Dark Knight I think like 10 times in theaters I think.

I've honestly never been that big a fan of Keaton's Batman. I know fans love him because of his whispery Batman voice but he was a mediocre Bruce Wayne (which is the most important part of the character)