AMAZING #75 Review and Spoilers: To Benfinity and Beyond!!!

[Superboy-Prime]

Just got to say...Not Cool. Ben should NOT have put on the suit and called himself Spider-Man without talking to Pete first...and if Pete said 'No' then Ben should not have done it.

Well, like Ben said. It's not just Peter's life. It's their life. That's what they decided back when Peter thought he was a clone. The same rules apply now.

[omegafix]

I want Kaine to come Back, he was cool once he was "healed"

[Huntsman Spider]

I want Kaine to come Back, he was cool once he was "healed"

He'll probably be back at some point, at least to react to Ben as Spider-Man Beyond.

[Chris0013]

Well, like Ben said. It's not just Peter's life. It's their life. That's what they decided back when Peter thought he was a clone. The same rules apply now.

Just one person's opinion...but Ben Reilly should never have been introduced (or reintroduced depending on how you look at it) but with that...when he died he should have stayed dead. I don't think it was as bad as OMD...but it was a bad story to give them a single Spider-Man.

[HypnoHustler]

Just one person's opinion...but Ben Reilly should never have been introduced (or reintroduced depending on how you look at it) but with that...when he died he should have stayed dead. I don't think it was as bad as OMD...but it was a bad story to give them a single Spider-Man.

Wow, what a hot take.

[Chris0013]

Wow, what a hot take.

For the most part I hate the whole "someone else is <insert heroes name>" gimmick. Very rarely is it more than something to shake things up an they always go back to the original.

Times I think it worked...Rhodey because Tony was in the bottle. John Walker becomes Cap because it allowed Steve to re-evaluate what and who he thought Cap should be. These were more character driven stories that allowed the characters to grow. But things like Ben Reilly or Otto becoming Spider-Man or Bucky or Sam becoming Cap....cheap sales gimmick.

I know Ben has his fans...and if they were to use him as Scarlet Spider...more power to them for making him his own thing...But Peter and Ben may have some memories in common...but that does not make them the same person. They have had different lives and life experiences that make them unique individuals.

[Huntsman Spider]

For the most part I hate the whole "someone else is <insert heroes name>" gimmick. Very rarely is it more than something to shake things up an they always go back to the original.

Times I think it worked...Rhodey because Tony was in the bottle. John Walker becomes Cap because it allowed Steve to re-evaluate what and who he thought Cap should be. These were more character driven stories that allowed the characters to grow. But things like Ben Reilly or Otto becoming Spider-Man or Bucky or Sam becoming Cap....cheap sales gimmick.

I know Ben has his fans...and if they were to use him as Scarlet Spider...more power to them for making him his own thing...But Peter and Ben may have some memories in common...but that does not make them the same person. They have had different lives and life experiences that make them unique individuals.

Fair enough on that last point, though the issue is that while they've had different lives and experiences since the moment Peter was cloned, they do still come from the same foundation, more or less.

[boots]

well look at that, my login still works. what's good cbr.

i'm back for beyond but not beyond beyond.

only read the panels online as australia hasn't gotten the hard copies in stock yet, but my take on ben no longer asking permission:

during the 90s, ben continuously centered peter's needs over his own. he stayed in the shadows, took the scraps as "the clone who didn't deserve to live", he sat on the parker home rooftop and mourned aunt may's death alone instead of being by her side. ben constantly put peter first and peter didn't argue it and took it for granted all the way until peter was forced into ben's shoes.

now we have ben deciding he no longer needs to ask for peter's blessing. this is character progression for ben but also a statement of where we are now as a society. minority groups are no longer asking for seconds or scraps or to be the support in someone else's narrative, they're asserting their right to that same centering. it makes sense to me that in the marvel universe, clones would be doing the same.

i reckon it's perfect.

as for brotherly dialogue, sure. i liked that in the 90s, but clone brothers chat could be even more complex than even conversation between twins. think about the way you talk to yourself, you can be harsh and honest and even cruel in ways you wouldn't be with even family members or friends. your clone is you. they know all your deepest darkest thoughts and desires. they know your dreams and your **** ups. they know your weird kinks too. you can delete your browser history but your clone knows, bro. he knows.

dialogue between clones could almost feel like an inner monologue when you argue with yourself. open, without censoring. their feelings are yours and vice versa.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

now we have ben deciding he no longer needs to ask for peter's blessing. this is character progression for ben but also a statement of where we are now as a society. minority groups are no longer asking for seconds or scraps or to be the support in someone else's narrative, they're asserting their right to that same centering.

I don't think Ben Reilly is any analogue for a minority. He's a blonde clone created by a creepy geneticist out of his pervert fixation with a coed.

Anyway you cut it Peter is the injured and aggrieved party. If we want to be analogous, someone whose consent was denied and had his genetic material rewired much like say the DNA of Henrietta Lacks was harvested without her knowledge and compensation to her family.

Ben is closer to Frankenstein's Monster, created for a malign purpose and cast away by his creator but the problem is that the narrative fixates Ben on Peter as somehow being his maker when he isn't.

For Peter, Ben is obviously a threat since he comes in with all of Peter's memories but all handed to him on birth without having to grow and acquire them. So Ben is the entitled granted stuff from birth guy while Peter's the one who was made to earn it. So that also makes Ben like a robot making Peter obsolete.

[Spiderfan001]

Ben literally said that Beyond was going ahead with it regardless of what Ben wanted. For someone like Ben who essentially gets therapy from being Spider-Man, it's a much easier choice than it looks from Pete's perspective.

He's getting therapy aside from being Spider-man.

And I agree 100% it's the easier choice and I think they might play w/ that.He basically gets everything he wants (Money ,therapy, a comfortable life, good home, Janine, being Spider-man) and Beyond's giving it all too him.Question is how far is he willing to go to keep it and how long before he sees that this is indeed to good to be true.

Trusting beyond or any Corp "owning" Spider-man is something Peter wouldn't do, let's say Ben feels it's worth it.Would he not even check the corp to make sure the aren't lying?

Well, like Ben said. It's not just Peter's life. It's their life. That's what they decided back when Peter thought he was a clone. The same rules apply now.

Even if we roll w/ the it's their life thing(I say this because Spider-man hasn't been his life for a long long time now) it's their life, not Ben's and specially not Beyond's.Being Spider-man again is a-okay but what he's doing w/ Beyond means they own Spider-man.And Beyond has already shown blatantly evil signs that Ben hasn't picked up.
Did he even check if the company was legit?

[boots]

I don't think Ben Reilly is any analogue for a minority. He's a blonde clone created by a creepy geneticist out of his pervert fixation with a coed.

Anyway you cut it Peter is the injured and aggrieved party. If we want to be analogous, someone whose consent was denied and had his genetic material rewired much like say the DNA of Henrietta Lacks was harvested without her knowledge and compensation to her family.

Ben is closer to Frankenstein's Monster, created for a malign purpose and cast away by his creator but the problem is that the narrative fixates Ben on Peter as somehow being his maker when he isn't.

For Peter, Ben is obviously a threat since he comes in with all of Peter's memories but all handed to him on birth without having to grow and acquire them. So Ben is the entitled granted stuff from birth guy while Peter's the one who was made to earn it. So that also makes Ben like a robot making Peter obsolete.

as a minority, i'll identify with what characters speak to me in ways that resonate.

there can be more than one working analogy within a story or character and like society, those can evolve and update. the frankenstein monster theme was leaned into heavily in past stories as well as peter's grievances. the point being, we're at a new stage in the relationship and i like where it's now at.

ben being the silver spoon entitled guy was a good laugh though, jack. cheers for that.

[The Black Death]

For the most part I hate the whole "someone else is <insert heroes name>" gimmick. Very rarely is it more than something to shake things up an they always go back to the original.

Times I think it worked...Rhodey because Tony was in the bottle. John Walker becomes Cap because it allowed Steve to re-evaluate what and who he thought Cap should be. These were more character driven stories that allowed the characters to grow. But things like Ben Reilly or Otto becoming Spider-Man or Bucky or Sam becoming Cap....cheap sales gimmick.

I know Ben has his fans...and if they were to use him as Scarlet Spider...more power to them for making him his own thing...But Peter and Ben may have some memories in common...but that does not make them the same person. They have had different lives and life experiences that make them unique individuals.

That would make sense if Miles didn't exist, I have to remind you that originally Miles was also the replacement for the Ultimate Spider-Man and currently coexists with the main Spider-Man without too many problems, so why does Ben have to be the exception? Besides Ben is already back as Spider-Man and the only thing left for you to do would be to accept it or avoid it, it's as simple as that.

[Chris0013]

That would make sense if Miles didn't exist, I have to remind you that originally Miles was also the replacement for the Ultimate Spider-Man and currently coexists with the main Spider-Man without too many problems, so why does Ben have to be the exception? Besides Ben is already back as Spider-Man and the only thing left for you to do would be to accept it or avoid it, it's as simple as that.

Miles became Spider-Man in an alternate universe after that universe's Peter died. I would much prefer if they restarted the Ultimate Universe and put all the Ultimate Characters back there. I also think they need to stop trying to re-tell Peter's stories with Miles...like the Clone Saga from earlier this year.

[Pav]

well look at that, my login still works. what's good cbr.

boots, my friend! So great to see you here. I appreciated your thoughts on Ben and Peter's conversation.

Ben is closer to Frankenstein's Monster, created for a malign purpose and cast away by his creator.

That was KAINE's whole shtick, originally.

-Pav, who still misses that costume...

[Chris0013]

Fair enough on that last point, though the issue is that while they've had different lives and experiences since the moment Peter was cloned, they do still come from the same foundation, more or less.

I view it more like that Star Trek TNG episode with the 2 Rikers. Due to a transporter accident it created a duplicate. One came back to his ship and continued his carreer...the other was marooned alone for something like 8 years. Yes they have the same memories up to a point...but what happened after makes them different people with different motivations, beliefs and desires.