No Time to Die (spoilers)

[Captain Nostalgia]

The worst Bond movie I've seen at least till the Brosnan years, and not just because of the woke stuff.

1. Lack of realism

Craig's movies are supposed to be closer to Connery's films than Moore's or Brosnan, in that they are less campy, and have a sense of realism to them, which was good in this film until they got to Cuba.

The New CIA agent running around shooting a submachine gun with one hand, and then having her quickly beats up 5 guys with three months training. C'mon. or Bond surviving 5 grenades getting dropped on him.

2. Lethargic boring plot line

There were times in the movie where I was literally falling asleep, partially because of point three...

3. The villain

He was one of the most boring cold war retreads I've seen in a James Bond film in a long time. I did not understand his motive, and everytime he talked I was ready for a snooze.

I mean, how many physically abnormal, villains and henchmen does Bond need. A silo misslle base island? What is this the 1960's? They really need to leave this cold war stuff in the past, which I will get to in a bit.

4. Bond didn't feel like Bond

The first time I've watched a Bond film, where the lines coming out of Bond's mouth didn't feel like Bond. He didn't feel confident or fun, and the whole idea of Bond being a family man is sort of antithetical to what Bond is about.

5. The Woke Stuff

I don't know if this was intentional, but....killing off James Bond in a 1950's cold war silo, with a young black female 007 in the wings, smacked of woke politics, (time to move aside old white male, and make way for diversity, Hurray!)

Gimme a break. I wouldn't be surprised if they release some unreleased footage in a few years where she takes the reign for the new 007 for the next film.

and personally I don't have a problem if they make the next James Bond is a POC, because maybe than we could update Bond films so he can go around killing Islamic terrorists and Chinese agents, instead these cold war European and Eurasian retread villains all the time...

but if they do pick someone like Rege Jean Page, than do it for the right reasons, talent and marketability, not politics.

[ChrisIII]

The Japanese island with poison is actually from the YOLT novel, although in that case it was a castle. I think SAFIN's Noh mask/Emblem is also a nod to Blofeld wearing Samurai armor in the novel as well. Since the film version of YOLT didn't really adapt the novel apart from the Japanese setting and Bond working with the Japanese secret service, some have wondered if the 'leftovers' of the novel would make it into a film. (A common practice in Bond films-Goldeneye and Die Another Day use elements from the novel version of Moonraker for example, FYEO is pretty much a bunch of Ian Fleming short stories melded together etc).


Safin's motive for dealing with SPECTRE makes sense but as noted it's unclear why he's after the rest of the world once that's done.

[ChrisIII]

Home video release date is confirmed as 12/21 (First day of Winter).

[Nate Grey]

Thinking about it (I actually saw this around the time of my James Bond Jr comments lol)...

...I didn't like this. Even the silliest Bond films at least aren't a chore to watch, and ironically that might be why I can watch Quantum of Solace to this day.

I liked everything up to Bond and Swan parting ways (before the 5 year jump)...everything after that? Meh. I loved every scene that Nomi and Paloma was in, so there's that at least.

[Pinsir]

This movie basically has the Foxdie concept from Metal Gear Solid in it...Kind of interesting that a franchise inspired by James Bond seems to have served as the inspiration for this film.

[ChrisIII]

This movie basically has the Foxdie concept from Metal Gear Solid in it...Kind of interesting that a franchise inspired by James Bond seems to have served as the inspiration for this film.

Kojima doesn't seem to mind too much. (He also directed Lea Sedoux in DEATH STRANDING).

https://twitter.com/HIDEO_KOJIMA_EN/...45674837458960

[AnakinFlair]

The worst Bond movie I've seen at least till the Brosnan years, and not just because of the woke stuff.

1. Lack of realism

Craig's movies are supposed to be closer to Connery's films than Moore's or Brosnan, in that they are less campy, and have a sense of realism to them, which was good in this film until they got to Cuba.

The New CIA agent running around shooting a submachine gun with one hand, and then having her quickly beats up 5 guys with three months training. C'mon. or Bond surviving 5 grenades getting dropped on him.

2. Lethargic boring plot line

There were times in the movie where I was literally falling asleep, partially because of point three...

3. The villain

He was one of the most boring cold war retreads I've seen in a James Bond film in a long time. I did not understand his motive, and everytime he talked I was ready for a snooze.

I mean, how many physically abnormal, villains and henchmen does Bond need. A silo misslle base island? What is this the 1960's? They really need to leave this cold war stuff in the past, which I will get to in a bit.

4. Bond didn't feel like Bond

The first time I've watched a Bond film, where the lines coming out of Bond's mouth didn't feel like Bond. He didn't feel confident or fun, and the whole idea of Bond being a family man is sort of antithetical to what Bond is about.

5. The Woke Stuff

I don't know if this was intentional, but....killing off James Bond in a 1950's cold war silo, with a young black female 007 in the wings, smacked of woke politics, (time to move aside old white male, and make way for diversity, Hurray!)

Gimme a break. I wouldn't be surprised if they release some unreleased footage in a few years where she takes the reign for the new 007 for the next film.

and personally I don't have a problem if they make the next James Bond is a POC, because maybe than we could update Bond films so he can go around killing Islamic terrorists and Chinese agents, instead these cold war European and Eurasian retread villains all the time...

but if they do pick someone like Rege Jean Page, than do it for the right reasons, talent and marketability, not politics.

Okay, I had to respond to some of these:

1. Have you watched the Connery Bonds recently? With the exception of the first two (Dr. No and From Russia With Love), they all got increasingly outlandish and campy. Spaceships that ate other spaceships and returned them to Earth, volcano lairs, multiple Bloefelds via plastic surgery, the entirety of Diamonds are Forever- they are as campy as any of the Moore films and some of the Brosnan films. And while the Craig films did start with a gritty, real-world vibe, they also started going more fantastical, starting with Skyfall.

Paloma was a more realistic agent than Goodnight was in The Man with the Golden Gun. And hey, you got to start somewhere.

The grenades- yeah, that was a WTF moment.

2. I was engaged myself, but then I tend to like longer movies.

3. I agree with everything you said about Safin. Once he took out Spectre, I really don't know his motivations for anything he does. But I will fight you on the base. I loved the throwback, Cold War-era base that looked like it was a backup location for Dr. No.

4 Agree to disagree. It felt like Craig was having more fun with Bond this time. I'm specifically thinking about the fight in Cuba (pauses to have a drink) and his interrogation of Bloefeld.

5. Sigh. The Craig Bond films are not like the Bond films of the past. The past movies were just a loose collection of stories that could be connected with one another, if only tangentially. By accident or design, the Craig Bond films really created its own universe, where they were almost all connected (Skyfall was a stand alone that they connected after the fact). With Craig officially being done, they wanted to put this universe to rest, and honestly the best way to do that was to kill him. With Craig's Bond dead, when the next movie comes out with a new James Bond, there will be no doubt this is a new series, not connected in any way with the Craig series.

As for the 'Woke' stuff? It isn't like MI6 would retire 007 when Bond retired. It's not a jersey number. Double-O's die or retire, and when that happens, the number is assigned to a new agent, which is what happened here. And yes, she rubbed it in his face at first. But by the end of the movie, it was Naomi who requested that James be given back the 007 designation. And I in no way think the next 'Bond' film will be starring Naomi. She's a one-and-done character who ends with this series.

I know The Rock is saying he wants to play James Bond next, and I say no to that. Not because he's black, but because he isn't British. I've heard that the producers thought about Colin Salmon as the first black Bond years ago, and everybody was saying that Idris Elba should get the role, but I think that they are both too old at this point. I'd wouldn't mind seeing a Black Bond, though.

[BeastieRunner]

I missed the scenes where Bond retires to teach critical race theory and protesting with BLM supporters on his days off.

Woke? He's still full on machismo. He very over-the-top white knighted to save his wife and daughter even.

Just because a black woman got the 007 status does not make it woke.

[ChrisIII]

Dwayne could play Felix. Pretty sure he's played a CIA agent a few times.

[AnakinFlair]

Dwayne could play Felix. Pretty sure he's played a CIA agent a few times.

Now THAT I could go for.

[BeastieRunner]

I think my favorite part of the Craig Bonds has been shining the light on Felix again because of "casting rumors" are talking about who will be the next Felix. I think that is cool.

Q, M, Moneypenny, and now Felix are excellent background characters to keep going on with.

I REALLY enjoyed Jeffrey Wright's take on Felix ... not sure I'd want to see the Rock play him. That feels like a step down IMHO. Wright played him so cool, I think we'd need a different direction for the next series. Whatever role the Rock played would end up overshadowing Bond anyway. Make him an evil CIA agent that tangles with Bond!

I'd like to see a younger Bond next time (30s or younger) with a seasoned Felix (40s or older) to change that dynamic a bit. Jon Bernthal, Mike Colter, Michael Beach, Demian Bichir come to mind. Terrence Howard or Djimon Hounsou might be kind of fun for some new takes.

[ChrisIII]

It'd be interesting if they adapt Felix's lost arm at some point. LTK in the old continuity of course had him get severe injuries, but then Felix didn't show up again in the films until ROYALE which rebooted Felix from scratch-while in the novels, Felix had the injury early on (in the second novel, LALD), but still appeared in later novels. The current comics (Which are a mix of cherry picked parts of Fleming's continuity with the movies's style) have him with some sort of metal arm, while I think the novels described it as a hook.


Also Tanner got a bit of an upgrade in the Craig films, as he only sporadically appeared in the earlier movies (and Robinson pretty much did a lot of his stuff in the Brosnan films.). Still not Bond's best MI6 friend though as the novels seemed to indicate.

[Captain Nostalgia]

Okay, I had to respond to some of these:

1. Have you watched the Connery Bonds recently? With the exception of the first two (Dr. No and From Russia With Love), they all got increasingly outlandish and campy. Spaceships that ate other spaceships and returned them to Earth, volcano lairs, multiple Bloefelds via plastic surgery, the entirety of Diamonds are Forever- they are as campy as any of the Moore films and some of the Brosnan films. And while the Craig films did start with a gritty, real-world vibe, they also started going more fantastical, starting with Skyfall.

Paloma was a more realistic agent than Goodnight was in The Man with the Golden Gun. And hey, you got to start somewhere.

The grenades- yeah, that was a WTF moment.

2. I was engaged myself, but then I tend to like longer movies.

3. I agree with everything you said about Safin. Once he took out Spectre, I really don't know his motivations for anything he does. But I will fight you on the base. I loved the throwback, Cold War-era base that looked like it was a backup location for Dr. No.

4 Agree to disagree. It felt like Craig was having more fun with Bond this time. I'm specifically thinking about the fight in Cuba (pauses to have a drink) and his interrogation of Bloefeld.

5. Sigh. The Craig Bond films are not like the Bond films of the past. The past movies were just a loose collection of stories that could be connected with one another, if only tangentially. By accident or design, the Craig Bond films really created its own universe, where they were almost all connected (Skyfall was a stand alone that they connected after the fact). With Craig officially being done, they wanted to put this universe to rest, and honestly the best way to do that was to kill him. With Craig's Bond dead, when the next movie comes out with a new James Bond, there will be no doubt this is a new series, not connected in any way with the Craig series.

As for the 'Woke' stuff? It isn't like MI6 would retire 007 when Bond retired. It's not a jersey number. Double-O's die or retire, and when that happens, the number is assigned to a new agent, which is what happened here. And yes, she rubbed it in his face at first. But by the end of the movie, it was Naomi who requested that James be given back the 007 designation. And I in no way think the next 'Bond' film will be starring Naomi. She's a one-and-done character who ends with this series.

I know The Rock is saying he wants to play James Bond next, and I say no to that. Not because he's black, but because he isn't British. I've heard that the producers thought about Colin Salmon as the first black Bond years ago, and everybody was saying that Idris Elba should get the role, but I think that they are both too old at this point. I'd wouldn't mind seeing a Black Bond, though.

We'll agree to disagree.

1) Yes, You Only Live Twice was outlandish for it's time, but it took place at the height of the Cold War era, when the general public at that time believed what they saw could be a possibility.

Casino Royale & Skyfall remain two of my favourite Bond films of all time, because they have a sense of realism to it, this one failed in that department on so many levels. Whenever I see someone in a movie shooting a sub machine gun with one hand, I roll my eyes...that should be a big no no in film at this point.

2) We'll agree to disagree, the movie started of good, but began to lag.

3) I couldn't disagree with you more on the Bond villain. It's 2021, how many European and Eurasian villains that appear to be from the Caucuses do we need. Time to mix up the villains a bit.

4) Craig felt like Bond to me in his other films, just not this one. Yes it would be nice if sailed away in an inflatable boat with a woman like Roger Moore, but sigh....(wouldn't happen today sadly) but in his latter films he's still fun, and has the charm and witty one liners. For whatever reason, just my opinion, he didn't sound or feel like Bond in this film.

5) Idris Elba is too old at this point, even the actor I would like (Cillian Murphy) is getting up there, so most likely won't get the role

There was a lot of hoop la about diversity politics creeping into this bond film...and I couldn't help feel that was the case after walking out of the movie theatre. I'm not really bothered if they change the skin pigmentation of Bond, or ever his gender (So long as Jane Bond seduces men) but it shouldn't be done for politics, it should be done for the right reasons, talent & ability, and staying true to his portrayal.

[AnakinFlair]

We'll agree to disagree.

Casino Royale & Skyfall remain two of my favourite Bond films of all time, because they have a sense of realism to it, this one failed in that department on so many levels. Whenever I see someone in a movie shooting a sub machine gun with one hand, I roll my eyes...that should be a big no no in film at this point.


3) I couldn't disagree with you more on the Bond villain. It's 2021, how many European and Eurasian villains that appear to be from the Caucuses do we need. Time to mix up the villains a bit.

Agree completely with this. But I will say that Skyfall suffers from what I call the Joker syndrome. As in the villain has this incredibly complex plot that requires all parties to do exactly what he needs them to do right up until the end, when the hero switches things up and wins. Same thing happened in The Dark Knight with all of Joker's plots, and if you stop to think about it, it can drive you crazy. But I still love both films.

I think you misunderstood me. I'm agreeing with you completely about the villain. I just loved his base. Yeah, the missile silo was a cold-war throwback, but then it was meant to be the original base of Safin's father, who would have been active in the Cold War. Plus I've always loved a cool Cold War base. But Safin himself sucked.

[sunofdarkchild]

I didn't think the movie was 'woke.' We're supposed to take Bond's side when he and the new 007 argue at the beginning and she comes around to respecting him before the climax. The only thing Bond is wrong about is believing Madelyn betrayed him, and that's something that's very in-character for Craig's Bond. Not having some of the more outdated and sexist Bond tropes isn't the same thing as being woke, and having black and female characters be badass spies isn't either.