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  1. #46
    Rumbles Limbo Champion big_adventure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    Most of that is fair enough, and open to supposition from both directions whether we'd get stuff like nuclear shaped charges working in time. Don't think we'll get any further, really.

    Interesting discussion, anyway.
    Yeah, I think that we agree completely on that at least. :-) Maybe not Rake-level agreement, but definite agreement. It's all supposition because it hasn't specifically happened. Feat-based considerations (and humans obviously don't have feats for deflecting a stick like this) work pretty well for Rumbles, but this is very different.

    It is an interesting discussion, and it would make an awesome XKCD kind of question.
    "But... But I want to be a big karate cyborg... ;_;" - Nik Hasta
    "Get off my lawn! ...on this forum, that just makes people think of Cyclops." - Sharpandpointies
    "...makes me think the Night King just says "Screw the rules, I have magic money" when it comes to physics." -Captain Morgan

  2. #47
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_adventure View Post
    Yeah, I think that we agree completely on that at least. :-) Maybe not Rake-level agreement, but definite agreement. It's all supposition because it hasn't specifically happened. Feat-based considerations (and humans obviously don't have feats for deflecting a stick like this) work pretty well for Rumbles, but this is very different.

    It is an interesting discussion, and it would make an awesome XKCD kind of question.
    It did get me looking up 'nuclear shaped charge' to see if we HAD figured them out yet, which brought me to information reminding me that Project Orion was a thing for a bit. *sighs*

    If you haven't already bought 'What If?' by Randall Monroe of XKCD fame, I highly recommend.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  3. #48
    Rumbles Limbo Champion big_adventure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    It did get me looking up 'nuclear shaped charge' to see if we HAD figured them out yet, which brought me to information reminding me that Project Orion was a thing for a bit. *sighs*

    If you haven't already bought 'What If?' by Randall Monroe of XKCD fame, I highly recommend.
    I'm about 75% sure that I'm the one who initially recommended that you read that brilliant tome, several years ago in another conversation. :-) I clearly recall recommending it, I believe that you'd yet to acquire it. Around the same time you recommended "The Girl with all the Gifts" and "The Rosie Project" to me.
    "But... But I want to be a big karate cyborg... ;_;" - Nik Hasta
    "Get off my lawn! ...on this forum, that just makes people think of Cyclops." - Sharpandpointies
    "...makes me think the Night King just says "Screw the rules, I have magic money" when it comes to physics." -Captain Morgan

  4. #49
    JUST DO IT?!?! Postmania's Avatar
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    Fun convos in this thread. Always liked these scenario threads.
    “The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried.”
    -Stephen McCranie

  5. #50
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    [delurk]

    Hmm. I felt like doing math, poorly. I'd also prefer Earth survive this, so all assumptions are best case scenarios for Earth.

    max earth to jupiter distance: 968000000000 m
    pole speed: 16000 m/s
    time to intercept: 60500000 s (not accounting for planetary movement)
    radius of earth + atmosphere: 6453312 m (assuming whatever god threw this at us has good aim for a center mass hit and an atmospheric miss would be enough, which I doubt)
    speed necessary to deflect from the path and miss earth if starting from the moment it was detected: .106 m/s

    telephone pole radius: .11 meters (varies wildly, tapers, etc. Just need a number)
    pole length: 71492000 m
    pole volume: 2717644 m3
    steel mass placeholder for adamantium: 7900000 g/m3
    pole mass: 21469387600 kg (the tiny radius helps us a lot here)

    acceleration in 1ms to reach target speed: 106 m/s2 (I'm not getting involved in impulse or whatever for this)
    Force required: 2,275,755,085,600 N
    This guy ( http://www.u.arizona.edu/~tuvas/Project_orion.html ) throws out a number for project orion that 1 bomb == 80,000,000 N. Assuming that number, you'd need 28,447 project orion style detonations.

    Saturn V stage I force: 3.5*10^7 N
    Force required to deflect: 65,021 Saturn V rockets

    Bomb or rocket, you'd have to exert this force at the center of the pole to prevent it from wasting some energy tumbling.

    Lacking a teleporter, there's no real way to get a fully-loaded Saturn V to the pole, position it, and fire it. Even if we could launch parts and fuel to orbit, assemble it, and somehow get it to the pole with a second ship, the time required to do so will increase the number of Saturn Vs needed to get a successful deflection. Even under the best circumstances, we're boned.
    Last edited by wahwho; 10-13-2021 at 09:48 PM.

  6. #51
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Nice maths, wahwho. Yeah, it's not getting into all of the various factors that probably exist, but for a KISS solution, it rather makes the point.

    Good way to delurk.

    Quote Originally Posted by big_adventure View Post
    I'm about 75% sure that I'm the one who initially recommended that you read that brilliant tome, several years ago in another conversation. :-) I clearly recall recommending it, I believe that you'd yet to acquire it. Around the same time you recommended "The Girl with all the Gifts" and "The Rosie Project" to me.
    Probably, then; my memory isn't helping, here.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  7. #52
    Rumbles Limbo Champion big_adventure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wahwho View Post
    [delurk]

    Hmm. I felt like doing math, poorly. I'd also prefer Earth survive this, so all assumptions are best case scenarios for Earth.

    max earth to jupiter distance: 968000000000 m
    pole speed: 16000 m/s
    time to intercept: 60500000 s (not accounting for planetary movement)
    radius of earth + atmosphere: 6453312 m (assuming whatever god threw this at us has good aim for a center mass hit and an atmospheric miss would be enough, which I doubt)
    speed necessary to deflect from the path and miss earth if starting from the moment it was detected: .106 m/s

    telephone pole radius: .11 meters (varies wildly, tapers, etc. Just need a number)
    pole length: 71492000 m
    pole volume: 2717644 m3
    steel mass placeholder for adamantium: 7900000 g/m3
    pole mass: 21469387600 kg (the tiny radius helps us a lot here)

    acceleration in 1ms to reach target speed: 106 m/s2 (I'm not getting involved in impulse or whatever for this)
    Force required: 2,275,755,085,600 N
    This guy ( http://www.u.arizona.edu/~tuvas/Project_orion.html ) throws out a number for project orion that 1 bomb == 80,000,000 N. Assuming that number, you'd need 28,447 project orion style detonations.

    Saturn V stage I force: 3.5*10^7 N
    Force required to deflect: 65,021 Saturn V rockets

    Bomb or rocket, you'd have to exert this force at the center of the pole to prevent it from wasting some energy tumbling.

    Lacking a teleporter, there's no real way to get a fully-loaded Saturn V to the pole, position it, and fire it. Even if we could launch parts and fuel to orbit, assemble it, and somehow get it to the pole with a second ship, the time required to do so will increase the number of Saturn Vs needed to get a successful deflection. Even under the best circumstances, we're boned.
    Nice cocktail napkin stuff, and welcome to Rumbles!

    We're screwed.
    "But... But I want to be a big karate cyborg... ;_;" - Nik Hasta
    "Get off my lawn! ...on this forum, that just makes people think of Cyclops." - Sharpandpointies
    "...makes me think the Night King just says "Screw the rules, I have magic money" when it comes to physics." -Captain Morgan

  8. #53
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    [DAN] *SCHTONK*

    *limit dance*
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  9. #54
    Rumbles Limbo Champion big_adventure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    [DAN] *SCHTONK*

    *limit dance*
    DAN is kind of a badass.
    "But... But I want to be a big karate cyborg... ;_;" - Nik Hasta
    "Get off my lawn! ...on this forum, that just makes people think of Cyclops." - Sharpandpointies
    "...makes me think the Night King just says "Screw the rules, I have magic money" when it comes to physics." -Captain Morgan

  10. #55
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    ...hilariously, DAN would make a decent weapon for Jupiter Gorilla, Monkey-King style.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  11. #56
    Rumbles Limbo Champion big_adventure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    ...hilariously, DAN would make a decent weapon for Jupiter Gorilla, Monkey-King style.
    Swinging the thing at his max speed and strength would bust a couple of galaxies.
    "But... But I want to be a big karate cyborg... ;_;" - Nik Hasta
    "Get off my lawn! ...on this forum, that just makes people think of Cyclops." - Sharpandpointies
    "...makes me think the Night King just says "Screw the rules, I have magic money" when it comes to physics." -Captain Morgan

  12. #57
    JUST DO IT?!?! Postmania's Avatar
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    Love it when the math gets broken out
    “The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried.”
    -Stephen McCranie

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