View Poll Results: Does Spider-Man Work Better With Or Without The Shared Universe?

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  • He Works Better With The Shared Universe

    17 68.00%
  • He Works Better Without The Shared World

    8 32.00%
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  1. #1
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    Default Does Spider-Man Work Better With Or Without The Shared Universe?

    Spider-Man/Peter Parker has been part of the Marvel universe since his inception. His very first comic series made it clear he wasn’t the only hero in town as Fantastic Four were already in existence, and he wanted to join them for the sake of expediency. For myself, I’ve always been of two minds about this, as much I like the idea of Spider-Man interacting with other heroes like FF and X-Men, I’ve always been of the mindset Peter Parker is better off as a solo character and often prefer other heroes be kept out and be minimally involved in the character’s solo adventures. I like MCU Spider-Man well enough, but there’s still that part of me, despite salivating at the mere possibility of a team-up with F4 in live-action, that kind of longs for the days pre-shared universe where Spider-Man was the only hero with extraordinary abilities who mostly accomplished things on his own without the aid of other heroes like Iron Man or Doctor Strange in the Raimi/Webb movies. I guess what I’m asking is, do you think Spider-Man as a character works better either with or without the shared universe. What’s your overall preference?
    Last edited by Amadeus Arkham; 10-16-2021 at 05:44 AM.
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  2. #2
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I think you can definitely do Spider-Man on his own as indicated in the movies and Spectacular, his world, supporting cast, and Rogues Gallery are rich enough to pull it off, but without the shared universe you miss out on having Spidey do fun team-ups and on significant character relationships with other heroes (Johnny/FF, Daredevil, Wolverine).

    I think with the MCU it's kind of an instance where it maybe revolves around the shared universe aspect so much that it hampers the characters' individual development.

  3. #3
    Astonishing Member Jman27's Avatar
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    I think he is fine in a shard universe as you said he is mainly a loner. But if I see a marvel game and there’s no Spider-Man I do get turn off a little. He is the Pikachu of this franchise he should be with the other heroes. I want him more of a leadership position instead of being the back ups. I think this questions applies more to the X-Men more than anything cause their whole plot line is that they are hated yet they live in a world with other heroes. That same energy that is being used to hate the mutants should apply to every other marvel hero.
    "He's pure power and doesn't even know it. He's the best of us."-Matt Murdock

    "I need a reason to take the mask off."-Peter Parker

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  4. #4
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    Until the MCU, the concept of the "shared universe" as a status symbol was a foreign concept. If anything, it was understood that a character that depends on cameos by other characters and heroes was someone who couldn't sell a book or wasn't interesting to command attention by himself. And Shared Universe appearances were generally seen as cringe or pathetic.

    So I would say Spider-Man is at his best when he is by himself. Some of his greatest and most famous stories - The Master Planner Saga - make no mention or reference to any other hero. You could read that and pretend that Spider-Man is the only hero in that world and be satisfied. There are great stories with Spider-Man as part of the Marvel Universe, like the Juggernaut 2-Parter, so it can work and be valued yes but there are far too many more where he's by himself that it's not required.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    His very first comic series made it clear he wasn’t the only hero in town as Fantastic Four were already in existence, and he wanted to join them for the sake of expediency.
    See when you present an example you need to present the context. The fact is that when Spider-Man made his debut in his own title, he was the new hero and the FF were there to help set him and hype him as a big deal. So the Fantastic Four were strictly promotional. If you read ASM#1, then you'll see it has two stories. The first story is about Spider-Man and Jameson. The second story, a much shorter one, is the one with Chameleon and FF.

    In other words, the FF were there for promotional and marketing reasons, not creative reasons. Once Spider-Man was established and popular, the FF and shared universe stopped making regular appearances and it's known that Steve Ditko wanted Spider-Man as a solo and standalone hero as much as possible. So the context of Spider-Man as a newcomer doesn't exist today. When Kamala Khan made her debut and needed to be tied and promoted with everything she was what Spider-Man was in his first issue. Today that context doesn't exist. Like does anyone seriously think that an Iron Man cameo is needed for Spider-Man? ​

    I mean you take Ultimate Spider-Man. It was that comic's success that laid the foundation for Ultimate Marvel. It came first and it sold far more issues and it was until 15-16 in that Nick Fury made his first appearance in Bendis-Bagley's run.

    For myself, I’ve always been of two minds about this, as much I like the idea of Spider-Man interacting with other heroes like FF and X-Men, I’ve always been of the mindset Peter Parker is better off as a solo character and often prefer other heroes be kept out and be minimally involved in the character’s solo adventures.
    Same.

    What’s your overall preference?
    I am not interested in Spider-Man being talked down by characters who individually and collectively don't measure up to him and so on.

  5. #5
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    It is strange how Peter is sometimes written as skeptical of things such as vampires, aliens or ghosts, and yet has been on enough intergalatic and supernatural adventures with groups like the Fantastic Four, Avengers, etc. that it shouldn't be a surprise.

    That said, he's been shared since ASM#1 back in 1963, so it's sort of bred in him now. I think it's fine. He has some great chemistry with characters like Human Torch, Daredevil, Wolverine, even Punisher. Although I don't like him being an Avenger. I definitely prefer him as primarily a loner with the occasional team-up.

    Now, if we're talking about Batman on the other hand....

  6. #6
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    I think he works best as a loner in a shared universe w/ occasional team-ups and all the great frendships.Also no Spider-family in either case

  7. #7
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    Shared universes are a lot like drugs. They can be fun and ideal if used in moderation, but if that's all a person wants and it comes at the expense of everything else, then they're not worth it. Spider-Man in a shared universe that takes away what makes Spider-Man work is just not worth it.

    The people who worked on the 616 and Insomniac shared universes are like responsible drug users, going by my analogy. Whereas the MCU often functions like a drug junkie in how much it wants to connect everything and go for novelty.
    Last edited by Kaitou D. Kid; 10-11-2021 at 08:23 AM.

  8. #8
    Spectacular Member Pattern_Maker's Avatar
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    Either one works. You can still do solo Spidey without mentioning other heroes.

  9. #9
    Extraordinary Member babyblob's Avatar
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    Spiderman can very much work o his own and has for years. Although his big Spider family has gotten a bit out of hand with just how many there are now. Teaming up with other heroes is fine. I enjoyed the marvel Team Up books. But I dont really like seeing other heroes in his books other then once in a while.

    I hate seeing him on The Avengers. I hate seeing other heroes treat him like a joke and the writers treating him like comic relief. In the old Marvel Team up books with Spiderman the other heroes either showed him respect or flat out didnt trust him because they didnt know him that well. That has gotten lost in recent years. Now when a hero sees him it is kind of them talking down to him or treating him like a side kick.
    Favorite teams. Alpha Flight, Avengers, Fantastic Four, West Coast Avengers, Justice Society of America, Legion of Superheroes.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    Spiderman can very much work o his own and has for years. Although his big Spider family has gotten a bit out of hand with just how many there are now. Teaming up with other heroes is fine. I enjoyed the marvel Team Up books. But I dont really like seeing other heroes in his books other then once in a while.

    I hate seeing him on The Avengers. I hate seeing other heroes treat him like a joke and the writers treating him like comic relief. In the old Marvel Team up books with Spiderman the other heroes either showed him respect or flat out didnt trust him because they didnt know him that well. That has gotten lost in recent years. Now when a hero sees him it is kind of them talking down to him or treating him like a side kick.
    Spitting, good writers know others respect him a lot.Even f*cking Bendis(who can't write 616 Spider-man well) got that part right for the most part IIRC.

  11. #11
    The Superior One Celgress's Avatar
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    I prefer Spidey's adventures being (mostly) self-contained.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  12. #12
    Extraordinary Member babyblob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderfan001 View Post
    Spitting, good writers know others respect him a lot.Even f*cking Bendis(who can't write 616 Spider-man well) got that part right for the most part IIRC.
    I just dont see it often I guess. Daredevil and Wolverine are the only two that I have seen treat him with any kind of respect or at least didnt make sly jokes on him. Everyone else is either bossing him around or ignoring him. or Spiderman is cracking jokes and not doing anything meaningful. Maybe it has changed. I havnt read anything with him teaming up with anyone that came out the last couple years to be honest.
    Favorite teams. Alpha Flight, Avengers, Fantastic Four, West Coast Avengers, Justice Society of America, Legion of Superheroes.

  13. #13
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    I just dont see it often I guess. Daredevil and Wolverine are the only two that I have seen treat him with any kind of respect or at least didnt make sly jokes on him. Everyone else is either bossing him around or ignoring him. or Spiderman is cracking jokes and not doing anything meaningful. Maybe it has changed. I havnt read anything with him teaming up with anyone that came out the last couple years to be honest.
    Speaking of Daredevil, that was one of the better parts of Chip Zdarsky's current run, that when Spider-Man went to Daredevil and demanded that he stop before he got himself jailed or dead because of how his going back out on the streets before he'd fully recovered from his earlier severe injuries resulted in him killing someone, Daredevil took him seriously enough to listen and stop (at least for a while). He even referred to Spider-Man in his thoughts as, "pure power and he doesn't even know it. He's the best of us." That's something I think should be emphasized more if we're going to keep Spider-Man in a shared universe, since he did start off at the same time as the other icons of the Marvel Universe, even if he was a teenager and most of them were already adults (barring Johnny Storm/Human Torch and the original five X-Men) at the time.

    With that in mind, he has a breadth and depth of experience and skill --- a lot of that sourced from him having to fend for himself with no support system or other backing to rely on --- that just about any other hero in the MU should be wanting to tap into as a valuable resource. Going back to him starting off as a teenager and growing into an adult, he ought to be the proverbial "big brother" figure for the younger heroes as a result; he may not necessarily be as "cool" or impressive at first glance as some other heroes, but after spending enough time with him to see what he's really about and how seriously he takes being a hero, any annoyance with his constant quips, jokes, and snark should coexist with being genuinely amazed and even inspired by him. As for his adult peers, I think there is (or should be) room for a decent balance of irreverent ribbing between them without indicating or implying that they don't take him seriously at all --- which should never be the case after how long he has been in the superhero life and how much he's bled, sweat, and sacrificed in the name of doing the right thing with his powers.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  14. #14
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    Shared universe...if he would just respond to his emails with his New Avengers team mates.

  15. #15
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0013 View Post
    Shared universe...if he would just respond to his emails with his New Avengers team mates.
    That's a fair point, too. It'd be one thing if every other superhero in the MU was constantly being a jerk to him; I could see him not wanting to answer emails from them in that case. Of course, they're more hurt than angry that he seems to ignore them, which does make it easier for some to think the worst whenever something bad happens with Spider-Man in its vicinity. Kind of like what Jameson was saying in their podcast interview when he argued that Spider-Man brought at least some of his bad publicity on himself by refusing to open up to the media and clear the air with regard to all the accusations against him, or even to his superhero peers.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

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