Marvel needs a new universe

[Ultimate Captain America]

An interesting twist would be a universe with no superpowers at all. The characters and their casts exist, but they simply don't have superpowers. Of course, as countless films and TV series show, you don't need them for a series to be entertaining or even have action.

For example, take the idea of Spider-Man in high school and do something like Riverdale or Dawson Creek. Take Captain America and make something like Die Hard. Take the Fantastic Four and make The Martian. Take a gang of street-level heroes and make Brooklyn 99.

[Ptrvc]

I don't think the current owners of Marvel are interested in the Universes they have much less creating a new one.

Continuity gets in the way of Consumption. Personality gets in the way of Product.

[CosmiComic]

That's unfortunate

[Ultimate Captain America]

Marvel made several comics set in the Wastelands. Even now, with Old Man Logan already dead, they are about to release "The Wastelanders" in a couple of months.

[PlatinumThorns]

Kinda wish they stuck with the 1602 universe. That Earth in particular got a lot of spin-offs and yet it was quickly dropped before/during Secret Wars.

[TheRay]

I just like the idea of being able to go in to certain universes whenever we want for more stories set there. I am very surprised that they don't do that or at least not often enough.

[Chainsaw Vigilante]

I've mentioned this before, but they already have an out. Back in 2001-2002 the Fantastic Four had the Abraxas saga that erased and re-booted the multiverse with the Ultimate Nullifier based on Reed Richards' thoughts guided by Galactus. They could easily have a classic multiverse for fans of the old ways of Marvel and a multiverse for fans of the newer ways by saying that what happened was that the old multiverse was cleansed of Abraxas based on Galactus' guidance and Reed accidentally created an alternate multiverse that has resulted in the bulk of the Quesada to now era.
They could have a Classic Marvel line that's more heavily edited and continuity based (a spirit of Gruenwald line) focusing more on the classic characters while also having the modern marvel line with modern modern concepts, looser editing (not that that's what fans want, more so it's what the writers want), more socio-political bent for those that want it, more "succession" characters, etc. That way everyone is happy. It'd be like Lucasfilm finally releasing the theatrical cuts of the original Star Wars trilogy, thus finally satisfying the fans that want those films while the "special editions" will also still exist. Why not make everyone happy?

Continuity is garbage mainly as a lot of writers want a more hands off approach, it's lazier and makes the universe less coherent, but gives them more creative freedom.

[Lee Stone]

Well... they could always dust off Crossgen or Ultraverse.
Of course, I don't know how often they need to publish something to keep the trademark.
I'm sure we'll see a special or something if/when it gets close to renewing.

[Devaishwarya]

No, they don't. Not when...
1: They can do so much more wth the 616 if only they were willing to push the envelope and think outside the box.
2: They don't push the envelope and think outside the box now...what would make having a new universe any different? They'll be stretching the imaginative and financial threads, and readership interest, that are already sretched way too thin.

We don't need more X-Men, F4, Avengers and Spiderman (the million and one Batbooks and Universes over at DC aren't a financial windfall)...we just need new and better and different stories.
And
3: Let history show that even when we are given "new, better and different" (objectively speaking) we still don't want and support it.

[CosmiComic]

No, they don't. Not when...
1: They can do so much more wth the 616 if only they were willing to push the envelope and think outside the box.
2: They don't push the envelope and think outside the box now...what would make having a new universe any different? They'll be stretching the imaginative and financial threads, and readership interest, that are already sretched way too thin.

We don't need more X-Men, F4, Avengers and Spiderman (the million and one Batbooks and Universes over at DC aren't a financial windfall)...we just need new and better and different stories.
And
3: Let history show that even when we are given "new, better and different" (objectively speaking) we still don't want and support it.

Because some fans are resistant to new things, unfortunately.

What do you think would be the solution?

[Hypestyle]

my guess is that marvel editorial is okay with implicit soft reboots every time there is another 5-7 years that go by-- seeing it in the recaps of the origin stories, etc.

at this point, Steve Rogers unthawing took place, what, during the Obama first term rather than 1962?

There would inevitably open rebellion at any genuine line-wide 616 reboot, along the lines of DC finally reversing the New 52 and even the random reversals that took place after the first Crisis in the 1980s.

[Lukmendes]

I've mentioned this before, but they already have an out. Back in 2001-2002 the Fantastic Four had the Abraxas saga that erased and re-booted the multiverse with the Ultimate Nullifier based on Reed Richards' thoughts guided by Galactus. They could easily have a classic multiverse for fans of the old ways of Marvel and a multiverse for fans of the newer ways by saying that what happened was that the old multiverse was cleansed of Abraxas based on Galactus' guidance and Reed accidentally created an alternate multiverse that has resulted in the bulk of the Quesada to now era.
They could have a Classic Marvel line that's more heavily edited and continuity based (a spirit of Gruenwald line) focusing more on the classic characters while also having the modern marvel line with modern modern concepts, looser editing (not that that's what fans want, more so it's what the writers want), more socio-political bent for those that want it, more "succession" characters, etc. That way everyone is happy. It'd be like Lucasfilm finally releasing the theatrical cuts of the original Star Wars trilogy, thus finally satisfying the fans that want those films while the "special editions" will also still exist. Why not make everyone happy?

Continuity is garbage mainly as a lot of writers want a more hands off approach, it's lazier and makes the universe less coherent, but gives them more creative freedom.

That sounds like DC with either the Earth 1/2 separations, or how they try to solve stuff with a Crisis event few tears,

The problem with trying this is that knowing Marvel, if they went for it, and we got a "classic" and "modern" continuities, one of them would become more popular and start to get stuff from the other, kinda like how 616 eventually got stuff from Ultimate.

I also doubt it'd be an "everybody's happy" situation, 'cause comic books are expensive, so people will keep buying whatever is perceived as the "main" universe while the other gets scraps, and then eventually the non main universe will most likely die, and with Spidey once again being the last one to go out lol.

2: They don't push the envelope and think outside the box now...what would make having a new universe any different? They'll be stretching the imaginative and financial threads, and readership interest, that are already sretched way too thin.

If Ultimate is any hint, a new universe is more willing to take risks because it's a blank slate, while 616 has established things that limits it somewhat.

What Ultimate did more than anything was being edgy, to the point cannibalism showed up with weird consistency, but the point is that a new universe can do more different stuff without as much backlash.

So yeah, a new universe to think outside the box is a thing they can do, as Ultimate itself showed, just a safe way to do the "Throw **** at the wall and see what sticks" method lol.

[Devaishwarya]

And where is Ultimate now? (New, better and different are not synonyms for edgy, dark and gross.)

And if they can take risks elsewhere, why can't the take risks in the 616? (It was basically the same fans reading both 616 and Ultimate, at the time...the readership didn't significantly grow because of the new Universe (eventhough that was the intent) and the readership has certainly dwindled significantly since then.

[Ultimate Captain America]

As I pointed before, Marvel does have a "ultimate" universe right now. It's the Wastelands. Old Man Logan is dead and "Avengers of the Wastelands" seemed to be the closing chapter for it, but Marvel is still making new stuff about it. We have Wastelanders: Wolverine, Wastelanders: Hawkeye, Wastelanders: Star-Lord, Wastelanders: Doom, and Wastelanders: Black Widow, all to be released in December.

[Lukmendes]

And where is Ultimate now? (New, better and different are not synonyms for edgy, dark and gross.)

And if they can take risks elsewhere, why can't the take risks in the 616? (It was basically the same fans reading both 616 and Ultimate, at the time...the readership didn't significantly grow because of the new Universe (eventhough that was the intent) and the readership has certainly dwindled significantly since then.

I'm pretty sure there were people who wanted to get into comic books and read Ultimate and not 616 because it was a new continuity.

Either way, a new universe has the benefit of changing stuff from the background without causing as much controversy, imagine if X-Gene was retconned to be another attempt at recreating Cap's super soldier serum in 616?

The wildly different characterizations too, in 616, when Morrison made Magneto into a terrorist again (Though there was the whole thing of him being controlled by Sublime at least), they retconned it really fast with that whole "Xorn was Magneto" nonsense, while Ultimate Magneto stayed as that pure evil villain who eventually caused Ultimatum.

And if the other universe isn't going for being similar to 616, then another thing it can do is time skips, 616 basically never does it (Pretty sure ANAD was the only time), while another universe can be used to advance time, have heroes actually age, retire and have successors take over, if MC2 is any hint, 616 is way less willing to do something like that, specially with bigger names like Spider-Man.

So yeah, there's stuff that another universe can do that 616 isn't as willing to go for, 616 has stuff that is considered "classic" and they're not as willing to change stuff, it obviously can happen, but riskier stuff are easier/safer in a new universe.

As I pointed before, Marvel does have a "ultimate" universe right now. It's the Wastelands. Old Man Logan is dead and "Avengers of the Wastelands" seemed to be the closing chapter for it, but Marvel is still making new stuff about it. We have Wastelanders: Wolverine, Wastelanders: Hawkeye, Wastelanders: Star-Lord, Wastelanders: Doom, and Wastelanders: Black Widow, all to be released in December.

Sounds interesting, is it in the same universe as OML's? 'Cause if he's dead, then it's weird he's there, unless some chapters happen before his death?