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  1. #241
    Ultimate Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakurai View Post
    Woah. So if I'm a fan of Laura, apparently we all have one single brain and all are complaining and racist and deserve our favorite character to disappear from comics?
    I have no idea where you read it, but no, there is no thread filled by X-23 fans with racism, because if that was the case it would be erased and people would be banned.
    I donít think every X-23 fan is antiblack but boy is that a veryÖ Ďwet behind the earsí opinion, if I may say nicely.

  2. #242
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevlon View Post
    Wow. I know Jean is powerful. But she handled Nightmare like he was nothing. Nightmare is a fear lord that causes problems for the sorcerer supreme. For Jean to just bat him away like a he was a fly.... that's something else.

    Not sure how I feel about Jean having this kind of power.
    Jean is an omega mutant for her TP. Its about time we start seeing her do things in that era to justify that instead of fainting or being rendered useless bc her opponent has TP resistance

  3. #243

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Y'all.

    How about some kindness and decency.

    I'm seeing all this strife and offensive rhetoric being slung left and right. Its not the look.
    We all have favorites. And we all want to see them shine. So lets not bad mouth somebody just because our favorite isn't being focused on. Its a group book. There are a lot of characters and the author has already pointed out that there WILL be issues that highlight individuals. There is absolutely no need to bad mouth anyone's characters because lets be honest -- we're all big nerds for the X-Men and many of us feel personally attacked when our favorite is defamed by other posters.

    Take a moment and self reflect. Please.
    When people come in hot and fast to advocate for their person, but in the same breath opt to shred another character? That's just tacky. Be better. Be LIKE the hero you love so much by behaving as they would.

    Unless your favorite is Sinister.
    You might be a sociopath. I don't make the rules. (I'm kidding, have a sandwich <3)
    Perfectly said. This is a hobby we all enjoy and while it's perfectly normal to feel passionate about these characters, we can be respectful.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom X View Post
    Literally! I’ll voice when I think a character I like is mistreated, but IMO that should never extend to bashing another character or their fandom. It’s hypocrisy at it’s finest.
    Agreed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    Jean is an omega mutant for her TP. Its about time we start seeing her do things in that era to justify that instead of fainting or being rendered useless bc her opponent has TP resistance
    Agreed. "Omega" has seemed like only a label, IMO, until recently so I'm happy to see evidence of said label.
    Boop! Krakoa forever!

  4. #244
    Astonishing Member dkrook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lefthanded View Post
    Some people are arguing about how this comic is 'problematic'. I think they are making a mountain out of a molehill.

    X-men comics have always been seen as a sort of soap operas. Amnesia tropes abound in soap operas, and this Laura/Synch memory thing is just one more wrinkle in that. Evil siblings can be common, and the Jean / Madelyn / Dark Phoenix is a version of that. There isn't really supposed to be realism here, and there isn't any bad behaviors occurring in a more realistic sense.

    Synch is certainly behaving better than Adam Sandler's character in 50 First Dates (in which the male character continually tries to make the female character with memory problems fall in love with him), or any other rom-com where the guy's stalking behavior is rewarded.

    Can female characters have better storylines? Yes.
    Is this comic a good example of female characters done dirty? No (For that, just look at any Greg Land drawn comic, or the myriad of Scarlet Witch possession storylines).
    Wink...looking at you Ground Hog Day movie, lol!! Dude spent multiple lives just trying to manipulate one woman's feelings to fall for him.

  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevlon View Post
    Wow. I know Jean is powerful. But she handled Nightmare like he was nothing. Nightmare is a fear lord that causes problems for the sorcerer supreme. For Jean to just bat him away like a he was a fly.... that's something else.

    Not sure how I feel about Jean having this kind of power.
    I think she can handle what Nightmare threw at her here, as in dream/mind manip.The problem is that he has so much more that Jean or most heroes just can't take.Seriously even outside his own realm he is an immensly powerful magician.

    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus View Post
    Didn't teenage Jean has punched Galactus in the face? ;-)

    I'm just wondering what you think the power scale of being an omega level telepath should be instead? I supposed that Jean's mutant powers is maybe simply exact the achilles' heel for Nightmare's powers.
    She's an omega level TP and heck let's say she's an Omega level TK as well.Those 2 things aren't enough to take out Nightmare in an actual battle.I'm not insinuating what she did was an outlier, she can take him in a TP fight IMO but they took most of Nightmare's powers away, he literally didn't use his powers.

    Also There is a massive diff. b/w being useless and doing this, but ignoring the fact nightmare didn't use his powers it's still an insane feat and I wonder how they are gonna keep this consistent throughout the run because if she can do this 99% of X-men problems are nothing to her.


    Also also just want to say that this is a Jean focus issue and yet most comments are stuck on one panel of Laura/Synch........
    Last edited by Spiderfan001; 10-14-2021 at 09:02 AM.

  6. #246
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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  7. #247
    Astonishing Member dkrook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    This is the internet and in CBR (as with Twatter) there are always other "mitigating factors" for the attitudes and opinions of some.
    Luckily, if you really pay attention you can learn to spot those from a mile away and avoid them wherever, whenever possible.
    You very much correct, but it doesn't take away the icky feeling of disgust knowing that some are using all kinds of issues to cover their racial enmity manifesting through one harmless fictional character.

  8. #248
    Mighty Member kevlon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus View Post
    Didn't teenage Jean has punched Galactus in the face? ;-)

    I'm just wondering what you think the power scale of being an omega level telepath should be instead? I supposed that Jean's mutant powers is maybe simply exact the achilles' heel for Nightmare's powers.
    Yeah I guess that Nightmare could have weakeness agaisnt tp. I think I'm just worried of Jean being put into the too powerful bracket and never getting used. If Jean can beat anyone and everyone, what's the point of having the other X-Men around?

    But actually I think you are right. An omega has no upper limit of power. So doing things like this should come standard to omegas.

    It was an awesome show of her power.

  9. #249
    Mighty Member kevlon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderfan001 View Post
    I think she can handle what Nightmare threw at her here, as in dream/mind manip.The problem is that he has so much more that Jean or most heroes just can't take.Seriously even outside his own realm he is an immensly powerful magician.



    She's an omega level TP and heck let's say she's an Omega level TK as well.Those 2 things aren't enough to take out Nightmare in an actual battle.I'm not insinuating what she did was an outlier, she can take him in a TP fight IMO but they took most of Nightmare's powers away, he literally didn't use his powers.

    Also There is a massive diff. b/w being useless and doing this, but ignoring the fact nightmare didn't use his powers it's still an insane feat and I wonder how they are gonna keep this consistent throughout the run because if she can do this 99% of X-men problems are nothing to her.


    Also also just want to say that this is a Jean focus issue and yet most comments are stuck on one panel of Laura/Synch........
    This is a better post than the one I wrote

  10. #250
    Spectacular Member Rakurai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tycon View Post
    I don’t think every X-23 fan is antiblack but boy is that a very… ‘wet behind the ears’ opinion, if I may say nicely.
    Wait, so was there a thread filles with racism by X-23 fans? Because there is difference between some comments, which are bad and I sincerely condamn them, and that we are raiding every thread with rasism. Also, if threads were filled with that wouldn't people be banned? I've seen threads disappear and people having bans for some time so I though something works here, and we cannot post some stuff because we'll be removed from forums. Also, one sentence below I said that rest of fans don't agree and reply to that comments. Also, I'm not native english speaker, I don't know what you mean. But if your calling me idiot for what I said, I guess I heard that enough in last 2 days each time I expressed my opinion. I never said there is no issue at all, it surly happened, just not as much as the person I replied to accused us of.

  11. #251
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    This is the same Jean Grey that neutralized symbiote god, Knull when everyone else seemed ineffective towards him



    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderfan001 View Post

    She's an omega level TP and heck let's say she's an Omega level TK as well.Those 2 things aren't enough to take out Nightmare in an actual battle.I'm not insinuating what she did was an outlier, she can take him in a TP fight IMO but they took most of Nightmare's powers away, he literally didn't use his powers.

    Also There is a massive diff. b/w being useless and doing this, but ignoring the fact nightmare didn't use his powers it's still an insane feat and I wonder how they are gonna keep this consistent throughout the run because if she can do this 99% of X-men problems are nothing to her.


    Also also just want to say that this is a Jean focus issue and yet most comments are stuck on one panel of Laura/Synch........
    But doesnt all his power come from when a person is sleeping? He affects the person on the Astral plane which is Jean's playground. What could he have realistically have done to her?

    And as far as this fear that she can take on 99% of the X-men's problems is a gross exaggeration. This was one issue against a mental threat. Her TP was useless in the first issue when that creature had TP resistance and Jean's role amounted to delegating orders and shielding the civilians. The entire team combined their powers to beat the threat. In #2, she used her powers to get intel to inform Sunfire, how he could beat the threat. She didnt really do anything in #3 besides project a TP image and TK shield herself when attacked. Duggan isnt about to have her oneshot the enemies from here on out.
    Last edited by Havok83; 10-14-2021 at 09:22 AM.

  12. #252
    Astonishing Member Frobisher's Avatar
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    I might start to only read the books from now on.

  13. #253
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    As a Laura fan I would be way more on board with this relationship if it had been handled better. If there had been an eXiles series about the Vault team and there was more depth to the relationship than three panels and some narration from another character I might be on board and even very interested in seeing if she wants the memories or not. Even without that a skilled writer could weave in her long-standing issues of souls and identity into a discussion of whether Vault Laura was her and if she wants the memories back or not. I could see an argument either way that would be in character for her. Or if what we got was a relationship built up after the Vault where Synch was more interested in bonding with current Laura than giving her his memories. Or if there was any acknowledgment that giving her those memories wouldn’t bring the woman he loved back or even guarantee Laura would love him. So many interesting things you could do with this.

    But we didn’t get those arcs. Instead we got a tell-not-show relationship between two characters who hadn’t even interacted before (or been alive and in comics at the same time lol). And Laura hasn’t really been written in character since Uncanny X-Men began. This just feels like lazy writing. I’m glad Synch fans get him having a real arc after actual decades, and I don’t think that would be possible without tying him to an A-lister. I just wish this romance was written by someone with any knowledge at all of one half of it. Because only knowing about one side (and only getting one side’s POV) is going to make the whole thing less compelling.

    Also I can’t see Marvel giving any other A-lister to a string of like five writers who don’t even know the archetype she’s supposed to fill and have never read a comic she played a major role in.

  14. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevlon View Post
    This is a better post than the one I wrote
    Thanks a lot

    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    This is the same Jean Grey that neutralized symbiote god, Knull when everyone else seemed ineffective towards him





    But doesnt all his power come from when a person is sleeping? He affects the person on the Astral plane which is Jean's playground. What could he have realistically have done to her?

    And as far as this fear that she can take on 99% of the X-men's problems is a gross exaggeration. This was one issue against a mental threat. Her TP was useless in the first issue when that creature had TP resistance and Jean's role amounted to delegating orders and shielding the civilians. The entire team combined their powers to beat the threat. In #2, she used her powers to get intel to inform Sunfire, how he could beat the threat. She didnt really do anything in #3 besides project a TP image and TK shield herself when attacked. Duggan isnt about to have her oneshot the enemies from here on out.
    That is her best modern TP feat I think , so good.

    EDIT:Since someone else already pointed it she didn't "neutralize" him, she got some info and was dazed and overwhelmed and Knull wasn't even damaged.I still think it's her best/one of the best feats since who Knull is but Knull hasn't shown any resistance to Psychic attacks IIRC.

    He has magic, as in reality warping levels of magic.He didn't even use it here.
    https://comicvine.gamespot.com/night...mp-ve-2037074/

    I should note some of the feats in that RT are when he is in his realm where he is much stronger.

    Exactly my point:-You're telling me she can be effective in using TP against Knull and casually own Nightmare in TP and yet can't take a random creature down w/ it.I know he's not going to do that, my question is how do you justify it.Again they can use excuses against characters that aren't well established but most of X-men's enemies of Earth and many of the space ones should be fodder to her.
    Last edited by Spiderfan001; 10-14-2021 at 09:32 AM.

  15. #255
    Ultimate Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Persephone View Post
    As a Laura fan I would be way more on board with this relationship if it had been handled better. If there had been an eXiles series about the Vault team and there was more depth to the relationship than three panels and some narration from another character I might be on board and even very interested in seeing if she wants the memories or not. Even without that a skilled writer could weave in her long-standing issues of souls and identity into a discussion of whether Vault Laura was her and if she wants the memories back or not. I could see an argument either way that would be in character for her. Or if what we got was a relationship built up after the Vault where Synch was more interested in bonding with current Laura than giving her his memories. Or if there was any acknowledgment that giving her those memories wouldnít bring the woman he loved back or even guarantee Laura would love him. So many interesting things you could do with this.

    But we didnít get those arcs. Instead we got a tell-not-show relationship between two characters who hadnít even interacted before (or been alive and in comics at the same time lol). And Laura hasnít really been written in character since Uncanny X-Men began. This just feels like lazy writing. Iím glad Synch fans get him having a real arc after actual decades, and I donít think that would be possible without tying him to an A-lister. I just wish this romance was written by someone with any knowledge at all of one half of it. Because only knowing about one side (and only getting one sideís POV) is going to make the whole thing less compelling.

    Also I canít see Marvel giving any other A-lister to a string of like five writers who donít even know the archetype sheís supposed to fill and have never read a comic she played a major role in.
    Perhaps that's yet to come, as these two characters move closer to addressing their "lost time" spent in the Vault.

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