X-MEN #4 Reviews/Spoilers Thread

[jwatson]

Very off topic and this might surprise some but if we ever see the world virus storm again i pray its in xmen. I feel it would be a waste to have her/it appear in sword and it would be the kind of villain this book could truly show everyone off against.

[Ambaryerno]

What do you think about the theory that Vault Laura is still alive and will reemerge all ultra-upgraded?
UnVault Laura would surely fight to keep her place as the real one.

Honestly, because of how it started the entire Vault storyline is just toxic to me and I'm ready for it to be scraped into the wastebin of continuity along with all the other chaff. Hopefully Krakoa in general will eventually be joining it there, never to be mentioned again.

[butterflykyss]

I think Duggan said exactly what the omega spec sheet calls out. Jean is an omega level telepath and telekinetic not Jean is omega level telepath and omega level telekinetic. there is a difference.

[jwatson]

I think Duggan said exactly what the omega spec sheet calls out. Jean is an omega level telepath and telekinetic not Jean is omega level telepath and omega level telekinetic. there is a difference.

In english grammar he was saying that she is both. Theres not much room around that especially since there was no "a" in front of telekinetic and no comma seperating the two implying they are combined. Its a lot harder to make the argument against than for in this case when if he wanted clarity he could have simply said. "I am an omega level telepath, telekinetic." You could still make the argument in that case she is both but it is a lot easier to say giving the definition the intent was to seperate the two but the clearest way to do so would have been. " I am an omega level telepath and a telekinetic." So unless clarified i'm going with she the first omega to defy the list.

[Marvelman]

I found certain details about this issue confusing. Jean was never the host for the Phoenix. The Phoenix created a copy of Jean while the real Jean healed in a cocoon beneath Hudson Bay. So, if this Jean is the original Jean then why would she feel guilt over what Phoenix did and why would she refer to herself as the Phoenix host? Have I misunderstood something?

[jwatson]

I found certain details about this issue confusing. Jean was never the host for the Phoenix. The Phoenix created a copy of Jean while the real Jean healed in a cocoon beneath Hudson Bay. So, if this Jean is the original Jean then why would she feel guilt over what Phoenix did and why would she refer to herself as the Phoenix host? Have I misunderstood something?

We have also seen duplicates can get memories from others like when quentin was getting them in x-force which shows in a way phoenix was a diplicate of jean but maddie was not.

[Havok83]

I found certain details about this issue confusing. Jean was never the host for the Phoenix. The Phoenix created a copy of Jean while the real Jean healed in a cocoon beneath Hudson Bay. So, if this Jean is the original Jean then why would she feel guilt over what Phoenix did and why would she refer to herself as the Phoenix host? Have I misunderstood something?

???? Jean was a Phoenix host. Jean has always expressed guilt and remorse for DPS

[butterflykyss]

In english grammar he was saying that she is both. Theres not much room around that especially since there was no "a" in front of telekinetic and no comma seperating the two implying they are combined. Its a lot harder to make the argument against than for in this case when if he wanted clarity he could have simply said. "I am an omega level telepath, telekinetic." You could still make the argument in that case she is both but it is a lot easier to say giving the definition the intent was to seperate the two but the clearest way to do so would have been. " I am an omega level telepath and a telekinetic." So unless clarified i'm going with she the first omega to defy the list.

yea I dont at all think Duggan was looking to contradict the current and official list made by Hickman. the modifier is on telepath not telekinetic and that aligns to the official list but if you believe otherwise have at it.

[Subliminally]

I liked the issue for what it was meant to be, a filler.

Jean kicked all kinds of telepathic ass and shut Nightmare down hard and that "I will end you" *chef's kiss*. How do you come into the home of the most powerful telepath on the planet and think you're just going to f**k around in her mind and NOT get caught?! That's a special kind of stupid, lol.

As for whether Jean is both an OL telepath and TK, I mean does it matter? We know in planet sized she shot the growing space station to Magneto at like Mach 10 using her TK and that's including everything else she can do with her TK from the micro to the macro. Jean is already the Goddess of telepaths so why not just finish the crown? *Besides who here is Team Exodus*. I mean, umm, yay Mutant kinship.

Edit: And I love how Jean-Emma was like "Please get rid of this Hefty trash bag you call a costume! It ain't you, sis."

[butterflykyss]

I found certain details about this issue confusing. Jean was never the host for the Phoenix. The Phoenix created a copy of Jean while the real Jean healed in a cocoon beneath Hudson Bay. So, if this Jean is the original Jean then why would she feel guilt over what Phoenix did and why would she refer to herself as the Phoenix host? Have I misunderstood something?

its due to the many retcons that even the writers cannot keep up. I think the general consensus is that Jean was the host and went dark , and the actions of dark phoenix are those of jean. which is why those nightmares of genocide still haunt her.

[jwatson]

yea I dont at all think Duggan was looking to contradict the current and official list made by Hickman. the modifier is on telepath not telekinetic and that aligns to the official list but if you believe otherwise have at it.

Its sort of like storm saying "i am an omega level mutant and more." The implication is she is an omega mutant AND more than that. But the implication is whatever the more is, is more than omega level mutant which is why it was followed up by the less, being the regent of arrako. But yes, to each their own.

[RamaBird]

its due to the many retcons that even the writers cannot keep up. I think the general consensus is that Jean was the host and went dark , and the actions of dark phoenix are those of jean. which is why those nightmares of genocide still haunt her.

Also, depends on which retcon people liked the most, lol. I've noticed that Jean fans seems split on that too. So it's kind of a pointless argument.

With that said, I like her bearing some responsibility so I like how this issue handled it.

[Reiko]

Honestly, because of how it started the entire Vault storyline is just toxic to me and I'm ready for it to be scraped into the wastebin of continuity along with all the other chaff. Hopefully Krakoa in general will eventually be joining it there, never to be mentioned again.

blasphemy.

[Starchilde]

I have a question regarding Scott. In that part of his nightmare where he is with Mags and Xavier and Scott says "this happened because I lied", do you think it is foreshadowing to something? or it's just Scott's insecurities?

[Mercury]

I will write more and respond to some replies later, after I finish some work, but I wanted to point out the following panels for context, which include a sentiment that has been echoed in other comics.

Jean accepting that she acted as “a vessel for death” doesn’t negate the fact that, in the end, it was a clone imbued with a fragment of her psyche, using an exact copy of her “brainwaves,” but thrust into situations, which involved mind control and falsified “realities” and memories - situations Jean had never been subjected to - that was responsible for the “sins” of Dark Phoenix. It’s also important to note: We’ve seen how another Jean clone imbued with and animated by the same exact fragment, and also subjected to mind-control and falsified memories, would act.

In the past, Jean has taken responsibility and faulted herself for the actions of both Dark Phoenix and Madelyne Pryor. Being the empath that she is, coupled with the fact that both clones were literally made “from her,” it’s understandable why she feels this way. On some level, she will always blame herself for the actions of Dark Phoenix. In part, this is why I love her: She isn’t afraid to acknowledge when she’s has been a part of or done something wrong. Note, however, that she does not refute what T’Challa says here. She only makes clear that a part of her was connected to Dark Phoenix, i.e., “a part of it,” which, of course, is true.