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  1. #76
    Fantastic Member cable guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolverine12 View Post
    I'm going to catch some heat for this, but I think the best of Percy's X-Force so far has been better than the best of S.W.O.R.D. The first arc was great imho. S.W.O.R.D has been good the whole run, but X-Force reached greater heights.
    I know what your saying and I agree. At one point I thought this was the best X book. Not for long and certainly Not anymore.

  2. #77
    Grizzled Veteran Jackraow21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rev9 View Post
    Which issues of X-Force or approximately what year?
    It was in the Dennis Hopeless/Salvador Larocca ‘Cable & X-Force’ series awhile back…


  3. #78
    Mighty Member pkingdom's Avatar
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    I'm in the minority that I loved the way Wolverine was used post Schism. I like it when he tries to lead and actually try to change as a person. So current Wolverine feels like a giant step back and undoing all of his character development. Just go right on back to angry attack dog that follows orders with a slight huff but no real complaints. It bums me out

  4. #79
    Extraordinary Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    Has Wolverine’s book ever felt particularly “important” to the X-line, though? Other than during some crossover event that is. I don’t think that’s really its raison d’etre, rather it is to give Logan some breathing room for his solo adventures which may be safely ignored by anyone who is not a fan of the character. Some of my favorite runs of Wolverine both put the character through the ringer (“thrashed him like a punch bag” as you put it) and weren’t really all that important to anything else going on in the X-books at the time. But they were awesome nonetheless… perhaps better because of it IMO.

    In particular I think back to the post Fatal Attractions issues from about Wolverine #76-90… damn that was a fun run! Logan with his healing factor burned out, no adamantium (bone claws) against Lady Deathstrike, Bloodscream and Cylla, Cyber, the Hand, the Hunter in Darkness, Maverick, Deadpool and Kane/Weapon X and finally that epic showdown with Creed in the X-mansion in Wolverine #90… good times.
    There was also "The Twelve" storyline when we discovered that Logan was remplaced by an Skrull, became Death and recovered his adamantium. But overall, yes Logan tends lurk in his own corner most of the time.

    Percy run is fine, althougth it somehows reminds me to the good and bad parts of Aaron's run, so i kind of nervous about the future.
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  5. #80
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    You know, Krakoa era was meant to be a change to the status quo. Heroes mired with villainous pasts were meant to get a clean break; outright villains a chance to prove themselves different.

    But for Piotr, they've done nothing but character assassinate him in the exact same way he'd been used decades ago. X villain takes control of Piotr to make him perform Y crime that he then suffers on about for Z months and issues later.

    Complete with a throw-away love interest who was made offscreen, met offscreen, and only briefly shown as a figure of importance for Piotr prior to her abrupt demise. Complete with a Telepath going through his head and somehow not seeing how irregular his actions have been or otherwise having any clue of what's going on.

    If this is Percy giving Colossus an "important story" then I'd rather he just not bother. Because if you can't make Colossus' subterfuge engaging, the moment you reveal the sabotage has no impact. No one has cared what Piotr has been doing because no one has known what he's been doing, and now that we know, it doesn't matter because he's not personally responsible and we never saw any of the conflict he might have had while doing it. The reader had no stakes, the character had no agency, and the death had no meaning.

    This arc has been a great example of how to not write a comicbook story. More power to those that do like it, but I am looking forward to this book being cancelled in favor of a new writer with better ideas on how to handle X-force in the Krakoa era. "Black Tom Ant Man's a disease in Beast" is not a compelling story for X-force to me, and neither is this nonsense Russian mutant stuff.

  6. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    There was also "The Twelve" storyline when we discovered that Logan was remplaced by an Skrull, became Death and recovered his adamantium. But overall, yes Logan tends lurk in his own corner most of the time.

    Percy run is fine, althougth it somehows reminds me to the good and bad parts of Aaron's run, so i kind of nervous about the future.
    Um there are croosovers like AOA, Old Man Logan unlocking various universes where he has played his part. New X-Men had a huge implication of Weapon X plus even though it didnt have any many appearances for Wolverine. There is also HoX/PoX, Eve of Destruction etc. But there are bad ones too. Either way i still think there should be some relative important content with Krakoa for Logan rather than just doing their dirty jobs.
    Keep Your Society. Take It With You To The Grave.

  7. #82
    Extraordinary Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vishop View Post
    Um there are croosovers like AOA, Old Man Logan unlocking various universes where he has played his part. New X-Men had a huge implication of Weapon X plus even though it didnt have any many appearances for Wolverine. There is also HoX/PoX, Eve of Destruction etc. But there are bad ones too. Either way i still think there should be some relative important content with Krakoa for Logan rather than just doing their dirty jobs.
    The status quo around the X-Men affect Logan yes, it kind of has to because he is one, it would be weird otherwise, but he doesn't tend to be a big player in any of those stories, they might be reveals or retcons that affect his book, like when it was retconned that Logan was actually deployed on missions during his time in Weapon X, but he tends to deal with that kind of stuff in his own corner, is rarely something that affects the wider mutant universe, he is at the end of the day a supporting characther in the X-Men narrative.
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  8. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    The status quo around the X-Men affect Logan yes, it kind of has to because he is one, it would be weird otherwise, but he doesn't tend to be a big player in any of those stories, they might be reveals or retcons that affect his book, like when it was retconned that Logan was actually deployed on missions during his time in Weapon X, but he tends to deal with that kind of stuff in his own corner, is rarely something that affects the wider mutant universe, he is at the end of the day a supporting characther in the X-Men narrative.
    Look the point is that there should be some moral ambiguity when he is doing their dirty jobs. Logan distrusts Krakoa but I haven't seen any action behind this. There are events Logan played big, either in the House of M or during Messiah Complex/War. Powers of X had a huge role for Logan, he and Moira were only survivors after 1000 years. Logan also led a team after Storm during Claremont's run.
    Keep Your Society. Take It With You To The Grave.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anchorsify View Post
    You know, Krakoa era was meant to be a change to the status quo. Heroes mired with villainous pasts were meant to get a clean break; outright villains a chance to prove themselves different.

    But for Piotr, they've done nothing but character assassinate him in the exact same way he'd been used decades ago. X villain takes control of Piotr to make him perform Y crime that he then suffers on about for Z months and issues later.

    Complete with a throw-away love interest who was made offscreen, met offscreen, and only briefly shown as a figure of importance for Piotr prior to her abrupt demise. Complete with a Telepath going through his head and somehow not seeing how irregular his actions have been or otherwise having any clue of what's going on.

    If this is Percy giving Colossus an "important story" then I'd rather he just not bother. Because if you can't make Colossus' subterfuge engaging, the moment you reveal the sabotage has no impact. No one has cared what Piotr has been doing because no one has known what he's been doing, and now that we know, it doesn't matter because he's not personally responsible and we never saw any of the conflict he might have had while doing it. The reader had no stakes, the character had no agency, and the death had no meaning.

    This arc has been a great example of how to not write a comicbook story. More power to those that do like it, but I am looking forward to this book being cancelled in favor of a new writer with better ideas on how to handle X-force in the Krakoa era. "Black Tom Ant Man's a disease in Beast" is not a compelling story for X-force to me, and neither is this nonsense Russian mutant stuff.
    Post Claremont the only decent Colossus writers I can think of for more than an issue or two have been Gillen and Wood.

    Logan, Kurt, and Piotr are the absolute heart of The X-Men.

  10. #85
    Incredible Member GeneTitan's Avatar
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    I finally read this issue and I'm now dropping X-Force. Colossus has had nothing done with him since HOX/POX. I started reading X-Men at the tail end of "Fall Of The Mutants" and he was such a dope character back then. X-Force now joins Wolverine, Excalibur and X-Corp on my drop list. Poor Kayla, she deserved better.
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  11. #86
    Incredible Member ermac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneTitan View Post
    I finally read this issue and I'm now dropping X-Force. Colossus has had nothing done with him since HOX/POX. I started reading X-Men at the tail end of "Fall Of The Mutants" and he was such a dope character back then. X-Force now joins Wolverine, Excalibur and X-Corp on my drop list. Poor Kayla, she deserved better.
    I just realize I don't have any x-title on my pull list anymore. Since Way of X ended, Hellions is ending soon and I'm done with X-Force and X-Men...

    I want to like it. I want to spend money on comics. But the current state of the X-Line doesn't let me

  12. #87
    The Best There Is Wolverine12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJS View Post
    Post Claremont the only decent Colossus writers I can think of for more than an issue or two have been Gillen and Wood.

    Logan, Kurt, and Piotr are the absolute heart of The X-Men.
    You didn’t like Whedon’s Colossus?
    You brought back Wolverine

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  13. #88
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJS View Post
    Post Claremont the only decent Colossus writers I can think of for more than an issue or two have been Gillen and Wood.

    Logan, Kurt, and Piotr are the absolute heart of The X-Men.
    Rosenberg's Piotr right before the current era was awesome and the direction they should have continued with him. For once, Piotr was actually fun

  14. #89
    The King Fears NO ONE! Triniking1234's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vishop View Post
    I think Duggan has thrashed Wolverine to this era like punchbag. Its pathetic. Percy's first couple issues with him down right bad nostalgia(Wolverine killing Jean). Despite all the some decent issues with Maverick, his run feels so unimportant at this point that him saying about working for the Krakoa is all too much ignorant to care. There was no hype whatsoever.
    Duggan has only written Logan in X of Swords tho.
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  15. #90
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triniking1234 View Post
    Duggan has only written Logan in X of Swords tho.
    thats not true. He wrote him in Cable. The opening scenes had him getting owned in a duel. Logan got defeated in combat by Kid Cable



    Outside of XoS, he wrote Logan in Maruarders.

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