The Flash (2023)

[Bunch of Coconuts]

Keaton's Batman had a rough time though.

Part of the point of the movie is that Keaton’s Batman was supposed to die. It’s not Barry’s fault.

[Jokerz79]

Everyone who was alive before is alive now so ya Everyone pretty much was saved.

Affleck's Batman was erased from history and replaced if Barry was in his original timeline but altered at the end.

[Bunch of Coconuts]

Affleck's Batman was erased from history and replaced if Barry was in his original timeline but altered at the end.

See, that internal logic there is what kept me from absolutely loving this film.

I get that it also somewhat follows the comics, in that Flash saving his mother caused Bruce to be shot instead of his parents, Kal El was captured, etc. But I’m not a big fan of Flashpoint anyway.

[choptop]

Affleck's Batman was erased from history and replaced if Barry was in his original timeline but altered at the end.

He wasn't erased he was altered there's a difference he is still the same person BvS still happened JL still happened but different? That's what happens when you F with time it's no different than what happened to superman after COIE he's history was different he wasn't as powerful etc or spiderman after OMD he was the same person but things were different different history the big difference is the batman moves happened in the DCEU before BvS.

[Jokerz79]

He wasn't erased he was altered there's a difference he is still the same person BvS still happened JL still happened but different? That's what happens when you F with time it's no different than what happened to superman after COIE he's history was different he wasn't as powerful etc or spiderman after OMD he was the same person but things were different different history the big difference is the batman moves happened in the DCEU before BvS.

I don't know if you watched the Battlestar Galactica Reboot but there was a lead character named William "Bill" Adama. They did a short-lived Prequel series that lasted one season called Caprica in it two of the main characters were Joseph Adama Bill's father and his son William "Willie" Adama. Throughout the series we're led to believe that Willie is Bill and his family just called him Willie as a kid until the end of the show where we learn Willie was killed as a child and Bill is actually Willie's younger brother born after his death and named in his honor. Same Dad and same Name not the same character.

Clooney has eleven years on Affleck meaning it wasn't the same sperm and egg that met to create the Bruce Wayne at the end of Flash hell this new version of Thomas and Martha who were his parents would have been dead before Affleck's Bruce was even conceived given, they usually die before Bruce is ten. Meaning while having the same parents and same name they're not the same person more like brothers and so yes Affleck's Bruce was erased and replaced with a new Bruce Wayne.

[choptop]

I don't know if you watched the Battlestar Galactica Reboot but there was a lead character named William "Bill" Adama. They did a short-lived Prequel series that lasted one season called Caprica in it two of the main characters were Joseph Adama Bill's father and his son William "Willie" Adama. Throughout the series we're led to believe that Willie is Bill and his family just called him Willie as a kid until the end of the show where we learn Willie was killed as a child and Bill is actually Willie's younger brother born after his death and named in his honor. Same Dad and same Name not the same character.

Clooney has eleven years on Affleck meaning it wasn't the same sperm and egg that met to create the Bruce Wayne at the end of Flash hell this new version of Thomas and Martha who were his parents would have been dead before Affleck's Bruce was even conceived given, they usually die before Bruce is ten. Meaning while having the same parents and same name they're not the same person more like brothers and so yes Affleck's Bruce was erased and replaced with a new Bruce Wayne.

No he is the same person he was just born earlier( so were he's mom and dad) and looks different has a different history he was altered it happens in comics all the time every thing is different because the magic of fing up the timeline no one was erased.

[HollowSage]

No he is the same person he was just born earlier( so were he's mom and dad) and looks different has a different history he was altered it happens in comics all the time every thing is different because the magic of fing up the timeline no one was erased.

This could be read as serious or sarcasm. It’s kinda hard to tell.

He’s the same person, but born earlier.
He’s the same person, but has a different history.
He’s the same person, but looks different.

If all that has changed then what proves it’s the same person?

[Jokerz79]

No he is the same person he was just born earlier( so were he's mom and dad) and looks different has a different history he was altered it happens in comics all the time every thing is different because the magic of fing up the timeline no one was erased.

I'm the product of a summer fling so if a time traveler went back in time and intervened so my parents met one year earlier, and they had a son one year to the day I was born in the new timeline and named this boy my name and he lived a life almost a copy of mine just everything happened one year earlier he wouldn't be me and I would cease to exist erased from the timeline replaced with him.

In OMD the events of Peter's life were changed not Peter himself in Flash the events roughly stayed the same, but Bruce was changed into a new Bruce who isn't the former Bruce. Because they were conceived at different times, they aren't genetically identical much like brothers, they lived similar lives but also different so they're lives are different these men have the same name but aren't the same man no more than Keaton's Batman was the same as Affleck's Batman. Affleck, Keaton, and Clooney are all Batman and all Bruce, but it doesn't mean they're the same man.

[Scott Taylor]

It can't really be explained and I think Clooney was just done as a joke with no thought behind it because - "who cares, the DCEU is dead." What if the Avengers came back from retrieving the stones to find that Nick Fury was now being played by David Hasselhoff? Its like that, just goofiness.

Personally I look at it the same way as Cassie Lang and James Rhodes changing actors. Barry's reaction was just a fourth wall break done for the audience, same as the subtle one at the court scene in Iron Man 2.

[Powerboy]

This could be read as serious or sarcasm. It’s kinda hard to tell.

He’s the same person, but born earlier.
He’s the same person, but has a different history.
He’s the same person, but looks different.

If all that has changed then what proves it’s the same person?

He's the same except for being different in countless ways.

For the record, I don't know anybody who thinks of the Post-Crisis Superman or Batman or Wonder Woman, as being the same character at all. They are no more thought of as being the same character than the Golden Age Superman is thought of as being the same character as the Silver Age Superman.

Post-Crisis Batman comes a little closer since it's essentially the same origin. But he's a far different character with far different attitudes and relationships to other characters than his predecessor of the Bronze Age. Wonder Woman has her whole history ripped out from under her while Superman is a very different character who thinks of himself as a human named Clark Kent instead of a Kryptonian for whom Clark Kent is a disguise. Post-Crisis Superman is very underconfident while Pre-Crisis Superman has confidence.

With the three DCEU Batmen, they have very different personalities and don't even look the same. Whether they are or are not intended to be the same Batman is sort of a moot point because they ain't and this thread has introduced me to the first person who thinks they are. It's vague enough that nobody can seriously say anybody else is wrong but I sure don't see many people taking them as being the same person. They seem to be the results of reality alterations. Even that is not consistent. For instance, it seems the reality of Keaton Batman already existed since the change Barry made was well after the events of the old Batman movies. It's just handwaving magic incantations and gestures, play no attention to the fact that none of this equals out to rational sense, just keep watching the moving hands.

[Jokerz79]

He's the same except for being different in countless ways.

For the record, I don't know anybody who thinks of the Post-Crisis Superman or Batman or Wonder Woman, as being the same character at all. They are no more thought of as being the same character than the Golden Age Superman is thought of as being the same character as the Silver Age Superman.

Post-Crisis Batman comes a little closer since it's essentially the same origin. But he's a far different character with far different attitudes and relationships to other characters than his predecessor of the Bronze Age. Wonder Woman has her whole history ripped out from under her while Superman is a very different character who thinks of himself as a human named Clark Kent instead of a Kryptonian for whom Clark Kent is a disguise. Post-Crisis Superman is very underconfident while Pre-Crisis Superman has confidence.

With the three DCEU Batmen, they have very different personalities and don't even look the same. Whether they are or are not intended to be the same Batman is sort of a moot point because they ain't and this thread has introduced me to the first person who thinks they are. It's vague enough that nobody can seriously say anybody else is wrong but I sure don't see many people taking them as being the same person. They seem to be the results of reality alterations. Even that is not consistent. For instance, it seems the reality of Keaton Batman already existed since the change Barry made was well after the events of the old Batman movies. It's just handwaving magic incantations and gestures, play no attention to the fact that none of this equals out to rational sense, just keep watching the moving hands.

I know in COIE they tried to say "New Earth" was essentially Earth-1 with added elements from the other lost Earth's but once they started the books it was impossible for me to think of them as the same.

Even Bats had a big change to his origin that all on screen versions adhere to and that's Alfred raising Bruce. Pre-Crisis both Earth-1 and Earth-2 Bruce's were raised by their uncle Phillip Wayne with Alfred entering their lives after becoming Batman.

[Powerboy]

I know in COIE they tried to say "New Earth" was essentially Earth-1 with added elements from the other lost Earth's but once they started the books it was impossible for me to think of them as the same.

Even Bats had a big change to his origin that all on screen versions adhere to and that's Alfred raising Bruce. Pre-Crisis both Earth-1 and Earth-2 Bruce's were raised by their uncle Phillip Wayne with Alfred entering their lives after becoming Batman.

I had forgotten that, which shows how new things can become part of the mythology.

I remember when Byrne decided to take elements that originated in Superman (1978) and make them part of the comic, like AI Jor-El and the S being the sign of House El., which has now been adopted by every screen version of Superman, as opposed to, it's an S for Superman. It will be interesting to see what Gunn's movie does.

[choptop]

This could be read as serious or sarcasm. It’s kinda hard to tell.

He’s the same person, but born earlier.
He’s the same person, but has a different history.
He’s the same person, but looks different.

If all that has changed then what proves it’s the same person?

I don't mean he is literally the same person I mean it is the same person recreated the same enggey say I have the Reality Stone I changed everything about you you mind history everything your not erased you are altered.

[choptop]

I'm the product of a summer fling so if a time traveler went back in time and intervened so my parents met one year earlier, and they had a son one year to the day I was born in the new timeline and named this boy my name and he lived a life almost a copy of mine just everything happened one year earlier he wouldn't be me and I would cease to exist erased from the timeline replaced with him.

In OMD the events of Peter's life were changed not Peter himself in Flash the events roughly stayed the same, but Bruce was changed into a new Bruce who isn't the former Bruce. Because they were conceived at different times, they aren't genetically identical much like brothers, they lived similar lives but also different so they're lives are different these men have the same name but aren't the same man no more than Keaton's Batman was the same as Affleck's Batman. Affleck, Keaton, and Clooney are all Batman and all Bruce, but it doesn't mean they're the same man.

I guess it's all in the way you look at it to me was altered recreated with a new history not erased it doesn't make sense but with time travel it does it ever?

[Scott Taylor]

I had forgotten that, which shows how new things can become part of the mythology.

I remember when Byrne decided to take elements that originated in Superman (1978) and make them part of the comic, like AI Jor-El and the S being the sign of House El., which has now been adopted by every screen version of Superman, as opposed to, it's an S for Superman. It will be interesting to see what Gunn's movie does.

Well I really hope they get away from that and just leave the S vague. Then it can just be an S that stands for Superman for all of us ignorant tomato-heads that don't need some kind of mysterious extra meaning!