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  1. #61
    Dirt Wizard Goggindowner's Avatar
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    This guy's real issue isn't his book or lacking an audience for his book. The problem is the way in which is decided to distribute it. I understand that he is looking to make a living off of monthly sales, but that was NEVER a realistic expectation to go into a venture such as this with.

    While I understand that he believes monthlies are going to be his bread and butter, at this stage in his game he really needs to be focusing on selling the trades. His audience is out there, but they aren't weekly comic shop customers. They are the set that pops into a shop every so often and checks out the trades, or browses online for trades. Cape comics are what sell monthly. Anything else is going to struggle without having an established talent attached to it.
    I co-host a podcast about comics. Mostly it's X-Men comics of the 90's.

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  2. #62

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    This makes wonder why DC and Marvel depend on monthly sales for minority and non-superhero comics.

  3. #63
    Dirt Wizard Goggindowner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    This makes wonder why DC and Marvel depend on monthly sales for minority and non-superhero comics.
    They don't. At least not as a means to keep the revenue generated. They publish those types of books and get what they can in sales, take up wall space in the LCS, and rely on their bread and butter to make money. Then, usually, those minority and non-superhero books are cancelled or rebooted/relaunched within twenty four issues.
    I co-host a podcast about comics. Mostly it's X-Men comics of the 90's.

    Billy and Dan Read Comics!

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post


    Well I'm not into Dexter or Punisher but that does bring up a point, maybe he should buy targeted ads on Facebook for people who "like" either of those.
    His primary income is a $750 a month Social Security Disability check, and Facebook ads are expensive. He'd starve to death before he saw any difference.

    Another big problem with Facebook ads is that Facebook is crammed with fake accounts set up for like farming and other shady practices. Facebook will happily send your paid for boosted posts and ads to these nonexistent people, so there's an enormous amount of waste in any Facebook ad buy.
    Last edited by Shawn Hopkins; 08-30-2014 at 07:42 AM.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goggindowner View Post
    They don't. At least not as a means to keep the revenue generated. They publish those types of books and get what they can in sales, take up wall space in the LCS, and rely on their bread and butter to make money. Then, usually, those minority and non-superhero books are cancelled or rebooted/relaunched within twenty four issues.
    But this does very little to help those properties themselves.

    And unlike other characters, it's very difficult for them to get second chances.

  6. #66
    Dirt Wizard Goggindowner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    But this does very little to help those properties themselves.

    And unlike other characters, it's very difficult for them to get second chances.
    All the Big Two really have to do is keep the property in rotation. You make the assumption that publishers publish comics with creative integrity at the forefront of their decision making, which is wrong. Shelf space, market share, and money are they care about, which is why there are so many Spiderman and Avengers books, and no Fantastic Four book. They invest in their tent pole properties which make enough money to allow them to produce the stuff that isn't as popular.
    I co-host a podcast about comics. Mostly it's X-Men comics of the 90's.

    Billy and Dan Read Comics!

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    This makes wonder why DC and Marvel depend on monthly sales for minority and non-superhero comics.
    Regarding Marvel, what non superhero comic?

  8. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goggindowner View Post
    All the Big Two really have to do is keep the property in rotation. You make the assumption that publishers publish comics with creative integrity at the forefront of their decision making, which is wrong. Shelf space, market share, and money are they care about, which is why there are so many Spiderman and Avengers books, and no Fantastic Four book. They invest in their tent pole properties which make enough money to allow them to produce the stuff that isn't as popular.
    So how do they expand both their market demographics and their readership base?

    Quote Originally Posted by dupont2005 View Post
    Regarding Marvel, what non superhero comic?
    I meant the Big 2, both in general and historically.

    Examples would include the non-superhero parts of the Marvel Next and the Tsunami lines, plus the CrossGen reboot, which all which tanked. Earlier than that, you had stuff like Razorline and the New Universe line.

  9. #69
    Incredible Member Kees_L's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    This makes wonder why DC and Marvel depend on monthly sales for minority and non-superhero comics.
    Quote Originally Posted by Goggindowner View Post
    They don't. At least not as a means to keep the revenue generated. They publish those types of books and get what they can in sales, take up wall space in the LCS, and rely on their bread and butter to make money. Then, usually, those minority and non-superhero books are cancelled or rebooted/relaunched within twenty four issues.
    Exactly what Goggindowner says.

    Any profession will primarily be to generate income. Working from whatever passion for a profession must adapt unto some kind of market or business model, so any publisher will do such too, both 'indy' or 'mainstream' or whatever kind.

    There is no industry onto *helping* comics or passions or whatever evolve, but only industry. There is only publishing, in the ways as proving viable or not, as based on itself.

    There are no comics or publishers as being *boss* or as being *right* necessarily at all.
    And there certainly are no fans invested in comics or as helping publishing or as helping comics. Or only as being what fans or consumers they would actually be.
    Last edited by Kees_L; 08-30-2014 at 10:52 AM.
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  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kees_L View Post
    Exactly what Goggindowner says.

    Any profession will primarily be to generate income. Working from whatever passion for a profession must adapt unto some kind of market or business model, so any publisher will do such too, both 'indy' or 'mainstream' or whatever kind.

    There is no industry onto *helping* comics or passions or whatever evolve, but only industry. There is only publishing, in the ways as proving viable or not, as based on itself.

    There are no comics or publishers as being *boss* or as being *right* necessarily at all.
    And there certainly are no fans invested in comics or as helping publishing or as helping comics. Or only as being what fans or consumers they would actually be.
    So again...

    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    So how do they expand both their market demographics and their readership base?

  11. #71
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    I hope that whatever happens he sticks in there. Maybe this project isn't the one that hits it big, but it might give him enough recognition that his next one does.

  12. #72
    Incredible Member Kees_L's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    So how do they expand both their market demographics and their readership base?
    What a creator or artist needs to do is keep on sluggin', keep on creating, as amassing stuff both as experience, onto creating new or more opportunity.

    Without dwelling on the past too much, without dwelling on whatever too much.

    Your questions of markets and expansion seem too fixated even if well meant. No professional and not anybody awaits perfect validity or perfect sense prior to whatever they would do - or they'll be fixated. Becoming static like glue or weighed down. Definitely, or risk and personality and passion couldn't be to exist. Or either stubbornness and being wrong wouldn't exist. And all that will exist, surely. For everyone.

    Any knowing better will just be something to happen when it would. Which wouldn't necessarily help any other or more being wrong from being possible just the same.
    Any *knowing all just perfectly* is not anything belonging to our modes of operation, as we'd best focus on what would need our focus the most.
    Since everything to happen won't necessarily evolve only around our own selves or our expectations, the world won't move according to only our strategies or inclinations, but instead all that happens completely the other way around.

    That's why all and everyone being succesful or genius or excelling at whatever always says (or should): "hey it happened, despite me more rather than (only) because of me".
    Last edited by Kees_L; 08-30-2014 at 12:20 PM.
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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    So how do they expand both their market demographics and their readership base?



    I meant the Big 2, both in general and historically.

    Examples would include the non-superhero parts of the Marvel Next and the Tsunami lines, plus the CrossGen reboot, which all which tanked. Earlier than that, you had stuff like Razorline and the New Universe line.
    Oh, you consider Avengers and X-23 to be non superhero titles. Okay.
    Crossgen was pretty much super heroes too. Just not the star spangled spandex wearing ones with a trademarked logo on the chest. They were still 22 page fight comics with super powered musclemen.

  14. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kees_L View Post
    What a creator or artist needs to do is keep on sluggin', keep on creating, as amassing stuff both as experience, onto creating new or more opportunity.

    Without dwelling on the past too much, without dwelling on whatever too much.

    Your questions of markets and expansion seem too fixated even if well meant. No professional and not anybody awaits perfect validity or perfect sense prior to whatever they would do - or they'll be fixated. Becoming static like glue or weighed down. Definitely, or risk and personality and passion couldn't be to exist. Or either stubbornness and being wrong wouldn't exist. And all that will exist, surely. For everyone.

    Any knowing better will just be something to happen when it would. Which wouldn't necessarily help any other or more being wrong from being possible just the same.
    Any *knowing all just perfectly* is not anything belonging to our modes of operation, as we'd best focus on what would need our focus the most.
    Since everything to happen won't necessarily evolve only around our own selves or our expectations, the world won't move according to only our strategies or inclinations, but instead all that happens completely the other way around.

    That's why all and everyone being succesful or genius or excelling at whatever always says (or should): "hey it happened, despite me more rather than (only) because of me".
    I was referring to the Big 2, not the individual creators.

    Their goal is to make money, right?

    How do they that without enlarging their comics-buying base or expanding the potential demographics that would read comics and make various types of books sell instead of select few?

    Quote Originally Posted by dupont2005 View Post
    Oh, you consider Avengers and X-23 to be non superhero titles. Okay.
    Crossgen was pretty much super heroes too. Just not the star spangled spandex wearing ones with a trademarked logo on the chest. They were still 22 page fight comics with super powered musclemen.
    I said "non-superhero."

    I was referring to books in those imprints such as Livewires, Spellbinders, Machine Teen, Saint Sinner, Ruse, Route 666, Kiss Kiss Bang Bang, Nightmask, Sentinel, Mark Hazzard, Ectokid, etc.

    Those weren't superhero titles.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by The S0/\/\@7ic Si/\/\[]Dl370n View Post
    I was referring to the Big 2, not the individual creators.

    Their goal is to make money, right?

    How do they that without enlarging their comics-buying base or expanding the potential demographics that would read comics and make various types of books sell instead of select few?



    I said "non-superhero."

    I was referring to books in those imprints such as Livewires, Spellbinders, Machine Teen, Saint Sinner, Ruse, Route 666, Kiss Kiss Bang Bang, Nightmask, Sentinel, Mark Hazzard, Ectokid, etc.

    Those weren't superhero titles.
    Uh, no, most of them were. Sort of offbeat ones, but totally superheroes. If The Punisher and Ghost Rider are superheroes then most of these have to be considered so as well.

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