X-Men '97: The Animated Series

[PhantomBoom]

I'm not gonna lie.
This is doing way too much just because your favorite wasn't in the show.

[Android 17]

I'm not gonna lie.
This is doing way too much just because your favorite wasn't in the show.

For real, doing the absolute MOST.

I want to see Kwannon/Betsy on but you don't see me going into histrionics.

[Havok83]

It would have been weird for lorna to just show up out of no where when she has never been that major in the series and all of a sudden we are seeing this through her view. Like who would care. Love me some lorna but it would not have had the impact if it was her. JMO.

Is it really any weirder than any of the random cameos we got this episode from Nature Girl to Pixie to Glob Herman? Given that Multiple Man and Val Cooper here and X-Factor (which Lorna is a member of this universe) is a government sanctioned team, it would have made perfect sense for them to be there as official business as liasons to Genosha as it preps to join the UN. I think there was room to fit her in somewhere. Heck even a cameo to acknowledge her and pay homage to her history would have sufficed. I mean they did so with Magik reference in the inferno episode

[Fokken]

Delete post.

I shouldn't be here.

[salarta]

I'm not gonna lie.
This is doing way too much just because your favorite wasn't in the show.

Way to try and spin the problems here as something they're not.

If this was simply about a fave not showing up then you wouldn't see me posting here. Did you see me posting here when the OTHER 4 episodes aired?

The problem is lack of respect for the important role these characters played in the events that this cartoon pretends to adapt. It's taking advantage of the emotional weight of this event without acknowledging and using the characters whose experiences were pivotal in making the event so impactful and important enough to end up on this cartoon in the first place.

[superjosh]

Way to try and spin the problems here as something they're not.

If this was simply about a fave not showing up then you wouldn't see me posting here. Did you see me posting here when the OTHER 4 episodes aired?

The problem is lack of respect for the important role these characters played in the events that this cartoon pretends to adapt. It's taking advantage of the emotional weight of this event without acknowledging and using the characters whose experiences were pivotal in making the event so impactful and important enough to end up on this cartoon in the first place.

Your main argument seems to be fealty to the character, but Lorna wasn't even in the original E for Extinction. The "emotional weight" of her story was added almost two years later.

So obviously we can't all have everything. The series has to pick who they feature. If a favorite isn't featured, your wish would be to not adapt any story at all if they can't be included? That basically means don't adapt any comics ever at all unless its completely chronological and features every character.

[toddcam]

Lorna did not appear in the arc in the comics. I read them back then, and wondered if she were even alive or had been killed off-panel without even an acknowledgement. I believe it was YEARS until we found out what happened to her. To feel this is somehow a slight against the character for not being faithful to the comics because she had no presence is absurd, as the comics didn't care, with actual reason for her to be there as opposed to here, where she is not known to be Magneto's daughter or have any connection to Genosha.

[Havok83]

Lorna did not appear in the arc in the comics. I read them back then, and wondered if she were even alive or had been killed off-panel without even an acknowledgement. I believe it was YEARS until we found out what happened to her. To feel this is somehow a slight against the character for not being faithful to the comics because she had no presence is absurd, as the comics didn't care, with actual reason for her to be there as opposed to here, where she is not known to be Magneto's daughter or have any connection to Genosha.

Your main argument seems to be fealty to the character, but Lorna wasn't even in the original E for Extinction. The "emotional weight" of her story was added almost two years later.

Pixie, Glob, Dazzler, Multiple Man, Boom Bom, Nature Girl, Cable, Madelyne, Rogue, Gambit, Moira, Banshee, Shaw, Nightcrawler, Callisto, etc...werent in the original comic story either. i dont think this is a valid argument. Im not going to die on the same hill as salarta but I dont think their criticism is unwarranted

[Tenebrae]

Our fandom can really be so messy.

The way the internet regularly erupts over the inaccuracies from the printed source material is fully wild. What this show manages to achieve in 30ish minutes of animation -- the humor, the cameos and history winks, the emotional gravitas --- while drawing inspiration from titillating stories we love and already know ---some of us like the back of our hand-- and yet still folks refuse to find the fun.

From episode one, folks across social media bemoaned Roberto's inclusion as the, forgive the pun, new mutant. "Where are the OTHER New Mutants?? Where are Sam and Dani and and?? This isn't how or when he joined!!"
We get these delightfully unexpected appearances of Colossus, Archangel and Psylocke by way of Morph, and the internet devolves into "But now they won't have a storyline!! How can this be???"
Real ones who know get a charming tip of the hat by Illyana's surprise cameo during the Inferno inspired episode and rather than find amusement, people opt to put their lawyer hats on(???) and argue "But how can she even be??? And a teenager?? How can Morph even know her???"

It. Is. Not. That. Serious.

This is not the printed books. This is not "our canon". Practically nothing in this show is accurate to the books its drawing inspiration from. The same can be said for the movies, for the MCU in general, and inevitably for any future big screen depictions.
This is just a cartoon meant to entertain. But folks are gonna gnash their teeth and smash their keyboards. The impulse to wrap one's self in misery while sipping on a cup of hot fury is so bewildering. As if life isn't challenging enough.

This episode was bananas. I cried. That's powerful ****. Bravo, X-Men97. You're doing the most, to say the least.

I'd get this engraved if I could.

[Fokken]

Pixie, Glob, Dazzler, Multiple Man, Boom Bom, Nature Girl, Cable, Madelyne, Rogue, Gambit, Moira, Banshee, Shaw, Callisto, etc...werent in the original comic story either. i dont think this is a valid argument.

And that is the point being made. This story is not THAT story. It is LOOSELY INSPIRED by the events of the book.
Nothing being done in X-Men97 is a copy paste job so why all the angst over inaccuracies and omittances?

[salarta]

If a favorite isn't featured, your wish would be to not adapt any story at all if they can't be included? That basically means don't adapt any comics ever at all unless its completely chronological and features every character.

It would be my wish to not adapt a story if key figures and their experiences are excluded from that story just because people making the adaptation don't give a damn about them.

I wouldn't want an adaptation of LotR if one of the Fellowship nonsensically isn't there because the person making the adaptation doesn't respect them.

Lorna did not appear in the arc in the comics. I read them back then, and wondered if she were even alive or had been killed off-panel without even an acknowledgement. I believe it was YEARS until we found out what happened to her. To feel this is somehow a slight against the character for not being faithful to the comics because she had no presence is absurd, as the comics didn't care, with actual reason for her to be there as opposed to here, where she is not known to be Magneto's daughter or have any connection to Genosha.

She was on Genosha and in the comics before the genocide happened, so we were plenty aware beforehand that she was at least present and had a stake in Genosha. This cartoon refused to do that, which sends the message that they aren't going to acknowledge this part of her history.

We got to see her direct experience of the genocide's aftermath a year later, by the same writer of E for Extinction.

To frame it as "she wasn't there for E for Extinction" and give no other context is obfuscating the issue for the sake of giving the cartoon a pass.

P.S. - Also? They don't even need to acknowledge she's Magneto's daughter here. The comics didn't do it until after the Genoshan genocide, and what I have a huge problem with is this cartoon pretending she wasn't there because their nostalgia for when she was treated poorly tells them to treat her poorly.

[ExodusCloak]

Keep in mind this is the first adaptation of EoE, which is why Salarta does have a point here. Imagine TAS doing the first adaptation of the Dark Phoenix Saga and using Xavier instead of Jean? I think even if you had the same level of Gravitas with the Rogue/Gambit thing you'd still have a lot of people who would be pissed.

[salarta]

And that is the point being made. This story is not THAT story. It is LOOSELY INSPIRED by the events of the book.
Nothing being done in X-Men97 is a copy paste job so why all the angst over inaccuracies and omittances?

Because inaccuracies and omissions get repeated in subsequent adaptations. This is Beau DeMayo and everyone under him giving a big "f you" to these characters and everything about them, and trying to pass his biases off to future adaptations. I'm not putting up with that, and I will fight tooth and nail to preserve this aspect of Lorna despite his apparent hate for everything she is outside the bounds of his nostalgia.

[Fokken]

Keep in mind this is the first adaptation of EoE, which is why Salarta does have a point here. Imagine TAS doing the first adaptation of the Dark Phoenix Saga and using Xavier instead of Jean?

But baby they did do Dark Phoenix and several characters were swapped in and swapped out. Was that a disrespectful travesty?
Not for the 90's kids enraptured by the action space opera we all hungrily devoured. Its when we hit adulthood that we somehow get this bizarre delusion of ownership over these stories and characters. Passion is beautiful but when passion becomes fanatical well maybe that passion should have a sandwich.

[superjosh]

Pixie, Glob, Dazzler, Multiple Man, Boom Bom, Nature Girl, Cable, Madelyne, Rogue, Gambit, Moira, Banshee, Shaw, Nightcrawler, Callisto, etc...werent in the original comic story either. i dont think this is a valid argument. Im not going to die on the same hill as salarta but I dont think their criticism is unwarranted

That's a bastardization of my argument. I was pointing out a flaw in salarta's iron-clad opinion that Lorna should be in 97's version of Extinction because she wasn't even in the original.

I'm totally fine with making changes to comic stories, and the original '92 series did this all the time, mixing in modern elements with classic stories. If Lorna was in it and it made sense I would have been fine with it.