View Poll Results: Should the Michelle Jones character be brought into Marvel Comics?

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  • Supporting character for Peter Parker

    11 24.44%
  • Supporting character for Miles Morales

    18 40.00%
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    8 17.78%
  • Supporting character for Gwen Stacy

    8 17.78%
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  1. #136
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    And in case you forgot, Spider-Man comics already had a love interest named "Michele".

    https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Miche...es_(Earth-616)
    We could always have Michelle being adapted by combining her with 616 Michelle, and have her go by "MG" .

  2. #137
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortex85 View Post
    I think MCU MJ's main appeal is that she is Zendaya. LOL
    Pretty much.

    On the other hand, that can be something worth bringing to the comics.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Kid View Post
    I doubt it because MCU MJ is basically what it says. She's the MCU interpretation of Mary Jane so I don't expect to see her in the comics because she basically already is
    What does Zendaya's MJ have in common with the 616 Mary Jane that she does not have in common with other characters from the comics?
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  3. #138
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Pretty much.

    On the other hand, that can be something worth bringing to the comics.
    When has something like that ever worked?

  4. #139
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Pretty much.

    On the other hand, that can be something worth bringing to the comics.
    I don't think anyone really cares about a character that looks like Zendaya being in the comics versus, say, the actual Zendaya in something.
    What does Zendaya's MJ have in common with the 616 Mary Jane that she does not have in common with other characters from the comics?
    A public persona to hide her inner vulnerabilities that she only really lets go to the one she loves?

  5. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    A father and son sharing a name is not the least bit strange. A character sharing an ancestor's name is also not actually strange.

    Two random people in the same franchise both sharing the same nickname?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    They don't have to call her MJ, Michelle is fine.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Again, the "Michelle" name was meant to throw people off when the character revealed their nickname. Invoking the nickname of "MJ" in a Spider-Man film carries with it a certain connotation. The reveal that she was "MJ" at the end of Homecoming was meant to say "you know who this character is".
    It doesn't matter. That just puts her in the same category as Yondu. The Mary Jane of the comics and Michelle Jones of the movies have very little overlap in terms of personality or appearance. The adaptation is so loose that they're essentially two different characters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    And in case you forgot, Spider-Man comics already had a love interest named "Michele".
    It doesn't matter. It could only get confusing if they're both in the same issue, and Michele Gonzales hasn't appeared in a decade.

  6. #141
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    It doesn't matter. That just puts her in the same category as Yondu. The Mary Jane of the comics and Michelle Jones of the movies have very little overlap in terms of personality or appearance. The adaptation is so loose that they're essentially two different characters.
    She is still referred to as MJ in-universe and out. I've never even seen anyone official use the name "Michelle Jones" to refer to her.

    It doesn't matter. It could only get confusing if they're both in the same issue, and Michele Gonzales hasn't appeared in a decade.
    But she's still "MJ", which is a lot more confusing. If you make her a different character, you send the message that Zendaya isn't playing "the real MJ" and perpetuate the idea that "the real MJ" can only ever be a Caucasian redhead.

  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    She is still referred to as MJ in-universe and out. I've never even seen anyone official use the name "Michelle Jones" to refer to her.
    She was called Michelle in the first movie. If they adapted her into the comics they could just call her Michelle. That's an okay concession to make to adapt her into that setting.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    But she's still "MJ", which is a lot more confusing. If you make her a different character, you send the message that Zendaya isn't playing "the real MJ" and perpetuate the idea that "the real MJ" can only ever be a Caucasian redhead.
    Sony/Marvel didn't commit to calling the character Mary Jane and they didn't write her anything like Mary Jane. Kevin Feige and Amy Pascal wouldn't even commit to it in an interview after the release of the first movie.

    https://www.ign.com/articles/2017/07...cters-nickname

    IGN: I'm going to sort of swipe a line from J.J. Abrams and ask why you went the mystery box route with the Michelle/MJ/Zendaya reveal. Can you talk a little bit about the decision to do that?

    Feige: Well, we never even looked at it as a big reveal necessarily but more of just a fun homage to his past adventures and his past love. She's not Mary Jane Watson. She never was Mary Jane Watson. She was always this new high school character, Michelle, who we know there's an "M" in Michelle and an "M" in Mary. [laughs] So we're so clever and we thought, "Wouldn't it be neat if her initials were MJ?" And then I think it leaked that she would be playing MJ and then it became a whole headache for Zendaya to have to navigate. It was never a big, "Oh my God, it's a big reveal!" There are big reveals in the movie. That's not one of them.

    Pascal: She is not going to end as being Mary Jane Watson.

    Feige: She's not Mary-Jane Watson. Is she going to date Peter? Are they going to fall in love? She seems to be intrigued with him. There's a nice chemistry there. Who knows what will happen in the future films?
    The screenwriters did intend her to be an adaptation of Mary Jane, but "wholly different".

    https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/...212204779.html

    Co-screenwriter John Francis Daley confirms to Yahoo Movies that he intended Michelle to “be a reinvention” of Mary Jane. “It’s not up to us, but that’s certainly how we planted the seeds in this movie. Just to make her wholly different.”
    So yes, technically she was adapted from the comics, but reinvented to such an extent that the only things that remain of the original character are her initials and her being a love interest of Peter Parker. That makes her different enough to introduce into the comics as a separate character.

    Marvel introduced a new Nick Fury to closer reflect the movies. They introduced a new Yondu to closer reflect the movies. They introduced a new Wasp to closer reflect the movies. They introduced a new Valkyrie, Rūna, to closer reflect the movies. They turned Sprite into a girl to closer reflect the movies.

    Marvel want their comics to be familiar and accessible enough to the people who are introduced to the characters through the films.

    For all the girls of color in the audience who love and relate to Zendaya's MJ and want more of that character, it just sucks to tell them "read about this white woman instead, she's completely different but has the same initials".

  8. #143
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    She was called Michelle in the first movie. If they adapted her into the comics they could just call her Michelle. That's an okay concession to make to adapt her into that setting.
    She is called "Michelle" until the climax, when she says her nickname is "MJ" as a surprise reveal for the audience and is then pretty much called "MJ" from that point forward. "MJ" carries with it some meaning to the Spider-Man franchise.

    Sony/Marvel didn't commit to calling the character Mary Jane and they didn't write her anything like Mary Jane. Kevin Feige and Amy Pascal wouldn't even commit to it in an interview after the release of the first movie.

    https://www.ign.com/articles/2017/07...cters-nickname
    Man, that interview with Feige and Pascal is so disingenuous considering she does in fact end up dating Peter at the end of the second movie.

    The screenwriters did intend her to be an adaptation of Mary Jane, but "wholly different".

    https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/...212204779.html

    So yes, technically she was adapted from the comics, but reinvented to such an extent that the only things that remain of the original character are her initials and her being a love interest of Peter Parker. That makes her different enough to introduce into the comics as a separate character.

    Marvel introduced a new Nick Fury to closer reflect the movies. They introduced a new Yondu to closer reflect the movies. They introduced a new Wasp to closer reflect the movies. They introduced a new Valkyrie, Rūna, to closer reflect the movies. They turned Sprite into a girl to closer reflect the movies.

    Marvel want their comics to be familiar and accessible enough to the people who are introduced to the characters through the films.

    For all the girls of color in the audience who love and relate to Zendaya's MJ and want more of that character, it just sucks to tell them "read about this white woman instead, she's completely different but has the same initials".
    And what happens if they do introduce a "Michelle" into the comics and she doesn't forever supplant Mary Jane Watson as the franchise's main love interest? "Sorry, girls of color, but you'll always be secondary to a white woman?"

    (And what happens if they make more Tom Holland-led MCU Spider-Man movies, but Zendaya doesn't want to come back?)

    (Nadia bares so little resemblance to the MCU's Hope, who herself bares little resemblance to the MC2 Hope that inspired the MCU incarnation. She was a comic character first.)
    Last edited by Kevinroc; 12-06-2021 at 08:44 PM.

  9. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Man, that interview with Feige and Pascal is so disingenuous considering she does in fact end up dating Peter at the end of the second movie.
    What are you talking about? Feige suggested they might end up dating, and they did.

    Feige: She's not Mary-Jane Watson. Is she going to date Peter? Are they going to fall in love? She seems to be intrigued with him. There's a nice chemistry there. Who knows what will happen in the future films?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    And what happens if they do introduce a "Michelle" into the comics and she doesn't forever supplant Mary Jane Watson as the franchise's main love interest? "Sorry, girls of color, but you'll always be secondary to a white woman?"

    (And what happens if they make more Tom Holland-led MCU Spider-Man movies, but Zendaya doesn't want to come back?)
    You're the only one who keeps bringing up the idea of her "forever supplanting Mary Jane". All anyone else is saying is that she's a fun character who could be introduced into the comics. Nobody's saying that they should get married and Mary Jane should be killed off. She either takes off or she doesn't. Or she's popular for a while and then she isn't. There's nothing to lose.

    You just seem to be worried that Peter will get a new girlfriend who isn't Mary Jane. I think that worry is a poor reason to keep a popular character out of the comics.

  10. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    What are you talking about? Feige suggested they might end up dating, and they did.

    Feige: She's not Mary-Jane Watson. Is she going to date Peter? Are they going to fall in love? She seems to be intrigued with him. There's a nice chemistry there. Who knows what will happen in the future films?



    You're the only one who keeps bringing up the idea of her "forever supplanting Mary Jane". All anyone else is saying is that she's a fun character who could be introduced into the comics. Nobody's saying that they should get married and Mary Jane should be killed off. She either takes off or she doesn't. Or she's popular for a while and then she isn't. There's nothing to lose.

    You just seem to be worried that Peter will get a new girlfriend who isn't Mary Jane. I think that worry is a poor reason to keep a popular character out of the comics.
    I wonder how popular she is? I know a poster here said Zendaya is popular with the under 25 fans, but is it because of her, is it because of her place in Spider-Man, or both? We have seen numerous love interests for Peter down through the years starting with Betty right up through Cindy and Carlie, and none of them equal the redhead with the majority of fans. I have little doubt that if Marvel and Corporate Parent Disney felt they could get away with it, they would get rid of 616 and have one universe the MCU ( Amazing included), and this would not only keep Peter with Michelle but keep Peter in High School as well( which as everyone knows they would love): Will they? Because of the fan reaction, I doubt they have the balls to do it ( ps. I sure hope not):
    Last edited by NC_Yankee; 12-07-2021 at 06:25 AM.

  11. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    Nick Fury was already in the comics. Mary Jane and Michelle Jones have less in common than Nick Fury and Nick Fury.

    More of a Yondu situation, now that I think about it.
    The difference is that Nick Fury was a B or C-list character in the comics at best. Samuel L Jackson's interpretation become the definite interpretation in the minds of, well, pretty much everyone.

    That's not the case with Zendaya's MJ at all. She's not the definitive MJ by any stretch. She's a very loose reinvention of the character who's in the precarious position of both a) being different enough from classic MJ to practically be a separate character, and b) really serving no purpose or function beyond being the ''MJ'' of a particular continuity.

    I also really don't see the clamor for Zendaya's MJ to join the comics. It's not like she even has Coulson level of popularity as far as I can tell.

  12. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    I wonder how popular she is? I know a poster here said Zendaya is popular with the under 25 fans, but is it because of her, is it because of her place in Spider-Man, or both? We have seen numerous love interests for Peter down through the years starting with Betty right up through Cindy and Carlie, and none of them equal the redhead with the majority of fans.
    It's not a contest. A character doesn't have to be the number one most popular to have value. The current Spider-Man comics need a stronger supporting cast and a more diverse supporting cast.

    The worst that can happen is that the character doesn't take off. No damage done.

    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    I have little doubt that if Marvel and Corporate Parent Disney felt they could get away with it, they would get rid of 616 and have one universe the MCU ( Amazing included), and this would not only keep Peter with Michelle but keep Peter in High School as well( which as everyone knows they would love): Will they? Because of the fan reaction, I doubt they have the balls to do it ( ps. I sure hope not):
    It wouldn't be viable to publish dozens of comics each month that fit the MCU continuity, without stepping on the toes of those movies/TV series.

    The comics are able to tell new stories, and the best ideas rise to the top and get adapted into the MCU.

    Anything that works well in the MCU can be adapted into the comics, to make them more familiar and welcoming to the audience of millions that watches the movies. With the comics and MCU characters more aligned, the comics can then produce stories that are more easily adaptable into the MCU, and the cycle continues.

    It's a mutually beneficial arrangement.

  13. #148
    Astonishing Member The Kid's Avatar
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    I don't think the comics really take that much from the MCU tbh. They do make some attempts at synergy but for the most part, writers seem content to try and write the next big thing that'll get adapted to the big screen. Tony and Pepper still barely have a relationship in the comics over the last ten years and that's the main couple of the MCU. I'd be down for Michelle being adapted though if they come with a nice way to do it. Although I have a feeling it'll end like attempts to bring Felicity and Chloe to DC comics but that's no reason not to try

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    It's not a contest. A character doesn't have to be the number one most popular to have value. The current Spider-Man comics need a stronger supporting cast and a more diverse supporting cast.

    The worst that can happen is that the character doesn't take off. No damage done.



    It wouldn't be viable to publish dozens of comics each month that fit the MCU continuity, without stepping on the toes of those movies/TV series.

    The comics are able to tell new stories, and the best ideas rise to the top and get adapted into the MCU.

    Anything that works well in the MCU can be adapted into the comics, to make them more familiar and welcoming to the audience of millions that watches the movies. With the comics and MCU characters more aligned, the comics can then produce stories that are more easily adaptable into the MCU, and the cycle continues.

    It's a mutually beneficial arrangement.
    Spider-Man has a very large supporting cast. In fact along with Batman the largest in comics. It is also diverse. The Robertson family to start with.

  15. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    It's not a contest. A character doesn't have to be the number one most popular to have value. The current Spider-Man comics need a stronger supporting cast and a more diverse supporting cast.

    The worst that can happen is that the character doesn't take off. No damage done.



    It wouldn't be viable to publish dozens of comics each month that fit the MCU continuity, without stepping on the toes of those movies/TV series.

    The comics are able to tell new stories, and the best ideas rise to the top and get adapted into the MCU.

    Anything that works well in the MCU can be adapted into the comics, to make them more familiar and welcoming to the audience of millions that watches the movies. With the comics and MCU characters more aligned, the comics can then produce stories that are more easily adaptable into the MCU, and the cycle continues.

    It's a mutually beneficial arrangement.
    Think about what Marvel did with the Ultimate Universe and DC did with Earth 2? More recently with James Bond. He was killed off but will return. Erasing that universe. They could easily finish the Peter/Mary Jane saga in Amazing 1000, and after that eliminate 616 and reboot Peter straight back to HS in MCU comics starting with the “New” Amazing 1

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