Zendaya's "MJ": Future as a Comics Character?

[Lee]

Why are you so gung ho about this specific MJ not being part of Miles cast if you are fine with her being some elseworld comics (where the characters don’t matter so much)?

She's not part of Miles' cast in the movies. It wouldn't be a good gateway for readers coming from the movies.

[Kevinroc]

Because there are girls out there who relate to Zendaya's MJ, just like there were girls who related to Kirsten Dunst's MJ in the early 2000s, which lead to Mary Jane comics and prose novels. For a whole new generation of Spider-Man fans Zendaya's MJ is an important character. But she is completely absent from the comics. Marvel is letting that audience down, at a time when YA girls graphic novels are bigger than ever.

So yes, I think it's important for this character to be in Spider-Man comics in some capacity. I think it's worth at least attempting. I think that audience matters. At best, Marvel has a success and they make more comics with the character. At absolute worst it doesn't sell too well and they don't make any follow-ups. At least that one gateway graphic novel will exist.

You're putting your foot down and insisting that there must never ever ever be a comic with an MCU-inspired MJ, that it should never be given a chance, that it must be prevented no matter what. It comes across as gatekeepery.

I think you're asking too much for what is a supporting character (to a white male lead) in today's market. I don't think this is the mark of progressivism when characters like Ironheart, Shuri (her problematic actress aside), and Storm exist and can serve as leads in their own stories.

People don't want to be the supporting civilian character. People want to see themselves as the hero.

Watch them cast a white red head for the college trilogy who's named 'Mary Jane' and he'll just go 'I'll call you MJ' and then fall in love with her.

Because I would not entirely put it past them to do that.

If they do more of these movies, and Zendaya doesn't come back and this happens, then I will laugh. Because Marvel would have done this to themselves. They're the ones who put more value in "surprising" their audience instead of coming forward and saying they cast Zendaya as "Mary Jane" (an act I still consider cowardly on their part).

[Lee]

I think you're asking too much for what is a supporting character (to a white male lead) in today's market. I don't think this is the mark of progressivism when characters like Ironheart, Shuri (her problematic actress aside), and Storm exist and can serve as leads in their own stories.

People don't want to be the supporting civilian character. People want to see themselves as the hero.

It's not either/or. Both can exist.

If there was an audience for Mary Jane graphic novels in 2020 then there should be an audience for MCU MJ graphic novels in 2022.

Kid and YA Spider-Man graphic novels, whether aimed at boys, girls, or both, should have characters familiar to the young audience who are growing up with the MCU movies. That means characters like the MCU versions of MJ and Ned. These characters have already appeared in children's picture books, so I don't understand why you think they should be barred from all Spider-Man comics. What does banning them from appearing in kid and YA comics accomplish?

[Mistah K88]

She's not part of Miles' cast in the movies. It wouldn't be a good gateway for readers coming from the movies.

People coming from the movies will see all sorts of stuff that doesn’t exist with Peter (who has decades worth of characters). For example Gank…Ned is a huge part of these movies, he perhaps has a bigger presence than MJ does (being the first person to learn Peter’s identity and all) and he doesn’t exist in Peter’s world. She wouldn’t have him to play off of like she does in the movies.

[Kevinroc]

It's not either/or. Both can exist.

If there was an audience for Mary Jane graphic novels in 2020 then there should be an audience for MCU MJ graphic novels in 2022.

Kid and YA Spider-Man graphic novels, whether aimed at boys, girls, or both, should have characters familiar to the young audience who are growing up with the MCU movies. That means characters like the MCU versions of MJ and Ned. These characters have already appeared in children's picture books, so I don't understand why you think they should be barred from all Spider-Man comics. What does banning them from appearing in kid and YA comics accomplish?

Content with this iteration of the character exists (such as Funko pops), and will continue to exist for some time to come (such as the animated Disney+ prequel series). But what you are asking for seems very difficult because you are talking about treating a supporting civilian character and trying to raise them to the level of a co-protagonist. At the end of the day, this is still Peter's story. People are here to see Peter.

Yes, Mary Jane has had her own spotlight stories. She's not going to get her own film series or her own animated series. Her ultimate role in the story is to be a supporting character for Peter. And that's the case at least 9.9/10 times.

This is why people should advocate for content that revolves around characters who are the heroes of their own story.

[Lee]

People coming from the movies will see all sorts of stuff that doesn’t exist with Peter (who has decades worth of characters). For example Gank…Ned is a huge part of these movies, he perhaps has a bigger presence than MJ does (being the first person to learn Peter’s identity and all) and he doesn’t exist in Peter’s world. She wouldn’t have him to play off of like she does in the movies.

There should definitely be an MCU Ned counterpart for Peter in the comics. Easy to do in something out of continuity. Within the main continuity he would need a surname that isn't "Leeds" and they'd need to flesh out his personality so that there's not too much overlap between him and Ganke. Trickier than Michelle, but certainly something they should consider, especially now that Harry is dead again.

Content with this iteration of the character exists (such as Funko pops), and will continue to exist for some time to come (such as the animated Disney+ prequel series). But what you are asking for seems very difficult because you are talking about treating a supporting civilian character and trying to raise them to the level of a co-protagonist. At the end of the day, this is still Peter's story. People are here to see Peter.

I've suggested several ways Michelle/MJ could appear in comics, and you've shot down every single one of them.

Would it be okay for Marvel to publish an out of continuity Spider-Man comic aimed at kids with an MCU inspired MJ as part of the supporting cast. Or would that be completely unacceptable?

Are there any circumstances under which you would find it acceptable for an MCU inspired MJ to appear in a comic, or do you think Marvel Comics should completely ban her from appearing?

[Kevinroc]

I've suggested several ways Michelle/MJ could appear in comics, and you've shot down every single one of them.

Would it be okay for Marvel to publish an out of continuity Spider-Man comic aimed at kids with an MCU inspired MJ as part of the supporting cast. Or would that be completely unacceptable?

Are there any circumstances under which you would find it acceptable for an MCU inspired MJ to appear in a comic, or do you think Marvel Comics should completely ban her from appearing?

They kind of did the thing you are talking about and it made such a non-splash that you don't even know they did it.

[Lee]

I'm aware of that. It's already been brought up in this thread. It used Michelle/MJ but called her Gloriana/GG (derived from Glory Grant). It also used Ganke instead of Ned.

It's exactly the kind of thing they should be doing, but the name differences are a barrier of entry. I don't know if it was due to a legal issue with Sony, internal politics, or simply a creative decision, but it's not ideal. This was before Far From Home, where Michelle/MJ's role was expanded.

[Kevinroc]

They should be putting out product that isn't successful?

At the crux of this discussion is the idea that movies will bring more people to comics, and after so long of super heroes being the dominant form of media, we can see that isn't exactly the case. You know who's a reasonably popular character online who debuted in the movies? The kid from Iron Man 3. You know who they finally stuck in a comic this year? The kid from Iron Man 3. (W.E.B. of Spider-Man.)

Has that done anything for comics? Nope.

[Lee]

They should be putting out Spider-Man comics that are accessible and recognisable entry points for young readers.

The Spidey comic ended and was replaced by Marvel Action: Spider-Man, which co-starred Miles Morales and Gwen Stacy. It launched when the most recent Spider-Man cartoon was in its second season and Into the Spider-Verse was about to premiere. It tied in with what was was being done with the brand in TV and movies at the time.

[Kevinroc]

They should be putting out Spider-Man comics that are accessible and recognisable entry points for young readers.

The Spidey comic ended and was replaced by Marvel Action: Spider-Man, which co-starred Miles Morales and Gwen Stacy. It launched when the most recent Spider-Man cartoon was in its second season and Into the Spider-Verse was about to premiere. It tied in with what was was being done with the brand in TV and movies at the time.

They licensed that out to another company to do (and they don't even have the license anymore). Marvel didn't even do that one themselves.

I think if that kind of thing were successful, companies like Marvel and DC would do it more often. It doesn't work. Even now, when a brand new MCU Spider-Man film is about to open, Peter isn't even the guy in the suit in the comic called "Amazing Spider-Man". Someone called Ben Reilly is.

DC isn't even publishing a comic called "Legends of Tomorrow". The show "Legends of Tomorrow" is currently on its seventh season.

[Frontier]

I'd rather we not chase brand synergy and just do stuff that's good for the brand/property, although I guess we might not agree on that.

[Kevinroc]

I'd rather we not chase brand synergy and just do stuff that's good for the brand/property, although I guess we might not agree on that.

I'm with you on that. That kind of thing doesn't work anyway.

[Mistah K88]

I'd rather we not chase brand synergy and just do stuff that's good for the brand/property, although I guess we might not agree on that.

Yeah, adaptations try to do their own thing anyway, as they have the advantage of seeing what works and what doesn't with decades of history (and they can plan things that were eventually retconned in advance to work in a cohesive way[which is why I was REALLY excited about the Spectacular animated series take on the Hobgoblin saga]). However, I wouldn't want comics to force things from adaptations into comics if they can't make it work in a cohesive way. Sure elseworlds can do that since, like adaptations they can kind of do whatever they want, and in the long run, whatever happens in them don't matter too much as they won't affect the main series.

[Mister Mets]

They kind of did the thing you are talking about and it made such a non-splash that you don't even know they did it.

You haven't really given your thoughts on whether it was worth trying.

I hope not, do you know how many more people in the world are going to hate Mary Jane's character if that happens? MCU Spider-man fans love Zendaya and will RIOT if she is replaced by another Mary Jane.

Mary Jane looks bad enough based on the Raimi trilogy's portrayal vs. TASM Gwen and MCU MJ already. We need audiences to be happy about Mary Jane's appearance, not upset.

The best option would be to have Zendaya become Mary Jane somehow after the events of No Way Home. When Tom and his cast quit in a few years, then they can recast Mary Jane with the rest of the cast.

This is racially loaded in ways that we haven't figured out perfect answers for.

A show on Broadway was cancelled after the uproad when a black actor was replaced by Mandy Patinkin.

https://forward.com/schmooze/378580/...-actor-of-col/

The show in question was an adaptation of War and Peace.

One idea may be to have Zendaya's MJ do more stuff that is associated with Mary Jane. The characters going to college allows for that form of discovery. Since Zendaya is a decent singer, that can be something to explore in the movies.

There will likely be some recast down the road, although it will likely take a few years to get there. They'll likely go with a diverse cast, which makes sense for a protagonist from Queens NY, but which will mitigate the change from Tom Holland & Zendaya to whoever the next leads are.

yup she is the pretty red head chick that spiderman dates. emphasize on pretty

Every love interest in the Spider-Man comics is pretty, though.