Krakoa has basically tried to destroy these characters the most.

[Spiderfan001]

Cyclops was not shown to be okay with the Crucible, and he's also seeing Emma on the side.

->He saw the murder happen and didn't object, the last decade IRL and few years in comics have shown Scott doesn't stand by when something he feel's is wrong is happening.

->He's not, or post the scans.One semi-flirty line of dialogue in a X-book written by Chip Zdarsky(which Hickman said wasn't part of plan) doesn't remotely mean they are sleeping together.

Also thanks for this because another point came to mind because of this

Scott has regressed in Krakoan era and doesn't stand up to Xavier/Mags nearly as much as he used to.

Didn't stop Sinister from taking his brother into his Su*cide Squad and seemed okay w/ Council saying no to Pryor's ressurection

[Dante Milton]

I wouldn't say "destroyed", but there are a few characters whose changes in this era I don't enjoy.

Nature Girl: It's not even that I think transitioning the character to a more antagonistic role is completely unbelievable, it's that Duggan's execution of the idea was so terrible. Instead of being an emotional and meaningful shift it just comes off as a joke, and one that poorly parodies actual ecological activism in a way that could actually be harmful. Also, it never really makes sense to me why writers don't seem to understand that humanity is also a part of nature, so if a character cares about defending the natural world that would also extend to the living conditions of humans.

Rictor: I just intensely dislike every decision that Howard has made with the character. Starting with the Apocalypse of it all. I hate how, unless it gets retconned, it will forever be a joke that he "hooked up" with Apocalypse. I hate that Howard never bothered to do the work to explain why Rictor would want any kind of connection to A given his specific history. He saw what A did to Warren, and to Caliban, he was a teenager when A first tried to kill him and the team that saved his life, he came of age on a team led by Cable who undoubtedly had some stories about how horrible this guy is. If Howard wanted to make that connection between these characters, she had to make it make sense, and she failed spectacularly to do so. I hate the magic stuff with him because he's way too cynical of a character to effectively perform magic, imo. Hate the the druid thing, and so would Rictor if he was being written in character. I would say that I'm glad she got him and 'Star back together, but I'm pretty sure it was mostly her fault that they were ever broken up, and that she never bothered to give a proper explanation why. As it stands now, it is established that Rictor came back from the AoXM reality couldn't find 'Star, and rather than ask any of their mutual friends about it, immediately assumed that they were broken up? Their reunion at the Hellfire Gala was horribly written, and in true Howard style, instantly ignored and resolved off panel.

Pyro: His characterization in Marauders is superficially enjoyable, but it's incredibly shallow. He should have a bit more depth.

Quentin Quire: That weird arc where he refused to kill in X-Force was just dumb and his "redemption" was entirely because of his relationship with Sophie, that's where I dropped the book it was so bad.

[davetvs]

->He saw the murder happen and didn't object, the last decade IRL and few years in comics have shown Scott doesn't stand by when something he feel's is wrong is happening.

->He's not, or post the scans.One semi-flirty line of dialogue in a X-book written by Chip Zdarsky(which Hickman said wasn't part of plan) doesn't remotely mean they are sleeping together.

Also thanks for this because another point came to mind because of this

Scott has regressed in Krakoan era and doesn't stand up to Xavier/Mags nearly as much as he used to.

Didn't stop Sinister from taking his brother into his Su*cide Squad and seemed okay w/ Council saying no to Pryor's ressurection

Huh? Writers have confirmed Cyclops is still seeing Emma and the scene where he escorts her to the QC meeting was heavily hinting at them having spent the night together.

[dragon1440]

I wouldn't say "destroyed", but there are a few characters whose changes in this era I don't enjoy.

Nature Girl: It's not even that I think transitioning the character to a more antagonistic role is completely unbelievable, it's that Duggan's execution of the idea was so terrible. Instead of being an emotional and meaningful shift it just comes off as a joke, and one that poorly parodies actual ecological activism in a way that could actually be harmful. Also, it never really makes sense to me why writers don't seem to understand that humanity is also a part of nature, so if a character cares about defending the natural world that would also extend to the living conditions of humans.

Rictor: I just intensely dislike every decision that Howard has made with the character. Starting with the Apocalypse of it all. I hate how, unless it gets retconned, it will forever be a joke that he "hooked up" with Apocalypse. I hate that Howard never bothered to do the work to explain why Rictor would want any kind of connection to A given his specific history. He saw what A did to Warren, and to Caliban, he was a teenager when A first tried to kill him and the team that saved his life, he came of age on a team led by Cable who undoubtedly had some stories about how horrible this guy is. If Howard wanted to make that connection between these characters, she had to make it make sense, and she failed spectacularly to do so. I hate the magic stuff with him because he's way too cynical of a character to effectively perform magic, imo. Hate the the druid thing, and so would Rictor if he was being written in character. I would say that I'm glad she got him and 'Star back together, but I'm pretty sure it was mostly her fault that they were ever broken up, and that she never bothered to give a proper explanation why. As it stands now, it is established that Rictor came back from the AoXM reality couldn't find 'Star, and rather than ask any of their mutual friends about it, immediately assumed that they were broken up? Their reunion at the Hellfire Gala was horribly written, and in true Howard style, instantly ignored and resolved off panel.

Pyro: His characterization in Marauders is superficially enjoyable, but it's incredibly shallow. He should have a bit more depth.

Quentin Quire: That weird arc where he refused to kill in X-Force was just dumb and his "redemption" was entirely because of his relationship with Sophie, that's where I dropped the book it was so bad.

As far as humans and nature, well in the larger ecological factor we are part of nature, we also on a soceital level have put ourselves above and seperate from nature. Great example, the hardship with getting people to beleive in evulotion, which still plauges us today and are so common that its used as a theme time after time after time. The thought human beings cant be related to monkeys is still a thought that persists. So yeah rational scintific people see humanity as part of nature, but humanity over all purposefully sets ourself above and seperate from nature. And I would argue at that point where the kettle had enough anti ecology issues inside it that the plastic bag made it boil over, I would say that at that point she might have not been thinking rationale. And honestly every thing that was done by Nature Girl could be seen as her more and more digging herself a hole and that instead of trying to get out of it because she was not in rational mind kept diving further in the hole.

[Spiderfan001]

Huh? Writers have confirmed Cyclops is still seeing Emma and the scene where he escorts her to the QC meeting was heavily hinting at them having spent the night together.

Scans and/or issue numbers

Also the tweet, because Hickman's does not confirm anything

Also people on here denying anything b/w Jean and Logan and yet a scene of them semi-flirting gets you to agree Scemma happened

[Kingdom X]

Scans and/or issue numbers

Also the tweet, because Hickman's does not confirm anything

Also people on here denying anything b/w Jean and Logan and yet a scene of them semi-flirting gets you to agree Scemma happened

"AIPT: X-Fan Cami asked the question on every Scemma fan’s mind — how often has Cyclops been to the White Palace?

Jonathan: As often as possible, I’d guess."

https://aiptcomics.com/2021/09/20/x-...athan-hickman/

I truly don't have a stake in this game, but among the ambiguous poly-stuff seems like Hickman also wanted to imply Scott was seeing Emma.

[xhx23x]

I don't know. The Moira thing seems kinda a weak complain, since the character was brought back with an interesting premise that hasn't been paid off yet, so is hard to say wether it will have lasting or harmful effects on her.

Kitty, is just being Kitty too. Every few years she goes through a phase of some sort. It's perfectly normal with both her character and the presumed age she is currently.

Nature Girl, i guess you can have some argument, but to be fair, nothing was being done with her, and I would argue that story doesn't really fit within the current canon unless the follow up to X-Men Green will be the fall of Krakoa over what she did. So it's less this era is bad for her, and more, she was randomly selected for the experimental app format that is meant to be quickly consumed and not really thought about. That could have happen to her, or any character, really.

[Zelena]

Nature Girl
Moira
Kitty

People want to know why I hate on Hickman and this era so much. I’ll point to those three characters and what has been done to them.

If it sticks, something has been “done“ to them. If it doesn’t… Don’t read what you don’t like. Wait and see. A character and its author go hand in hand.

[Spiderfan001]

"AIPT: X-Fan Cami asked the question on every Scemma fan’s mind — how often has Cyclops been to the White Palace?

Jonathan: As often as possible, I’d guess."

https://aiptcomics.com/2021/09/20/x-...athan-hickman/

I truly don't have a stake in this game, but among the ambiguous poly-stuff seems like Hickman also wanted to imply Scott was seeing Emma.

Oh yeah I know what this is, and I agree he's trying to imply it but his saying this doesn't make it remotely canon.The statement itself seems hesitant, he's going away anyway and AIPT mentioned the person is a Scemma fan.Seems like a perfect diplomatic answer.

Not to mention end of Bendis made it clear Scott doesn't want to be w/ Emma "I wouldn't touch you with Namor's trident".But he still respects her and works w/ her, even if he visits the palace it can be work related.Also Emma stated in the Gala she has no time for such things when talking about steve.

Just feels like the things pointing to no is more than the yes by a good margin.And it's not like they have any reservations of showing the ploy thing, they did with Jean and Logan

[Kingdom X]

Oh yeah I know what this is, and I agree he's trying to imply it but his saying this doesn't make it remotely canon.The statement itself seems hesitant, he's going away anyway and AIPT mentioned the person is a Scemma fan.Seems like a perfect diplomatic answer.

Not to mention end of Bendis made it clear Scott doesn't want to be w/ Emma "I wouldn't touch you with Namor's trident".But he still respects her and works w/ her, even if he visits the palace it can be work related.Also Emma stated in the Gala she has no time for such things when talking about steve.

Just feels like the things pointing to no is more than the yes by a good margin.And it's not like they have any reservations of showing the ploy thing, they did with Jean and Logan

I'd argue that they have pretty huge reservations about showing the poly thing on the page. While they were more explicit with Scott/Jean/Logan, they also refused to put any exploration of it in the books and they seem to be walking it back a lot recently. I don't remember the last time the three of them had panel time together and it seems like Scott and Jean are sleeping in the Treehouse, leaving Logan alone on the moon.

[Spiderfan001]

I'd argue that they have pretty huge reservations about showing the poly thing on the page. While they were more explicit with Scott/Jean/Logan, they also refused to put any exploration of it in the books and they seem to be walking it back a lot recently. I don't remember the last time the three of them had panel time together and it seems like Scott and Jean are sleeping in the Treehouse, leaving Logan alone on the moon.

They have reservations in confronting it , we've seen proof that the ploy three way is a thing.They can never acknowledge it but can't walk back on it unless they give us a She-hulk Juggernaut style retcon or something.

Jean was kissing Logan in front of Scott before Scott asked her to come to bed.

It has fell off, although Jean and Logan are in seperate places and books so that is a valid reason.

[Omega Alpha]

People are still in denial about Scott and Emma? Really? Also, Scott was clearly disturbed about the concept of the Crucible (in that issue, he also mentions seeing Jean and Emma), that was the point of the conversation with Kurt.

[Habis]

I love the premise of House of X/Power of X, but the implementation leaves much to be desired...

First, it is really hard to shoehorn all the previous stories into this plotline... If you re-read them, you need to make some convoluted mental gymnastics to explain their choices... There must be a hundred things Moira, Magneto and Xavier could have done to prepare for the future and preserve mutant lives... All mutants could be living in their own planet in another galaxy in another universe by now, humans tricked into thinking they have gone extinct or whatever... Once they had a safe mutant colony elsewhere (and maybe a mutant DNA database so they can clone more), they could allow Dr. Tucker's prenatal test and cure and Kavita Rao's Hope Serum to be produced, or not help undo Wanda's "No More Mutants", and voila! humans think there are no more mutants, they focus their fear on Inhumans or Deviants or vampires or aliens or whatever, while the X-Men run their brand new mutant homeworld...

Second, Xavier and Moira are monsters. They have manipulated and lied so much... they have literally bred unloved children to be used as living tools, they have mistreated, neglected and manipulated them, and discarded them when they weren't of use...

Xavier has already been made into a manipulative, morally bankrupt ******* by previous retcons... but, how do they fix this, unless they reboot the universe so House of X never happened, or they will just kill him, leave him dead for a decade and pretend House of X never happened without retconning it...

Third, I find hard to swallow the behavior of all the other mutants who DON'T know about Moira's many lives... I mean... from their point of view they are basically repeating Utopia, but this time on Krakoa and with Apocalypse, Mr. Sinister, Selene, Sebastian Shaw, Exodus... etc... how aren't they running from it shouting "NOPENOPENOPENOPENOPENOPENOPE!!!".

They should also realize that the Five's "resurrection" is just cloning plus memories implantation... they even have mentioned they could create duplicates... and despite that, they are happy to throw their lives away because they know they will be replaced... don't they realize they will be still dead, even if a replacement is made?

[Omega Alpha]

They already tried isolationism in the 5th life, it didn't work.

Also, right now mutants are living in another planet.

They also not repeating Utopia- now they have way more resources, people, are much more united and are on course to become the most powerful nation on Earth. Plus, you know, having Apocalypse, Shaw, Selene, etc, with the same goal as you is a good idea.

The complaint about resurrection being "just a duplicate with your memories, therefore isn't you" it's also non-sense. Right now, there's not a single cell in your body that was already there 15 years ago, so you are essentially a duplicate with your memories.

[AdamFTF]

I don't know. The Moira thing seems kinda a weak complain, since the character was brought back with an interesting premise that hasn't been paid off yet, so is hard to say wether it will have lasting or harmful effects on her.

The problem with Moira is that she's not a regular human anymore.

Maybe I'm old-fashioned, but I think the X-Men should have human friends. And not just "technically" human like other superhumans, but HUMAN human as in no powers. But they seem to lose those friends really easily. Not even "loss" in the sense of death. But loss in the sense of them just disappearing or being forgotten about. I'm a little out of the loop on comics, but tell me if any of the X-Men's human friends have appeared lately. Stevie Hunter? Candy Southern? Peter Corbeau? Kavita Rao? Yukio? Charlotte Jones? Tom Corsi? Trish Tilby? Lee Forester? Any of them?

The one that lasted the longest and had the biggest presence in the X-Men was Dr. Moira MacTaggert until she was unceremoniously and unfairly killed 20 years ago. But then she's brought back and the explanation is that she was secretly a mutant the whole time, but her power was just one that wasn't easily displayed. What this retcon suggests is that mutants, particularly X-Men, cannot have lasting, meaningful friendships with even sympathetic humans. And if they seem to, the reality is that human was actually a mutant the entire time and you didn't know it.

I guess there's Kyle Jinadu-Baeubier for now. Though it doesn't seem like quite enough. And Shogo Lee, who they keep turning into a dragon because they don't know what to do with a human infant (he shouldn't have to do much, just be a symbol of maturity for Jubilee).