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  1. #76
    Braddock Isle JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    Tampering?
    Jean didn't influence the voters. She "pushed" a needed candidate to run, when that candidate would have otherwise decided not to. Lorna won her place fare and square.

    Some of y'all arms must be tired from all that reaching. LOL.
    I mentioned in the Polaris thread how cool it was for her to simply say three words and she got elected easily. The mutants love her!
    "Danielle... I intend to do something rash and violent." - Betsy Braddock
    Krakoa, Arakko, and Otherworld forever!

  2. #77
    Ultimate Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Self doubt is a part of autonomous decision making as well...theres many reasons why someone might feel that way... not being ready is one a reason. I'm sure others can think of many others.

    I'd laugh if the Secret X-men feel robbed and this is not the only instance. I mean if it can happen to one vote why not more?
    Last edited by ExodusCloak; 11-24-2021 at 02:06 PM.

  3. #78
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    I thought it was delyed

  4. #79
    The Red Dragon Tank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    Rigged elections in Krakoa not a good look if the residents of Krakoa found out and if they are going to vote for a new QC
    Emma changed the minds of the human voters so Krakoa could be declared a nation in HoX. I didnt see you having a problem with that.
    What Emma did was tampering and outright changed the vote.

    But it’s only problematic because it was Jean who did it and she didnt even change anyone’s vote, merely pushed Lorna to not self sabotage. She didnt tamper in the actual voting. If it was Emma you would be saying how assertive and helpful she was.
    Last edited by Tank; 11-24-2021 at 02:09 PM.

  5. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jbenito View Post
    I mentioned in the Polaris thread how cool it was for her to simply say three words and she got elected easily. The mutants love her!
    How many resurrected mutants are alive on Krakoa at this point? That might help to explain it. I am unsure if Jean rigged the vote in favor of Lorna though. The issue on some level opened up that possibility.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dante Milton View Post
    Disappointing issue. I liked the vote shenanigans as a Jean moment, but hated it as a Polaris moment. There was a lot of exposition pretending to be character development for Lorna. There are actually some potentially interesting ideas here about Lorna's lack of confidence and her mental health issues but the execution is very poor. The dialogue in this issue also feels weirdly expositional rather than conversational. Just a really clunky book that really doesn't feel like it's making the most of its page space. Nice art though.
    It was a strong Jean moment showing who she is in the new era and her greater moral flexibility then certain other eras. Though we saw in ToM though that Jean was not ok with mind wiping the Avengers though Lorna very much was. I am not sure where the philosophical divide falls between them though with this issue and X-Men in general.



    In terms of your point about it as a Polaris moment I would say it gets back to the issue of what's your motivation. Some of my favorite Lorna moments of all time are her giving speeches on how she sees the world. This wasn't that and it is playing its cards close to the vest in a number of areas with the character at this point I would agree.
    Last edited by jmc247; 11-24-2021 at 02:31 PM.

  6. #81
    Ultimate Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tank View Post
    Emma changed the minds of the human voters so Krakoa could be declared a nation in HoX. I didnt see you having a problem with that.
    This is not that as bad.
    But it’s only problematic because it was Jean who did it. If it was Emma you would be saying how assertive and helpful she was.
    Well its a national election for her own people? We know mind tampering is wrong. Every telepath does it but mind tampering the enemy is one thing mind tampering your own people when you are trying to build a country that won't eventually implode on itself is another.

    It sullies whatever democratic process they had of putting in after the QC get the boot.
    This could be meta commentary that the marvel poll was rigged too.

  7. #82
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    I'm sorry, yall. I love a pushy Jean. Not like every issue, but ever so often, the content should remind you that this is a character who could be domineering and destructive if she isn't careful with herself. You gotta see that danger peeking through the unassuming every now and then. This was a neat way to do it without some kind of "Bastard Xavier" type of move.

  8. #83
    The Red Dragon Tank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kitty&Piotr<3 View Post
    I'm sorry, yall. I love a pushy Jean. Not like every issue, but ever so often, the content should remind you that this is a character who could be domineering and destructive if she isn't careful with herself. You gotta see that danger peeking through the unassuming every now and then. This was a neat way to do it without some kind of "Bastard Xavier" type of move.
    “But she rigged the vote!! It’s a bad look for Krakoa and the Xmen!!”- Emma fans despite Emma actually rigging the vote for Krakoa to be a nation in the first place.

    The bias is real.

  9. #84
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    Tampering?
    Jean didn't influence the voters. She "pushed" a needed candidate to run, when that candidate would have otherwise decided not to. Lorna won her place fare and square.

    Some of y'all arms must be tired from all that reaching. LOL.
    Thank you. Seriously, I can't... Meanwhile, let's really talk about manipulative and destructive behavior...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kitty&Piotr<3 View Post
    I'm sorry, yall. I love a pushy Jean. Not like every issue, but ever so often, the content should remind you that this is a character who could be domineering and destructive if she isn't careful with herself. You gotta see that danger peeking through the unassuming every now and then. This was a neat way to do it without some kind of "Bastard Xavier" type of move.
    I agree with this, though I'm not sure it applies in this case.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderfan001 View Post
    I'm disappointed lol.For a Lorna issue it was a very baseline issue, we don't see any of her past or even reasonings.The fighting is barebones, passable but not special.Laura is Logan 2.O(they really messed her stint as wolverine up).Rogue isn't even there, Scott and Shiro are just there.Jean is again the highlight.

    And another filler issue w/ teases, please move on w/ the plot...

    The art-work while not Laraz is good and the saving grace here



    Could have been very interesting but wasn't.Duggan showing his writing skills or lack thereof
    Agreed With you

    This is a jean book Zzzzzz . Sorry But not sorry

    X_x

  11. #86
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    HAHA, the Jean hate is real

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    Tampering?
    Jean didn't influence the voters. She "pushed" a needed candidate to run, when that candidate would have otherwise decided not to. Lorna won her place fare and square.

    Some of y'all arms must be tired from all that reaching. LOL.
    That doesn't make it any better. Rather than let Lorna work issues out on her own she just flipped a switch in her head and essentially made that decision for her. There are SIGNIFICANT issues on the matter of consent, here.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    Well its a national election for her own people? We know mind tampering is wrong. Every telepath does it but mind tampering the enemy is one thing mind tampering your own people when you are trying to build a country that won't eventually implode on itself is another.

    It sullies whatever democratic process they had of putting in after the QC get the boot.
    This could be meta commentary that the marvel poll was rigged too.
    How changing "just not me" to "just pick me" is tampering? seriously, you made it sound like Jean created a whole speech for Lorna.
    And even though with those three words the others voted for her.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rift View Post
    I mean to be fair, Rogue wasn't on the cover, nor was this issue advertised as a Rogue issue. Besides, they're not just putting her on the team for fans to buy it; she's going to play a role on the team, she just has to wait her turn for her spotlight issue, like everyone else.

    They're likely going to split the team to tackle Cordyceps Jones. With less characters around, she'll have more of a chance to shine.
    How everyone else?
    but if all the issues have been basically jean and as a co-star maybe Synch, the others are just there, and Rogue and Laura aren't even that.


    I like jean as a group character but I'm not interested in investing in her solo because Zzzzzzz, and this unfortunately is not a team book but Jean's solo Zzz, I don't know why they didn't call it jean gray book in the first place, even in this issue it was from Lorna we had the annoying voice of jean in the background stealing attention like the rest of the issues. X_x

  15. #90
    Ultimate Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dam View Post
    How changing "just not me" to "just pick me" is tampering? seriously, you made it sound like Jean created a whole speech for Lorna.
    And even though with those three words the others voted for her.
    Of course its tampering its taking the locus of control away from Lorna and shes making a paternalistic decision on her behalf instead of helping Lorna come to that decision herself.

    My point is the optics. If this can happen how do we know it didn't happen in other cases. Did Toad not put himself forward because he said no not me instead of just pick me? Or Jason Wyngarde or Selene or the Fenris or whoever

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