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  1. #91
    Extraordinary Member Omega Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reigna View Post
    I just realized the argument we are having is pointless. Nothing that the mutants do would ever be deemed acceptable by anti krakoa. Except go back to that stupid mansion and get bombed every week. So like the Mutants I am realizing it's pointless to debate this. This is a thread to appreciate why krakoa is sooo important not to debate whether it has a right to exist. I am done with these people and their squabbling they can argue with the air on this idc.

    Krakoa is good for mutants and has enabled them not only to survive but thrive.
    That's it exactly. Krakoa triggers two kinds of people: the ones that hate anything different than X-men sitting on a mansion playing baseball and getting bombed, and the ones that hate minorities being aggressive and pro-active.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom X View Post
    I love the idea of Krakoan election and actually thought we’d be heading in that direction post-Inferno.

    But yes the mansion has DEFINITELY been a thing (though it’s obviously also been a school). Partway through Utopia the Jean Grey School was opened and the mansion was back. Then even when the X-Men were living in Limbo they took the mansion with them. Then Kitty decided to drop the mansion in Central Park (IIRC).
    Fair enough, I've been off and on after M-day. I knew Storm and Beast used it during Schism but there was also the Utopian period and such. My point was that the Mansion as a status quo was not broken by Krakoa.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saithor View Post
    This. I don't know if I mentioned it specifically on this forum but I've been advocating for a mutant election to replace the Quiet Council and the formation of an actual government. Honestly has the mansion even been a thing in the last twenty years at all anyway?
    Co signed, if it's for the mutants then they should get to choose who lead.Also w/ all the power Xavier and the good X-men have I highly doubt their isn't a way they can make Sinister and co. loose their power while keeping their benefits.

    The mansion was in limbo for a while.Personally I'm fine w/ it not being around for a while, although it could be cool to have a school for young mutants be there in the Krakoan age.

    Funny how people say Krakoa is mutants being pro-active when 99% of the mutants have no say in anything about Krakoa.The government is self elected and the people have no idea what's going on w/in the council and have no way to object.Pretty sure a lot of mutants don't want Shaw and Sinister to be their leaders.

    Also say what you will about Krakoa but the X-men wouldn't agree to all this.After all this time some of them maybe, but all of them being okay w/ this out of nowhere isn't it.
    Last edited by Spiderfan001; 12-23-2021 at 11:09 AM.

  4. #94
    Astonishing Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reigna View Post
    Krakoa is good for mutants and has enabled them not only to survive but thrive.
    I don’t care for the mutants. I cared for the X-men and I don’t like their characterization changed.
    “Strength is the lot of but a few privileged men; but austere perseverance, harsh and continuous, may be employed by the smallest of us and rarely fails of its purpose, for its silent power grows irresistibly greater with time.” Goethe

  5. #95
    Mighty Member scourge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Alpha View Post
    That's it exactly. Krakoa triggers two kinds of people: the ones that hate anything different than X-men sitting on a mansion playing baseball and getting bombed, and the ones that hate minorities being aggressive and pro-active.
    Or y'know...people who hate massive retcons that make little sense, bad writing, random changes to characterizations...

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    I don’t care for the mutants. I cared for the X-men and I don’t like their characterization changed.
    Well you can go cry marvel a river then.

  7. #97
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Well, I'm expecting the mansion and familiar status quo will be in the MCU one way or another...and, granted, I don't think they'll get as explicitly bad for Mutants as the comics have.

  8. #98
    Astonishing Member Kingdom X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    I don’t care for the mutants. I cared for the X-men and I don’t like their characterization changed.
    Seems odd to not care about the group whose rights the X-Men have been fighting for, for decades. I understand if that's not ALL you care about... but to each their own I guess.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by scourge View Post
    Or y'know...people who hate massive retcons that make little sense, bad writing, random changes to characterizations...
    Terrible government systems, death pits, the idea you need to let yourself get beaten to death to get back something your were born with, weird neocolonialism in spots, Sinister being a mutant despite the fact that he essentially appropriated that identity, Magneto flipping his lid at the idea that a diplomat brought a gun when he can kill that entire room with a paper clip. But you know, it’s just we don’t like change or empowered minorities.

  10. #100
    Astonishing Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    Christ please tell me this isn't gonna be another thread where not liking Krakoa or Hickmans writing is treated as being the same as being a bigot against real, actual minorities who cannot fly or blow up buildings with a thought?

  11. #101
    Astonishing Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Alpha View Post
    That's it exactly. Krakoa triggers two kinds of people: the ones that hate anything different than X-men sitting on a mansion playing baseball and getting bombed, and the ones that hate minorities being aggressive and pro-active.
    Oops, spoke too soon, it's already devolved into that.

    Look, the Xmen and mutants being allegories for minorities does not automatically make criticizing story elements or writing as being bigotry against real, actual, people. Especially because, you know, real minorities who can't use mind control or wipe memories at a whim or declare themselves rulers of the earth because of their genetic superiority.
    Last edited by gonnagiveittoya; 12-23-2021 at 11:29 AM.

  12. #102
    Astonishing Member The Kid's Avatar
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    I love Krakoa. Beyond just the great points brought up in the OP, it's a significantly fresher status quo than the tired mansion stuff which had been old years ago. Need MCU to start with Krakoa to firmly establish this going forward

  13. #103
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Kid View Post
    I love Krakoa. Beyond just the great points brought up in the OP, it's a significantly fresher status quo than the tired mansion stuff which had been old years ago. Need MCU to start with Krakoa to firmly establish this going forward
    I don't see how that could work unless they jump, somehow, straight into the X-Men without much of a fresher because they expect people know enough from the Fox movies because Krakoa only really works with a degree of continuity and experience with what Mutants had gone through and what their usual MO was prior to Krakoa.

    There would also probably be a lot scaled back for Krakoa and maybe "sanitize" it a little. Like instead of a Quiet Council it would probably be a more traditional government, if it's even treated as a nation at all and not a Superhero headquarters.

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Kid View Post
    I love Krakoa. Beyond just the great points brought up in the OP, it's a significantly fresher status quo than the tired mansion stuff which had been old years ago. Need MCU to start with Krakoa to firmly establish this going forward
    It's not going to work because of the sheer amount of build-up needed. You'd either have to make massive adjustments to the story behind it to fit it in or pretend that some pre-existing film cannon was cannon to the MCU to handle at least some of the set-up...which would be the Fox stuff. Too much of Krakoa is dependent on things that have happened in the past comics continuity, things that the general public is definitely not familiar with because the Fox films never touched them, and the animated shows touched on a little more but nowhere near enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    Oops, spoke too soon, it's already become that.
    To be fair, at least one person has said that they only care about the X-men and not mutants specifically but that's probably not them being an actual bigot, and yeah....getting really tired of any criticism of this brand new era has to be because I'm a bigot who hates empowered minorities. Because you know, criticizing them having the genocidal nazi monster who appropriated their minority status as a member of their government is being a bigot. You do realize we can criticize the Krakoan government for being stupid, corrupt, or morally questionable without hating on the ideas of minorities people?

    Seriously, if I tried to defend Chuck Austen's run with the idea that any critiscism of the xmen is being I'm pretty sure you all would crucify me virtually over it.

  15. #105
    Astonishing Member The Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I don't see how that could work unless they jump, somehow, straight into the X-Men without much of a fresher because they expect people know enough from the Fox movies because Krakoa only really works with a degree of continuity and experience with what Mutants had gone through and what their usual MO was prior to Krakoa.

    There would also probably be a lot scaled back for Krakoa and maybe "sanitize" it a little. Like instead of a Quiet Council it would probably be a more traditional government, if it's even treated as a nation at all and not a Superhero headquarters.
    Like you said, people do generally know the mutants and their deal from the old movies and just like Spider-Man, I expect the MCU to do very different stuff from old movies to differentiate their take and they have a habit of taking from recent comics. They just need to establish the mutants, where they are coming from, and use a mutant island nation as sanctuary and you start telling stories there. Also, Quiet Council works fine as it would be like a council of mutants all with a vote

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