Which post HoX title most missed the mark for you and why

[BobbysWorld]

Basically just what the title says.

For instance, although I enjoy a lot about the current slate and status quo, and I've got plenty of other criticisms than just this, the reason I started this thread in particular is I was thinking about how much X-Force feels like a 'the writer didn't understand the assignment' situation, lol. I mean obviously the X-office approved Percy's story threads, and part of the problem is I don't think Percy's really that great of a writer (particularly with ensemble casts, I think Wolverine is at least better and I think he's probably just better suited for solo character titles).

But the bigger problem for me is just like....this book really doesn't live up to the concept of 'the sanctioned off the books espionage network of a new nation of mutants' IMO. Its literally just the same three mutants going out on shoot 'em up missions while Sage says stuff on the computers, Forge invents deus ex machina machinery, Beast lurks shadily in the background and creates more problems than he solves, and Black Tom talks about himself in the third person in place of having a personality.

And sorry but that seems like just such an utter WASTE of 'the sanctioned off the books espionage network of an entire nation of mutants?' They're an entire ISLAND of mutants. They have shapeshifters, mutants with invisibility, teleporters, size changers, phasers, illusionists, and plenty of completely off the wall powers! Why are they acting like a probability manipulator, a psychic and a guy with claws and a healing a factor are the best they can field? (Not to mention nobody's really talking about the fact that Wolverine's famous healing factor does not make him nearly as integral for life or death missions now that they all have resurrection. After all, Quentin's taken far more damage than Logan has pretty much since the book started).

If you're gonna get shady with Krakoan politics and mutant powers, like, at least GO for it, y'know? Why don't they have a clairvoyant on staff, remote viewing their enemies? Send in one of their 'equivalents of a walking weapon of mass destruction' to infiltrate one of their enemies' most secure locations to intimidate them with the demonstration of how Krakoans can get to someone no matter where they are. Recruit someone like Cipher, a mutant from the short-lived Young X-Men title who can walk through walls, turn invisible AND make people forget her presence once she's gone! Have psychics plant telepathic bombs in the brains of people who find out Krakoan state secrets that are 'programmed' to go off and wipe the memories of that from their heads if they try and share that information. Get a power replicator like Mimic on the team so they can shadily make use of the power of any mutant they can't just ask to go on a particular mission because they know they'd never be down with it for moral reasons. Reveal that a rival head of state's beloved new pet is actually a Krakoan shapeshifter in disguise, constantly in telepathic contact with someone back on Krakoa. Trick enemies like Xeno or Mikhail into a reality warper or illusionist's hands so they think they're working with their colleagues and reveal details about their plans unknowingly. Flip a Russian mutant in Mikhail's organization by offering them a guaranteed get out of jail free resurrection card if the Russians find out about their betrayal. Use mutant healers and biokinetics to 'infect' the genetically engineered soldiers sent against them with some kind of artificially devised virus that makes their modifications break down or turn against them. Have the Quiet Council reach out to Arakko and warn them about how much damage Sentinels have done to mutants over the years and try and convince them to have Lactuca find the locations where various governments are stockpiling Sentinels and then send technopaths in secret via teleporters/phasers/invisible mutants to plant kill switches in the robots instead of just destroying them, so they don't make more Sentinels thinking they have some ready to use only to have them explode only upon activation.

There's literally SO MUCH they could be DOING with this book, and they're not even trying! LMAO. Like I get that its supposed to be shady as hell and we're not supposed to like a lot of the decisions the characters are making, but the bigger problem this particular book has IMO is that its just so BORING. I LIKE Domino, hell, I even like Quentin and Black Tom and don't actually hate Logan when he's used well, but like. I just do not understand how a writer given a book that's literally just 'mutant spies, assassins and black ops with total carte blanche to do whatever they think is necessary to protect Krakoa,' like, looked at the literally THOUSANDS of mutants available at this point to choose from, and went hmmm, I'll take Wolverine....Kid Omega....Domino....and eh, that's it. That's all this book needs.

Just....c'mon Marvel!

[ericng]

I think this will be revealed in the X-Books Award voting 2021.

Have you voted yet for the worst title?

[BobbysWorld]

I think this will be revealed in the X-Books Award voting 2021.

Have you voted yet for the worst title?

Well I was looking for something where people could expand on what they were hoping for from particular books or what they felt was lacking, y'know? That sorta topic.

[AppleJ]

Truthfully I could tell X-Force was not for me within the first several issues. It really turned into the body horror book, which isn't something I have an extensive desire to read month after month. Also watching Beast continue to devolve into an ethically bankrupt monster brings me no joy either.

But I would love to read the version of this book you are envisioning BobbysWorld! That sounds far more interesting. More espionage! I'd think breaching some relevant topics like the ethical quandary of surveillance of your own population to root out dissent would also be intriguing.

For me though, Excalibur has been my biggest and most bitter disappointment of this era. I love fantasy as a genre. I was curious to see exactly what "mutant magic" was supposed to be. The cast had my two favorite characters and another two of my top 10, including lots of strong personalities that should have played off each other in such a fun way. It had a great artist.

And the whole thing has been a miserable experience for me as a reader. It has never been made clear what mutant magic is or how it's any different from a mutant technology circuit. It basically isn't. And even there, the circuit they create only the one time isn't that creative or even that interesting, especially compared to the ones in other books like SWORD. The characters have been generally stiff and one dimensional and unpleasant in their interactions with each other. They just wander from aimless mission to mission without questioning what they're being asked to do. I truly don't understand most of their motivation. Action sequences are skipped on the regular and we are told instead of shown what happens many times. This is supposed to bring Betsy into this new role, but she's absolutely terrible at it. Why any of the characters continue to stay on a team they never chose in the first place is completely unclear and unjustified. The majority of the fairly small cast is underutilized. Plot threads are started and then dropped so often that the whole thing feels unmoored in it's purpose and direction. What they are doing in Otherworld feels very questionable, yet nobody seems to care - invading a foreign land and installing your own government? We're good with that, Krakoa? It's hard to empathize with the mutants in this scenario as they feel more like the aggressors than the heroes. It's not made clear why what they're doing is right or necessary.

I thought we would be in for fun adventures through all these new worlds, but it's been more like a miserable pointless dungeon crawl. And you don't really get to hang out to worldbuild anywhere because the characters are yanked out of each place before you get to know it or the characters living in it.

And now Marvel is slapping a new coat of paint on it and a shiny new name to give us more of the same? No thanks. Count me out.

[Saithor]

So…I’m not going to lie, it’s going to be a four way tie for me. I’m not sure if we are counting miniseries as titles, but if they are, then it’s X-men Green/X-Corps/Excalibur/Marauders

Marauders had the nice initial pitch of being about mutant pirates but quickly just devolved into an Emma solo focused on the hellfire club shenanigans which I could not care about and made very little sense. How they handled Shaw was dumb, they should have reported what he tried to do, not try to extort him, which I am sure is going to blow up in their faces and both Emma and Kate should be smarter about. Also the other villains…I have never liked the Hellfire brats. They’re concept is dumb, I seriously hate the fact that they are taken seriously, and they drag down the book whenever they show up.

Excalibur someone else outlined most the reasons for, but as a fan of A Crooked World I also find the use of Jaspers and the Fury just disappointing, and some other plot points I was unable to buy. (The best option to take over Avalon is the insane reality warper who used to be a slave trader. What?)

X-corps was mostly just dull mixed with my pet peeve trend of writers in this era trying to sweep villains past misdeeds under the rug, this time with Mastermind. Also Selene torturing someone treated as a good thing.

X-men Green was a supposedly pro-enviorimental book that instead reads like a far-right screed about the dangers of he Sierra Club. From Nature Girl killing blue collar workers for trying to earn a wage to portraying those workers as malicious people who want nothing but destruction of the environment while quietly ignoring anything that might indicate you know, it might be the rich people in charge causing this, which, for crying out loud, even DC runs with that. Then she tries to pollute the envioriment immensely by blowing up an oil refinery. She’s accompanied by a sociopathic side kick who gets more annoying the more screen time she has. Her secondary mutation is literally an electric shaver and some greasepaint. Wolverine is here because why the **** not? Black Mamba and Sauron are here and threatening the readers that they’ll have sex because why not? Random dream sequence where Duggan makes fun of fan complaints about the manager’s murder. A really anti-climatic ending where nothing really happens. Then Cypher let’s them go because Krakoa too knows the joys of strangling a courtesy clerk to death, and they boat off into the sunset while Duggan decides to threaten the readership with their return.

Oh, and this was supposed to be the X-office’s contribution to Marvel Infinity.

[Pumpkin King]

For me, it was Marauders, with the same complaints I've had for pretty much the entire run. What was presented as a pirate-themed team book starring Kate, Emma, Storm, Bishop, Iceman and Pyro turned very quickly into a Kate and Emma solo, and leaned heavily into Hellfire club shenanigans instead of the "rescuing stranded mutants" idea that was supposed to be the team mission statement. I could have forgiven the shift in plotline, but not the way so much of the supposed main cast was neglected throughout the book. The trio of Bishop, Iceman and Pyro especially were lucky if they even got to appear and have dialogue, much less any kind of real character development. Why didn't Duggan just call the book Hellfire, or "The Adventures of Emma and Kate" from the very beginning. It was frustrating because I thought it was honestly a fun book, and Duggan could write good character moments for the characters he actually cared about, he was just VERY selective of which characters got that treatment.

Also, X-Men Green was a weird mess, and seemed like a complete misfire, either as an "environmental" story, or as a dark "Nature Girl goes down a misguided, violent path" story. Way to stab that store clerk, Nature Girl, you removed exactly zero plastic bags from the ocean by doing that.

[Journey]

Marauders was a failure unless you only read it for Emma & Kitty, Storm was worth nothing when she was on, Bishop was wasted, Bobby has had nothing this entire run, Pyro got the best he could hope for, but overall it was not a team book at all. Just a stealth duo series about Emma & Kitty.

[Nopozyzy]

All of them except for Hellions. But it's mostly because my favourite characters on each book are largely ignored and useless. Bishop, Sage, Chamber, Gambit, Jubilee. X-Corp was such a chore to enjoy. I just couldn't get into it despite being a Monet and Madrox fan. The art in Excalibur was pretty enough for me to try to ignore the poor writing but not in X-Corp.

[johnnysv75]

I really liked House of X. And I love Inferno. But nothing inbetween has felt as important as those books. It’s like the most interesting stories from HoX were forgotten until Inferno. So I am tempted to say … all of them?

But if I have to choose one, it is Excalibur. For all the reasons listed by AppleJ above.

[Starchilde]

X-Force is an absolute let-down for me. Initial plots interested me but all of them lose direction, the supposed villains are nowhere to be seen, nothing seems to be resolved, Wolverine is surfing now for some reason. Nothing excites me about the book anymore, unless the casual sighting of my girl Sage in some random panel.

[Nopozyzy]

If I had to choose just one it would be Excalibur as well. AppleJ explained it perfectly. It has one of the best rosters and a fantastic artist yet it makes me dislike some of my favourite characters.

[lurkerforyears]

I liked the main Hickman book, Hellions, SWORD and the mini with Nightcrawler and Legion by Spurrier.
The rest wasn't very good.

[CGAR]

Excalbiur was too seperate fromt the main threat of ORCHIS. I dont really care about patriotic heroes and the fantasy aspect of it either. It wasnt executed well.

And the issues with the human Clan Akkaba and the poitical aspect of it just wasnt done in the best way.

[Saithor]

Excalbiur was too seperate fromt the main threat of ORCHIS. I dont really care about patriotic heroes and the fantasy aspect of it either. It wasnt executed well.

And the issues with the human Clan Akkaba and the poitical aspect of it just wasnt done in the best way.

Honestly that and other parts of the later issues really felt like they wanted to do commentary on Britain's political issues, but they never really wanted to commit. Coven Akkaba just joins the legion of bland, forgettable, and unthreatening anti-mutant groups that fill the X-books these days. I can't even remember the names of the two..I think it's two most prominent members. If you want to do the commentary, Jasper is literally a former Tory Prime Minister. If you want to focus on the anti-mutant thing, make them actually threatening and not capable of being outplayed by a screaming Rictor.

[Aeon]

I must say that at the end, the whole Krakoa era became a let down for me. After starting actually strong, a lot of things rubbed my nose in the wrong way, the enemies living literally under the same roof with people they tried to murder more than once.

It became a Xavier, Magneto, Emma, Storm, and Kate show. A lot of editorial errors, dozens of underused characters again shoved in the background.

I stopped buying any more X issues.