"CHAOS Magic Woman!" Scarlet Witch/Wanda Maximoff Appreciation 2022

[GenericUsername]

Why should they waste her own iconic villain in an ensemble movie again, it's her personal story.

Because everything has to be given the the X-Men, lol.

[gurkle]

I don't think it matters if everything ends up colliding in the end. Saying for sure it means this or that anyway is a reach. The statement is very vague.

I mean remember when they talked about how they worked to make this a natural progression of Wanda's arc from "WandaVision," and then the movie came out and Elizabeth Olsen admitted that when she was filming WandaVision she never expected them to take Wanda in this direction, and didn't know how to make the two stories match up?

I know they have to pretend that everything is interconnected and planned out, but it's very obvious that this isn't true and movies are constantly ignoring what came before (and that's not even a bad thing in itself, if the story is good).

They drop vague hints of things to come, whether it's Thanos or the (sigh) incursions, but nothing is set in stone.

[GenericUsername]

I mean remember when they talked about how they worked to make this a natural progression of Wanda's arc from "WandaVision," and then the movie came out and Elizabeth Olsen admitted that when she was filming WandaVision she never expected them to take Wanda in this direction, and didn't know how to make the two stories match up?

I know they have to pretend that everything is interconnected and planned out, but it's very obvious that this isn't true and movies are constantly ignoring what came before (and that's not even a bad thing in itself, if the story is good).

They drop vague hints of things to come, whether it's Thanos or the (sigh) incursions, but nothing is set in stone.

Yeah we have no idea what to gleam from what they say. Especially when they sometimes lie to prevent spoilers. And I never take vague statements to mean 100% whatever I want to happen will happen.

Whatever will happen will. I just hope it has a better script than ITMoM. And honestly will not look forward to it if it's something Waldron is involved with.

[Lucky99]

I just finished watching the movie 3 hours ago...wow....

[Gnostic]

Anyway I doubt he's talking about Children's Crusade because that story is about Wanda's kids looking for her, and the kids we saw in this other universe are specifically not our Wanda's kids, and their mother is still fine at the end of the film.

If there is a Children's Crusade project it will be about the Billy and Tommy from WandaVision, who never appear in this movie and are discussed as though they didn't exist. But they're the only versions of the characters who would consider looking for our Wanda.

Children's Crusade was also about Billy and Tommy protecting Wanda from being arrested by the Avengers and killed by the X-Men. They could definitely use that as the premise with 838 Wanda being hunted by the 838 Mordo and some members of the Avengers, X-Men, Fantastic Four, and Inhumans. Mordo and some of the other Illuminati thought that Strange was a threat due to what his variant did and he would likely think the same about Wanda.

Why should they waste her own iconic villain in an ensemble movie again, it's her personal story.

Again?

[Lucky99]

I would kind of like the idea of stopping toxic sexist **** for Wanda. You gotta be kidding me. Seriously, she's become this wish list of all the worst sexist tropes. And usually it revolves around something X-Men. What is up with that?

What's the issue? During her show, the fans had House of M trending every week. And Elizabeth Olsen is obsessed with interacting with her X family too. She just whopped the **** out of the Avengers...let's keep the fun going. In the end, she still did the right thing. We all knew she would.

[GenericUsername]

Children's Crusade was also about Billy and Tommy protecting Wanda from being arrested by the Avengers and killed by the X-Men. They could definitely use that as the premise with 838 Wanda being hunted by the 838 Mordo and some members of the Avengers, X-Men, Fantastic Four, and Inhumans. Mordo and some of the other Illuminati thought that Strange was a threat due to what his variant did and he would likely think the same about Wanda.



Again?

It wasn't completely about that. They had to search and find her first. And the Avengers were not there to arrest her. They sided with her while the X-Men wanted to arrest her and have her pay for her crimes. HoM was when the X-Men wanted to kill her. And initially Cyke had a line in TCC to burn the witch, but that was later edited out. They were gonna take her and have her stand trial for her crimes. But the Avengers felt she would not get a fair trial.

And they could choose to put that in movies. But it might also be very boring. They didn't even do that with Bucky, and he had a huge trial in comics.

And what do you mean about again? They didn't flesh out any of the stuff with Chthon.

[GenericUsername]

What's the issue? During her show, the fans had House of M trending every week. And Elizabeth Olsen is obsessed with interacting with her X family too. She just whopped the **** out of the Avengers...let's keep the fun going. In the end, she still did the right thing. We all knew she would.

That's because her show was basically HoM. Without all the plot device stuff. It had her create a false reality and Vision play the Wolverine role. But the key is, she still had autonomy and agency. Where she didn't in ITMoM, nor AD, Nor HoM. Most people rooting for HoM never read that actual event to know it was mostly Wolverine trying to get people to see it was false reality, while Wanda was basically wallpaper.

Feats are not character development. Winning battle boards =/= the character winning. I don't care who she can beat. I care if she's a fully developed character and not boiled down to some one note, possessed presence.

[gurkle]

Children's Crusade was also about Billy and Tommy protecting Wanda from being arrested by the Avengers and killed by the X-Men. They could definitely use that as the premise with 838 Wanda being hunted by the 838 Mordo and some members of the Avengers, X-Men, Fantastic Four, and Inhumans. Mordo and some of the other Illuminati thought that Strange was a threat due to what his variant did and he would likely think the same about Wanda.

Maybe, but it feels like something they would do in a What If. Probably due to the constant rewrites, the alternate universe Wanda had no personality and only one major line of dialogue, and her Billy and Tommy had no personalities either. Not much to build on.

The rumors about a Children's Crusade adaptation in the MCU suggest it would be something like Young Avengers, where Wanda has disappeared after committing a horrible crime that has the entire superhero community against her. And it's with the main universe that they've been setting up Young Avengers, as well as Wanda's crime.

The fact that America Chavez only knows her as a cackling supervillain trying to kill her is in some ways a good setup, similar to the original Young Avengers where she killed Cassie's father, but more personal (Cassie wanted to search for Wanda so she could bring her dad back to life, as she ended up doing; America would probably side with the adults who just don't want to find her at all).

[Lucky99]

That's because her show was basically HoM. Without all the plot device stuff. It had her create a false reality and Vision play the Wolverine role. But the key is, she still had autonomy and agency. Where she didn't in ITMoM, nor AD, Nor HoM. Most people rooting for HoM never read that actual event to know it was mostly Wolverine trying to get people to see it was false reality, while Wanda was basically wallpaper.

Feats are not character development. Winning battle boards =/= the character winning. I don't care who she can beat. I care if she's a fully developed character and not boiled down to some one note, possessed presence.

There was development..she knew she went too far and was definitely heroic at the end. I mean..let's be real..the Xavier part showed she wasn't herself and it was the Darkhold.

[gurkle]

There was development..she knew she went too far and was definitely heroic at the end. I mean..let's be real..the Xavier part showed she wasn't herself and it was the Darkhold.

Unfortunately I think the Xavier part was showing that the "good" Wanda was being controlled by our own evil Wanda.

It does seem like the Darkhold was controlling her because she snapped out of it and went right back to being the character we know, but that really came out of nowhere and the movie really kind of went back and forth on how much of this was her own choice, since all they said is the Darkhold "corrupts," with no rules or logic about how it corrupts or what people are responsible for under its influence.

They didn't care to make her motivations make sense and just used the Darkhold as an all-purpose excuse for her total change in personality and motivations.

[GenericUsername]

There was development..she knew she went too far and was definitely heroic at the end. I mean..let's be real..the Xavier part showed she wasn't herself and it was the Darkhold.

The heroic at the end just retraced WV when she let everyone go. She sacrifices herself. She doesn't really face what she did and try to correct it. Now don't get me wrong, no part of me believes she's actually dead or anything. So I do think they'll have redemption. But there was nothing that forwarded her from WV. She basically goes through a meltdown again, now with the Darkhold making it worse. It doesn't matter if it was the Darkhold. That gives her no agency. And it doesn't really do anything new with her character. I'm not wowed by power wank. For me, once Wanda got reality warping, her characterization went into the toilet.

[GenericUsername]

Unfortunately I think the Xavier part was showing that the "good" Wanda was being controlled by our own evil Wanda.

It does seem like the Darkhold was controlling her because she snapped out of it and went right back to being the character we know, but that really came out of nowhere and the movie really kind of went back and forth on how much of this was her own choice.

They didn't care to make her motivations make sense and just used the Darkhold as an all-purpose excuse for her total change in personality and motivations.

There is that. It wasn't the same Wanda.

[MaximoffTrash]

There was development..she knew she went too far and was definitely heroic at the end. I mean..let's be real..the Xavier part showed she wasn't herself and it was the Darkhold.

They regressed her first though.

[gurkle]

I'm not wowed by power wank. For me, once Wanda got reality warping, her characterization went into the toilet.

Plus her range of powers was actually severely restricted. Her "spontaneous creation" power from WandaVision, the thing the entire plot ran on, was almost totally ignored. In the fights, she was really just back to telepathy and telekinesis, it's just that her red energy was stronger than yellow energy for some reason. Anyone hoping to see her use the new tricks she learned would be disappointed.

Again, broken record, but you can look at any aspect of her portrayal in this film and see that it would be basically the same if WandaVision had never happened, which isn't surprising since the story was developed independently of the show.