"CHAOS Magic Woman!" Scarlet Witch/Wanda Maximoff Appreciation 2022

[gurkle]

I'm not really going to blame him for the story because Raimi and Feige had more power over that than him. And because Raimi hasn't given a lot of interviews about the movie (except for the one where he admitted he nver saw all of "WandaVision" and hadn't known the show existed until he and Waldron were mostly finished plotting this story out) he's sort of been sent out there a lot to explain what went on, so he takes more blame, especially because Raimi and Feige have done a lot of good work in the past and he doesn't have anything like their track record.

Even as a script about Wanda being evil though, it's not very good for reasons that have been gone into a lot, and even the good reviews mention the script is weak, as they should. He deserves blame for that. But I believe him when he says the plan was always for Wanda to go bad. I don't like it but it's obvious Feige thinks, or thought, Wanda needed to be disgraced in the eyes of the superhero community like she was before Children's Crusade, and her crimes in Westview weren't bad enough (Strange even mentions that he's not mad about it because she did the right thing in the end). Now everyone hates her and thinks her kids weren't real and apparently that's what Feige thinks is "true to the comics."

I hope her rumored solo project happens, and it feels like it might if they greenlit an Agatha spinoff, but I doubt the original plan was to bring her back until her kids went looking for her.

[Cruelrain]

“She doesn’t want to torture them. She’s not a villain. She’s suffering. She wants her children like [Waldron] wrote… [She’s] just someone who loves too deeply and will do anything to be with the one she loves.”

— Sam Raimi on the ScarletWitch in MultiverseOfMadness

https://twitter.com/scarletwnews/sta...Vk5iMhSMNFqLqQ

Well he difinitely filmed it in a way that clearly makes her a villain that someone could not empathize with as hard i would want to.

[CJStriker]

^^^^^HA, You beat me too it Cruelrain.

[GenericUsername]

I'm not really going to blame him for the story because Raimi and Feige had more power over that than him.

I wouldn't blame him alone if his takes weren't just so bad.

[Galerion]

She had a bit of a Carmen Sandiego thing going (before Carmen Sandiego was a thing) on the cover of one of her best guest appearances, Power Man & Iron Fist 102 by Busiek and Howell, where she secretly hires Luke and Danny to guard a mystic idol.



Speaking of that issue, I love how it portrays her as a huge ham who loves to do things in the most dramatic way possible, like putting on a fake French accent for Luke and Danny or gently chiding Vision for having "no sense of drama." And then explains it by calling back to the early Avengers issue where she mentions she wants to be an actress (but so did a lot of Stan Lee heroines).

Hehe how ironic seeing as it's now the other way around.

You know what that also reminds me of? People like Wanda should be really wealthy. Like there is no chance she wouldn't be. People with specialized skills and knowledge are rare and therefore always in demand and accordingly highly compensated for it. Doesn't matter if we are talking about CEOs, doctors, athletes, entertainment stars, leading politicians, etc.
And even in the Marvel Universe with all its crazy stuff happening most people are just normal humans living their life. There would be tons of people lining and paying good money for someone like Wanda to work a bit of magic for them and Im not even talking about anything morally questionable here though those things would exist too.
Even if Wanda wouldn't care about worldly possesions that much she could give that money to people who she thinks need it more than her. There is no downside to it.


So have there been any references to Wandas financial situation?
Obviously she is not someone like Tony Stark or Bruce Wayne who are characters that are built on being wealthy so I don't expect constant references to it but Im curious if someone every really thought this through.

[GenericUsername]

Hehe how ironic seeing as it's now the other way around.

You know what that also reminds me of? People like Wanda should be really wealthy. Like there is no chance she wouldn't be. People with specialized skills and knowledge are rare and therefore always in demand and accordingly highly compensated for it. Doesn't matter if we are talking about CEOs, doctors, athletes, entertainment stars, leading politicians, etc.
And even in the Marvel Universe with all its crazy stuff happening most people are just normal humans living their life. There would be tons of people lining and paying good money for someone like Wanda to work a bit of magic for them and Im not even talking about anything morally questionable here though those things would exist too.
Even if Wanda wouldn't care about worldly possesions that much she could give that money to people who she thinks need it more than her. There is no downside to it.


So have there been any references to Wandas financial situation?
Obviously she is not someone like Tony Stark or Bruce Wayne who are characters that are built on being wealthy so I don't expect constant references to it but Im curious if someone every really thought this through.

There use to be a reference somewhere of earnings of Avengers. I remember Wanda wasn't even on the list. I don't remember where or when it was though. Just some fun thing. Those things use to get posted on the forums too but I haven't seen one in a long while.

[gurkle]

Hehe how ironic seeing as it's now the other way around.

What's the other way around?

You know what that also reminds me of? People like Wanda should be really wealthy. Like there is no chance she wouldn't be. People with specialized skills and knowledge are rare and therefore always in demand and accordingly highly compensated for it. Doesn't matter if we are talking about CEOs, doctors, athletes, entertainment stars, leading politicians, etc.
And even in the Marvel Universe with all its crazy stuff happening most people are just normal humans living their life. There would be tons of people lining and paying good money for someone like Wanda to work a bit of magic for them and Im not even talking about anything morally questionable here though those things would exist too.
Even if Wanda wouldn't care about worldly possesions that much she could give that money to people who she thinks need it more than her. There is no downside to it.


So have there been any references to Wandas financial situation?
Obviously she is not someone like Tony Stark or Bruce Wayne who are characters that are built on being wealthy so I don't expect constant references to it but Im curious if someone every really thought this through.

Like a lot of mutant characters she has almost never been portrayed as having a real job, I don't know why. (Scott Summers was a radio talk show host for like one issue and that's one more job than most mutants have had.) There have been references to the fact that she and Vision get a salary as Avengers, and in 1983 or so the salary was established as $1,000 a week, which would be about three times that today -- not bad money considering they get free room and board, but nothing like they could make in private business.

In the Vision & the Scarlet Witch maxiseries it's mentioned that they agree to let Peter Parker do a magazine feature about their house so they can make some extra money, because they've resigned from the Avengers and have to live off their savings. But again, neither of them ever bother to get a regular job.

In the end a lot of superhero team members are like sitcom characters -- they somehow always have enough money to do whatever the plot needs them to do, but we don't ever see them working to get it. So after Wanda and Pietro left the Brotherhood they were living in a Swiss Chalet, but where did they get the money to pay for it? Lee and Kirby didn't know and we sure don't.

[Galerion]

What's the other way around?

Being portrayed by an actress herself. Granted Olsen probably didn't want to be Wanda more than anything before being offered the role so it's technically not 100% correct but you know what I mean. Moving on.

Like a lot of mutant characters she has almost never been portrayed as having a real job, I don't know why. (Scott Summers was a radio talk show host for like one issue and that's one more job than most mutants have had.) There have been references to the fact that she and Vision get a salary as Avengers, and in 1983 or so the salary was established as $1,000 a week, which would be about three times that today -- not bad money considering they get free room and board, but nothing like they could make in private business.

In the Vision & the Scarlet Witch maxiseries it's mentioned that they agree to let Peter Parker do a magazine feature about their house so they can make some extra money, because they've resigned from the Avengers and have to live off their savings. But again, neither of them ever bother to get a regular job.

In the end a lot of superhero team members are like sitcom characters -- they somehow always have enough money to do whatever the plot needs them to do, but we don't ever see them working to get it. So after Wanda and Pietro left the Brotherhood they were living in a Swiss Chalet, but where did they get the money to pay for it? Lee and Kirby didn't know and we sure don't.

There was also her her Manhattan home in her solo series which gave off an expensive "old world" vibe.







But I guess you are right about this dynamic. If your character is not being built with having wealth in mind than nobody bothers with bringing up the topic. For some reason this topic really struck me when I was watching WandaVision. She was an Avenger and saved the world and everybody knows it too. People are literally talking about it in the show. How is this person not a celebrity at that point? Granted it's revisionist history but in Ms. Marvel there is apparently even Wanda merchandise in-universe. It really goes against how this stuff works in real-life.

[Galerion]

Also Im sure some of you have already seen it already but someone from the set of MoM shared his work on the sculptures in Wundagore and that boy is confirmed to be Billy.

https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudi...re_sculptures/







So I guess they are really leaning into the whole reincarnation/Demiurge business which also makes Children Crusade coming more likely

[CJStriker]

I'm not really going to blame him for the story because Raimi and Feige had more power over that than him. And because Raimi hasn't given a lot of interviews about the movie (except for the one where he admitted he nver saw all of "WandaVision" and hadn't known the show existed until he and Waldron were mostly finished plotting this story out) he's sort of been sent out there a lot to explain what went on, so he takes more blame, especially because Raimi and Feige have done a lot of good work in the past and he doesn't have anything like their track record.

Even as a script about Wanda being evil though, it's not very good for reasons that have been gone into a lot, and even the good reviews mention the script is weak, as they should. He deserves blame for that. But I believe him when he says the plan was always for Wanda to go bad. I don't like it but it's obvious Feige thinks, or thought, Wanda needed to be disgraced in the eyes of the superhero community like she was before Children's Crusade, and her crimes in Westview weren't bad enough (Strange even mentions that he's not mad about it because she did the right thing in the end). Now everyone hates her and thinks her kids weren't real and apparently that's what Feige thinks is "true to the comics."

I hope her rumored solo project happens, and it feels like it might if they greenlit an Agatha spinoff, but I doubt the original plan was to bring her back until her kids went looking for her.

I am just thinking on some things, Wasn't It Strange that said the Darkhold that took Wanda, and it was not her anymore, so how would Strange consider Wanda Bad in the Superhero community?! Also, was it not just Strange, Wong, America and those sorcerers that mostly fought Wanda from the MCU main universe, so most of the Superhero community of the MCU don't know this went down? I just think if only a few experienced this and Strange himself said it was the Darkhold would it not be fair they blame the Darkhold more than just Wanda in the movie?

Or it just does not really add up cause it is weak and bad writing.

As for the Writer compared to Raima and Feige, Yea he seems to be the only one out their trying to do what accounts to Damage Control for the outcome of the movie. While I like not to give him as much blame and it might be fair to consider that, he keeps putting his foot in his mouth like that quote about him telling use Wanda become the “V” word in WandaVision, while admitting that he knows nothing about the show by barely watching it. I do want to try to feel somewhat bad for him for so far taking this brunt, but he just keeps taking steps back, so I don’t know.

But indeed, Raimi and Fiege have been hiding cowardly in the wake of the movie Reaction and while there have been positives from some alike and fans still for the most part sticking with Wanda, I think the backlash we have seen to the movie has been one of the main reasons they have not talked about the movie to much, especially Fiege. I have only heard an unconfirmed rumor or so, but it just goes along with there is some backlash behind the scenes of the outcome of this movie and the usage of Wanda, even if that is just a remote amount, just a little combine with the articles about the MCU treating Wanda very Sexist and misogynistic, it believe enough it going on behind the Scenes we don’t know between Fiege, Marvel Studios and Disney over this controversial choices in the movie, it would not surprise me.

So, I think he is hiding cause he is spead so much time trying to figure out how to clean this mess up with the Studio and Disney, that is just a guess, but with Raimi’s recent comment, It sounds like they are in Damage Control mode.

[MaximoffTrash]

She had a bit of a Carmen Sandiego thing going (before Carmen Sandiego was a thing) on the cover of one of her best guest appearances, Power Man & Iron Fist 102 by Busiek and Howell, where she secretly hires Luke and Danny to guard a mystic idol.



Speaking of that issue, I love how it portrays her as a huge ham who loves to do things in the most dramatic way possible, like putting on a fake French accent for Luke and Danny or gently chiding Vision for having "no sense of drama." And then explains it by calling back to the early Avengers issue where she mentions she wants to be an actress (but so did a lot of Stan Lee heroines).

That time when she calls herself Miss Wonderly I remember.

[Albert1981]

Reallllllllyyyyyy….If this is the head writer, seriously all shorts of lies coming from the dude that admitted to barely watching the show to begin with, what a load of croc IMO.

Creators like these and the media outlets the empower them should be ashamed of themselves, they are not being accountable to their own canon and characters and if the MCU is going to go down a road where they keep telling fans you have to watch this and that but later make a new project and not take from the past projects ignoring the canon like the Intelligence of MoM did, then the MCU will be in a continuous decline from more and more tick-off fans.

Oh but don’t worry, parts of our so called In Power and our Voice on platforms will cover for these guys cause we did not see WandaVision the “WAY WE SHOULD” have seen it, we the loyal fans are just blind, defeat and dumb I suppose;

https://youtu.be/5BqfuHj2Edg

If you like the movie that is Fine and you have our full support here.

But it is a whole bunch of croc for others in areas of power that have justified problems with the film to cover-up for and tell us to clam-up towards what is at the very least lazy and controversial writings.

P.S.— I am sorry to get So Hot Under the collar, again if you Like MoM that is Great and you have support and understand here.

But what is getting me is that I keep being told what I Saw, What I heard, What I Experienced and what I talk at verbatim about over a year ago about WandaVision that somehow I then did not Watch the series and I am just dumbfounded to not see it like theses in higher power are telling me “HOW” I should have saw it. I just get so upset over that kind of history re-writing to cover-up for present day, clear as day and admitted to mistakes and not watching the said show in question, BUT WE the fans are wrong to question those mistakes and hold those in power at least to respectful questioning responsibility, we somehow have no right cause we are bias or uninformed.

I just had the great misfortune of watching the MoM today. And believe me, I TRIED to find some enjoyment from it. I went into it with a COMPLETELY open mind. And I have very lowbrow tastes (big fan of Maury and Judge Judy here) so it shouldn't be too hard to please me. Hell, I even enjoyed Thor 2 and Age of Ultron. But Strange 2 was as bad as advertised. I still can't believe Feige greenlit this project. This Strange sequel was an ABSOLUTE clusterfuck from beginning to end. I hated the music, editing, direction, script, and yes even the acting in it. I had NO idea what was going on throughout most of this film. I consider this picture to be even WORSE than Black Widow and the Eternals. At least those two movies made me laugh at times. Whatever happened to the Marvel humor that we know and love? Sure Wanda was treated badly in this movie, but so was practically everybody else in it (so they spread that bullshit around). I felt EMBARRASSED for Rachel McAdams. I thought Charlize Theron's costume looked ridiculous. Patrick Stewart's return as Professor X was just pathetic. I felt SO bad for Cumberbatch when he had to spew out THAT much cringe dialogue. I even HATED Wanda's and Clea's make-up in this picture. People didn't have conversations in this movie. Whenever characters talked in this film, at least eighty percent of the time they were just dumping exposition for future MCU projects I no longer have any interest in seeing. I feel really bad for Young Avengers fans. Because I think a LOT of audience members will NOT be interested in seeing these characters in later MCU movies and shows after how they were portrayed in the MoM. I don't know why people here are praising the performances from this movie. I thought they were AWFUL. Olsen's performance in WandaVision was FAR superior to hers in this one. I agree with other reviewers. I REALLY felt the absence of Agatha and Vision in this film. I always thought Olsen, Hahn and Bettany had the best rapport of any of the actors and actresses from the Disney Plus Marvel shows, and without that chemistry Wanda became REALLY boring to me. The magic system in Strange 2 was also nonsensical. Characters were pulling spells out of their asses with ease and flaunted them with almost no limitations. But they only used them some of the time because of "reasons". MoM tried to have some "emotional" moments, but EVERY single one of them fell flat for me. Wanda's "sacrifice" was a total JOKE. I'm still in shock this movie made nearly a billion dollars. Marvel Studios better be careful. After watching this movie and No Time to Die (and being thoroughly disappointed by each of them), it only confirmed my belief that movies/shows winning awards and enjoying great box office numbers does NOT reflect their quality AT ALL. Yes, Top Gun: Maverick and Everything Everywhere All at Once and the MoM were the "top" movies of 2022 so far. But people are STILL talking about TGM and EEAAO TODAY. Folks stopped giving a shit about Strange 2 a week after it came out. I REALLY hope Chapek and Feige understand that huge chunks of the MCU fanbase want them to slow the fuck down and stop saturating theaters and television screens with middling movies and shows. The strong momentum that the MCU got from WandaVision and NWH in 2021 has COMPLETELY stalled in my opinion. Marvel for the first time in years is actually not part of the cultural zeitgeist. And I agree with gurkle. I actually don't blame Waldron and Raimi for the MoM's failings. The responsibility lies with the top brass at Marvel Studios and at Disney. They were rushing things and trying to cram in too many storylines in Strange 2 for the benefit of other movies and shows. I read about the cast of Top Gun: Maverick participating in EXTREME training to give authenticity to their film and the actors and actresses doing SO many of their own stunts in EEAAO for the same reasons and I just think those two films DESERVE to be more well-received than the MoM because they simply put in more effort than the folks at Marvel Studios (the people who made the MoM didn't even watch WandaVision for Pete's sake). I think it's very telling that Scott Derrickson, executive producer of the MoM, stated on social media that:

"I won't see a better film this year than EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE. Absolute Masterpiece." And this was AFTER Strange 2 got released in theaters! ROFL!

And this is happening with the Star Wars franchise too. I see WAY more people talking about Stranger Things' latest season as opposed to the most current Star Wars offering.

[MaximoffTrash]

Also Im sure some of you have already seen it already but someone from the set of MoM shared his work on the sculptures in Wundagore and that boy is confirmed to be Billy.

https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudi...re_sculptures/







So I guess they are really leaning into the whole reincarnation/Demiurge business which also makes Children Crusade coming more likely

I honestly kinda hate how on the face it is, those statues literally had their face at a certain life stage.
Like 3D printed in moderm time than ancient statues.

[Albert1981]

“She doesn’t want to torture them. She’s not a villain. She’s suffering. She wants her children like [Waldron] wrote… [She’s] just someone who loves too deeply and will do anything to be with the one she loves.”

— Sam Raimi on the ScarletWitch in MultiverseOfMadness

https://twitter.com/scarletwnews/sta...Vk5iMhSMNFqLqQ

Well he difinitely filmed it in a way that clearly makes her a villain that someone could not empathize with as hard i would want to.

How is Wanda NOT a villain when she said to Reed before murdering him: "Is Their Mother (Sue, I presume) Still Alive? Good, There Will Be Someone Left To Raise Them." More horseshit from "family-friendly" Marvel Studios.

[Dipter]

I honestly kinda hate how on the face it is, those statues literally had their face at a certain life stage.
Like 3D printed in moderm time than ancient statues.

It was made with magic probably, that’s the mystical equivalent of 3D printing