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  1. #4291
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    Just jumping in to say that no one who likes this movie, or Wanda's role in it, is "wrong." It's just a silly superhero movie, and just because I take it too seriously doesn't mean I expect everyone else to be miserable along with me. Most people who enjoy it recognize the flaws in it, but so what? It can still be enjoyable

    Anyway I'm sorry if I gave the impression of making fans of the movie unwelcome.

  2. #4292
    Fantastic Member Cubbyboo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    Just jumping in to say that no one who likes this movie, or Wanda's role in it, is "wrong." It's just a silly superhero movie, and just because I take it too seriously doesn't mean I expect everyone else to be miserable along with me. Most people who enjoy it recognize the flaws in it, but so what? It can still be enjoyable

    Anyway I'm sorry if I gave the impression of making fans of the movie unwelcome.
    Simply put. Gurkle- you are loved. Lay your worries aside.

    So I work in fashion - clothing, hair and makeup. I talk with people of all ages nonstop. Lol almost all the models, male and female - when she's come up while chatting - love Wanda. Many called her Scarlet Witch as they knew her primarily from WV and LOVED it. They'd say "Oh yeah, I do remember her from Avengers now that you mention it. Lol - oh well! So, what I noticed was Wanda did become huge with Endgame - I agree totally with GenericUsername.

    Anyhow, what I noticed over the past few years was that fans plus a few more loved her on a new level after her Endgame battle with Thanos.
    WandaVision put her through the roof and gave her a whole new fanbase - almost anyone under 35 that I spoke to knew and loved WV, or at least knew of her from WV. Now with MoM everyone - even many elderly - know who she is and love her. I even know some who disliked her pre WV, changed their opinion with WV, and now adore her after MoM. Go figure?!!! That still makes me shake my head. With MoM as noted by CJ - many were worried that backlash from MoM's dark twist would hurt her popularity and it seems she now is more loved and popular than ever. Go figure again.

    I just hope the next movie is a solo and is a journey to redemption and self realization with a female screen writer somewhere in a decision making role that puts this journey on a positive and rewarding path for Wanda. I am LOVING all the figures, toys and merchandise tho:-)
    Last edited by Cubbyboo; 05-27-2022 at 03:18 PM.

  3. #4293
    Extraordinary Member Galerion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaximoffTrash View Post
    Too bad they have to use the movie for reference, otherwise pretty cool.
    It's limited to recoloring, asset mashing, etc. If only Bandai is not so goddamn anti-modding lol.
    To be fair I only know very few devs who are pro-modding. There are a ton who simply don't care but the ones actually supporting it are rare and from a business perspective it sadly makes sense. Even Bethesda got themselves into that paid mods fiasco.


    Quote Originally Posted by Cubbyboo View Post
    This looks cool. I wonder if she's playable right off bat for a newbie. I'd prob download if so. I had to go see the movie again with my dad LOL. He loved it. So that's good. He didn't feel Wanda was evil or irredeemable but that she was grief stricken and possessed by the Darkhold. So that's good audience reaction for someone who doesn't have any personal vested interest.


    Also please other Wanda fans -not Galerion obviously- if someone says they like the film don't give all the reasons they are wrong or have blanketed overtones of wtf is wrong with you? It's not my fave depiction when it could have been done with a better script and more balanced anger and redemption for Wanda - but that's my opinion and ofc I love her 70's heyday. But many love her now and of course this totally eclipses her 70's popularity. This film has sent her popularity into the stratosphere and she may well be an antihero in the future. Let newer fans who come here state why they love her and don't drive them away. I've noticed a few not returning. Everyone has a right to love her in whatever incarnation and not get pushback for that. Hell, I still love her Deodato Crossing look.

    The Hot Toys figure is really nice. I'm only gonna get one and preordered the WandaVision one. I like the MoM one but is the WandaVision one softer/prettier? Feel free to give input on that CJ you def come to mind there and anyone else who's seen them :-) omg all the merchandise out there. Lol gotta pick and choose - got the two cosbaby WandaVision figures. Adorable. The wal-mart exclusive MoM Scarlet funko is awesome. Just so much. Torn wether to splurge on the MoM 2 pack cosbaby of Strange/Scarlet Witch. I like the WV cosbaby's of her alone better tho the MoM is a cool one
    Welcome and I hope you enjoy your stay here.
    Now you basically hit the nail on the head there and I don't feel like getting into it that much because well Im sure I said the exact same thing here at some point. If there is a reasonable conversation to be had Im all for it. I mean that is kinda the point of a forum but I won't respond to certain type of posts anymore that don't lead to that. Simple as that and that is all I have to say about it.

    Funnily enough I took a look at the WandaVison figure again yesterday and for me it's the opposite. The WV one does have a softer expression and the makeup is lighter too so get where you are coming from. I guess I just prefer the more stern look of the MoM one. I also must say that Im not even that impressed from the $1000 one. It's obviously way bigger but something about it is just off. Can't really tell you what.
    Last edited by Galerion; 05-27-2022 at 03:34 PM.
    "This is me being reasonable"

  4. #4294
    Chaos bringer GenericUsername's Avatar
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    Those sites that sell the hot toys stuff do accept payments too, so you can stretch out things over a period of time to get what you like, even if you like both.
    Love is for souls, not bodies.

  5. #4295
    Extraordinary Member Galerion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    I understand what you're saying. I just think it would be better if magic in the MCU has some rules in it in order to create tension and drama. The Harry Potter franchise WAS really successful in its prime, but I don't think a lot of folks are satisfied with what's happening with it now. The magic definitely had too many inconsistencies in it in the last couple of the Potter films and frankly the retcons and the introduction of too many characters hurt them too. And they didn't that many sequels to tell their stories either. I do believe fans understand this on some level even if they're not really "aware" of it. I don't want the MCU's magical corner to suffer the same fate. I think "power creep" is happening with Wanda and Strange, and I would ground their powers with costs and limitations. I think it would be unwise for Disney to use magic as deus ex machinas in its Marvel movies and shows.

    I wonder if Agatha might not have been totally truthful about the spell. There's a lot we don't know about Chaos magic. We still don't know a lot about it. Maybe Wanda will "learn" how to fix the mistakes she made in Westview. I thought WandaVision didn't do a thorough job of exploring of Agatha's motivations. Like why did she want Wanda's powers so badly? Were they like energon cubes for her? They should have focused a little bit more on Wanda's and Agatha's relationship:

    Hahn stated that Agatha/Wanda had a Salieri/Mozart kind of relationship:

    “There’s something I loved between the relationship of Agatha and Wanda,” she said. “We [Hahn and Shakman] talked a lot about Amadeus and Salieri, in terms of their relationship — Agatha wishes that she could make the kind of music that the Scarlet Witch just had naturally. For someone that has spent centuries studying this, to meet a young person to whom it comes completely naturally, it’s maddening and you want to know why.” The dynamic that our director [Matt Shakman] kind of put in our head was like [Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart and Antonio Salieri]. Which I don’t know if you guys know that reference but Amadeus is a great movie from back in the day. And that’s kind of what our relationship was. Like, I wanted her power, but I also wanted to befriend her, I wanted to teach her, I wanted to learn from her, I wanted…all of it."

    Now most people on this thread I assume probably have NOT seen Amadeus, but I did when I was in music class decades ago. The movie was very entertaining, but I hated it how it did Salieri dirty. Agatha (Salieri) was the more experienced magic user, but recognized and was envious of Wanda's (Mozart's) natural talent. I assume Agatha (Salieri) was trying to manipulate Wanda (Mozart) for her own ends, but we still don't know why. I imagine this will be covered in Harkness's series. I think a Salieri/Mozart relationship between Agatha/Wanda is much more interesting than their relationship in the comic books if I'm being honest.
    I haven't seen it that way but are right and I would like if their relationship would continue with that undertone. Agatha has spent hundreds of years studying magic. Even magic that made her an enemy of her own coven and still she got upstaged by a novice who has never even learned the basics. All only because she was born different. That must sting and probably leads to some jealously.


    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    Those sites that sell the hot toys stuff do accept payments too, so you can stretch out things over a period of time to get what you like, even if you like both.
    Im not really a collector though and I don't have the space nor an extra display for stuff like that. So Im really selective about this stuff.
    "This is me being reasonable"

  6. #4296
    Fantastic Member Cubbyboo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galerion View Post
    To be fair I only know very few devs who are pro-modding. There are a ton who simply don't care but the ones actually supporting it are rare and from a business perspective it sadly makes sense. Even Bethesda got themselves into that paid mods fiasco.




    Welcome and I hope you enjoy your stay here.
    Now you basically hit the nail on the head there and I don't feel like getting into it that much because well Im sure I said the exact same thing here at some point. If there is a reasonable conversation to be had Im all for it. I mean that is kinda the point of a forum but I won't respond to certain type of posts anymore that don't lead to that. Simple as that and that is all I have to say about it.

    Funnily enough I took a look at the WandaVison figure again yesterday and for me it's the opposite. The WV one does have a softer expression and the makeup is lighter too so get where you are coming from. I guess I just prefer the more stern look of the MoM one. I also must say that Im not even that impressed from the $1000 one. It's obviously way bigger but something about it is just off. Can't really tell you what.
    Thanks. I hope you do also:-) It's a pretty awesome Wanda-centric place to hang out - when there's time, oh my lord. Both WandaVision and MoM Hot Toys figures are beautiful tbh. I really want the Age of Ultron one that's the limited edition red leather costume with rooted hair. Omg the prices are insane tho. Lol the MoM does wig me out a bit as the hair can be switched meaning she might have an odd look with a shaved frontal area when switching.Tho I'd never actually take her out (probably)
    Last edited by Cubbyboo; 05-27-2022 at 04:53 PM.

  7. #4297
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galerion View Post
    I haven't seen it that way but are right and I would like if their relationship would continue with that undertone. Agatha has spent hundreds of years studying magic. Even magic that made her an enemy of her own coven and still she got upstaged by a novice who has never even learned the basics. All only because she was born different. That must sting and probably leads to some jealously.




    Im not really a collector though and I don't have the space nor an extra display for stuff like that. So Im really selective about this stuff.
    Great minds think alike! I think Shakman was on to something with his Salieri/Mozart suggestion. But if you didn't see Wanda's and Agatha's relationship in that way during WandaVision, their execution obviously didn't "come off" properly. Why is that Wanda can cast spells without having to use Latin incantations while every other witch in the MCU's history has to? Wanda would have never neutralized Agatha's powers during their laser battle if she had to use incantations. Harkness would have been on to her FAST. So yes, I think the MCU should definitely continue to make Harkness's jealousy a key component of her relationship with Wanda. It wouldn't even make her a villain. Lots of viewers sympathized with Salieri in Amadeus. By the way, the fellow who played Salieri in Amadeus, F. Murray Abraham, also voiced Khonshu in Moon Knight (and he was hilarious in MK too). And Agatha DID say that she didn't steal any magical knowledge that was forbidden to her in Episode 8 of WandaVision when those other witches were accusing her of doing just that: “I did not break your rules. They simply bent to my power.” So I don't think Agatha is EVIL. The ONLY reason why Wanda is more powerful than the other witches in the MCU is because of some evil book and its prophecies.

    My argument on these threads has been really consistent. WandaVision should have given more screen time to Hahn. After the first two episodes of WandaVision, Agatha sort of faded away and only returned with a bang at the end of Episode 7. Vision separated from Wanda in Episode 5 and the tension between them was not really resolved smoothly. I think Fietro, Billy and Tommy and SWORD kind of took over at that point. WandaVision could have actually shown Harkness "hate teaching" magic to Wanda and Agatha growing increasingly unhinged with envy as time went on (with very funny results). That would have created so much more drama (and Agatha's motivations could have been revealed in the process). And it would have been so much more fun to have Wanda and Vision NOT separate and work things out slowly even though they were really mad at each other (this kind of thing happens to most families anyways). WandaVision was not as good when Olsen, Hahn and Bettany were not together. That's why I'm not a big fan of Disney's/Marvel's approach of having so many characters and storylines be inserted into these movies and shows. They lose focus of what's really important.

    And I find it's really weird that the MoM would apparently trash the idea of Wanda ever having a family in the main universe or whatever the MCU calls it these days. Wanda CLEARLY stated at the end of WandaVision to Vision, Billy and Tommy that: "A family is forever. We could never truly leave each other, even if we tried." I guess that's no longer the case then?! I mean, what happened here?!

  8. #4298
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galerion View Post
    To be fair I only know very few devs who are pro-modding. There are a ton who simply don't care but the ones actually supporting it are rare and from a business perspective it sadly makes sense. Even Bethesda got themselves into that paid mods fiasco.




    Welcome and I hope you enjoy your stay here.
    Now you basically hit the nail on the head there and I don't feel like getting into it that much because well Im sure I said the exact same thing here at some point. If there is a reasonable conversation to be had Im all for it. I mean that is kinda the point of a forum but I won't respond to certain type of posts anymore that don't lead to that. Simple as that and that is all I have to say about it.

    Funnily enough I took a look at the WandaVison figure again yesterday and for me it's the opposite. The WV one does have a softer expression and the makeup is lighter too so get where you are coming from. I guess I just prefer the more stern look of the MoM one. I also must say that Im not even that impressed from the $1000 one. It's obviously way bigger but something about it is just off. Can't really tell you what.
    Bandai is the publisher though, I just don't understand why they ban people for using mods that are simply model swapping/re-texturing that doesn't even affect the actual gameplay.(Capcom is pretty chill with Monster Hunter in that regard.)
    A big modding scene usually means longevity for the game, like Skyrim, Minecraft, Witcher 3, GTA5, Mount&Blade, etc granted it's not the only reason, but they help a lot.
    Also mod support comes in many forms, like releasing official modding tools(Bethesda and Valve) and giving open permission to resources(Witcher 3 assets are all over the place in other game's mods because CDPR straight up gave open permission.)
    Fromsoft games are actually nice foundation for modding, Dark Souls 3 has a lot of complete overhaul with custom bosses.
    InfernoPlus(A Youtuber and a mod author) straight up mod functioning firearms into Dark Souls 1.(He was formerly a Halo modder, yeah, the guns are from Halo lol.)
    Sorry to bring this off topic so much.

  9. #4299
    Chaos bringer GenericUsername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galerion View Post
    Im not really a collector though and I don't have the space nor an extra display for stuff like that. So Im really selective about this stuff.
    I'm in the same situation with limited room.
    Love is for souls, not bodies.

  10. #4300
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    Also for MoM, ToM, etc, I don't know, even if I flush out all my resentment there is still the feeling of time and commiment wasted.
    Basically Wanda's recent appearances in various media ranges from nearly all-out disaster, good outcome(which again, didn't lead to actual good stories later, she just went back to slumber.) with questionable process, or just medicore.(Ironically, her best recent showcase in terms of story is MFR of all things.)
    How long before I can have a complete and self-contained story arc I can look back at fondly of? How long before I can actually look forward to her next appearance without some existential dread?

    And really, getting gaslit about "MoM Wanda made total sense" surely doesn't help.

  11. #4301
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    Great minds think alike! I think Shakman was on to something with his Salieri/Mozart suggestion. But if you didn't see Wanda's and Agatha's relationship in that way during WandaVision, their execution obviously didn't "come off" properly. Why is that Wanda can cast spells without having to use Latin incantations while every other witch in the MCU's history has to? Wanda would have never neutralized Agatha's powers during their laser battle if she had to use incantations. Harkness would have been on to her FAST. So yes, I think the MCU should definitely continue to make Harkness's jealousy a key component of her relationship with Wanda. It wouldn't even make her a villain. Lots of viewers sympathized with Salieri in Amadeus. By the way, the fellow who played Salieri in Amadeus, F. Murray Abraham, also voiced Khonshu in Moon Knight (and he was hilarious in MK too). And Agatha DID say that she didn't steal any magical knowledge that was forbidden to her in Episode 8 of WandaVision when those other witches were accusing her of doing just that: “I did not break your rules. They simply bent to my power.” So I don't think Agatha is EVIL. The ONLY reason why Wanda is more powerful than the other witches in the MCU is because of some evil book and its prophecies.

    My argument on these threads has been really consistent. WandaVision should have given more screen time to Hahn. After the first two episodes of WandaVision, Agatha sort of faded away and only returned with a bang at the end of Episode 7. Vision separated from Wanda in Episode 5 and the tension between them was not really resolved smoothly. I think Fietro, Billy and Tommy and SWORD kind of took over at that point. WandaVision could have actually shown Harkness "hate teaching" magic to Wanda and Agatha growing increasingly unhinged with envy as time went on (with very funny results). That would have created so much more drama (and Agatha's motivations could have been revealed in the process). And it would have been so much more fun to have Wanda and Vision NOT separate and work things out slowly even though they were really mad at each other (this kind of thing happens to most families anyways). WandaVision was not as good when Olsen, Hahn and Bettany were not together. That's why I'm not a big fan of Disney's/Marvel's approach of having so many characters and storylines be inserted into these movies and shows. They lose focus of what's really important.

    And I find it's really weird that the MoM would apparently trash the idea of Wanda ever having a family in the main universe or whatever the MCU calls it these days. Wanda CLEARLY stated at the end of WandaVision to Vision, Billy and Tommy that: "A family is forever. We could never truly leave each other, even if we tried." I guess that's no longer the case then?! I mean, what happened here?!
    Like I said, Wanda despite being popular is still an expendable wretch, so narrative wise her family and love can be easily dismissed and invalidated without much consequence.

    WV's creator is the exception, not the rule for her.

  12. #4302
    Scarlet Witch~4~LIFE!!^_^ CJStriker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaximoffTrash View Post
    Also for MoM, ToM, etc, I don't know, even if I flush out all my resentment there is still the feeling of time and commiment wasted.
    Basically Wanda's recent appearances in various media ranges from nearly all-out disaster, good outcome(which again, didn't lead to actual good stories later, she just went back to slumber.) with questionable process, or just medicore.(Ironically, her best recent showcase in terms of story is MFR of all things.)
    How long before I can have a complete and self-contained story arc I can look back at fondly of? How long before I can actually look forward to her next appearance without some existential dread?

    And really, getting gaslit about "MoM Wanda made total sense" surely doesn't help.
    ~ We look Foundly on that which we have already gotten From our History of Wanda that Lead us all to Be here MaximoffTrash.

    ~ We Take the Good out of Even the Bad to Look foundly at what can now be build up for our Wanda

    ~ & In our wait for More Justice for our Wanda, to have that Truly Completed, Self-Contained Story, We Relay on Each other to help us get to that day that will come one day that we know it will.

    It is long at time and Certainly Unjutified, but we have Justice by Wanda cause she created enought to make us all become who we are here today, We Take solice in each other, the history that has already abound and the good from the dark cause it is the Love that is shining threw to keep her fans spark growing even now.
    "By Earth and Sky, By Craft and Hex -- By The Past and The Future – I Call HOPE Forth From The DARKNESS! I Speak The Words We Made Into MAGIC! Let THEIR Power Augment Our OWN! To Strike ONE BLOW From Our HEARTS and SOULS – From ALL THAT WE ARE! Let The CALL Go Forth -- AVENGERS! ASSEMBLE!" Scarlet Witch/Wanda Maximoff ~~ From Avengers #689!

    Come Join and Learn about Wanda Maximoff at: The Scarlet Witch Appreciation Thread 2023!

  13. #4303
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaximoffTrash View Post
    Like I said, Wanda despite being popular is still an expendable wretch, so narrative wise her family and love can be easily dismissed and invalidated without much consequence.

    WV's creator is the exception, not the rule for her.
    That is such a short-sided move in my opinion. I've read comments online stating that many women who never gave the superhero genre a second thought were VERY invested in WandaVision BECAUSE of Wanda's relationship with her family. That was REALLY important to them and made them connect with the show. Superhero families are not really a thing in live-action, so that definitely made WandaVision unique. I think by focusing on that stuff, the MCU actually GREW its audience which is a great thing. I'm a bit surprised that Disney walked that back and retreated into "comic book mode" again. You wanna hang on to those new MCU fans, not drive them away doing weird "comic book ****". I'm not sure if they can relate to the cameos, multiversal shenanigans, and horror stuff that the more hardcore MCU fanbase clearly hungers for. I hope Disney can "fix" things somehow.

    I actually read an interview NBC conducted with Michael Waldron recently. It was quite interesting:

    https://www.nbcnews.com/pop-culture/...haos-rcna25892

    You see, like Mr. Waldron, I too was a HUGE fan of professional wrestling back in the 90s. And one of the biggest "events" in pro wrestling is what is known as a "heel turn". A heel turn is defined as thus:

    When a person completely and suddenly, and often shockingly, goes from good to evil. The term came from professional wrestling to refer to when a face (good guy) turned his back on the fans and became a bad guy (heel).

    I used to love that **** as a kid, so I would understand why it would appeal to Mr. Waldron. I think that has influenced his writing in Strange 2 apparently. Mr. Waldron was very honest about how he only got interested in comic books more recently. His favorites include "anything by Jonathan Hickman, Matt Fraction's "Hawkeye", and Tom King's "Vision". Mr. Waldron also explained pretty articulately why he thinks "multiverses" are resonating with audiences and are a big thing in pop culture at the moment. Mr. Waldron also noted that he is a fan of TCM and enjoys watching old movies. And to me, anybody who watches TCM can't be THAT bad in my opinion. I do quite a bit of that myself!

    As I've stated many times here previously, I'm not mad at what Raimi and Waldron did in the MoM. They were given DIRECTIONS from the higher-ups at Marvel Studios. Disney is putting WAY too much pressure on their creative teams at Marvel to meet tight deadlines and I understand why they couldn't find the time to watch WandaVision in a more thorough manner. I had to go over it a few times myself to pick up on things I didn't get at first. Watching it once is simply not enough. But Marvel is putting out so much content at this point, I can understand why the folks working at Marvel Studios are getting overwhelmed by the deluge (I am too. I only JUST completed Moon Knight the other day). So I'm pretty convinced that Marvel Studios has to sorta rely on cameos to make up for their lack of knowledge regarding previous MCU lore. I think we're gonna see more cameos in She-Hulk, Echo and Secret Invasion as a result because the creators of THOSE shows have probably been overwhelmed as well. That's why I would prefer Disney to SLOW DOWN the releases of their Marvel content and introduce FEWER characters more thoughtfully like they did in the previous three Phases. The new ones are not getting as much traction because of how they have been shoehorned into the movies and shows so unnaturally. I'm surprised the MCU is doing that. They did such a great job of SLOWLY introducing characters back in the first three phases. I'm not trying to knock Marvel or Disney or anything. I just want them to adjust course a bit. And surprisingly to me, more and more YouTube "geek" and "nerd" commentators are noticing the same things I am. That is VERY gratifying to me. I thought I was the only one feeling that way.
    Last edited by Albert1981; 05-27-2022 at 06:55 PM.

  14. #4304
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    Thanks CJ, it's been some time and I am not actively resentful that much I guess lol.
    Just need some good news down the line, if not, well, there is always this thread to talk about the topic of the day(or make up that topic in case she is too dead in the water.)

  15. #4305
    Chaos bringer GenericUsername's Avatar
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    I don't understand them giving Wanda more loss than she even had in comics. And isolating her even more now. Where is there to go with that? They could have at least made it so the sons thing wasn't so complicated. Would have maybe sort of made up for killing off Quicksilver (which I still hate).
    Love is for souls, not bodies.

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