YIBAMBE! T’Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2022

[BlackClaw]

People say that about all the new arrivals regardless of how true it actually is. Usually it's people just over hyping. They said the same thing about Shuri in BP 1 too

And now we’ll actually see if the side characters are strong enough to carry the franchise. Which I doubt.

[Mantis-Ray]

And now we’ll actually see if the side characters are strong enough to carry the franchise. Which I doubt.

I have compared this to basically an Iron Man movie that only stars Happy Hogan and Pepper Potts.

Though I guess a better comparison would be Agents of Shield, as that was basically giving Coulson a supporting cast member from a couple prior Marvel movies his own TV show.

I find distinction compared to Falcon and Bucky getting stuff is that the latter 2 are supers. They have the cool names, individual costumes, and unique abilities which Shuri, Okoye, and Coulson don't all have.

[BlackClaw]

Man I went on Twitter and the complaining about replacing or not replacing Bozeman is ridiculous. I love MCU movies & I love comics but damn. The intensity that is being brought to this discussion escapes me. People are way too invested in this stuff. I have a friend who said “I used to call myself a Star Wars fan until I got around real Star Wars fans. Then I realized I was a lightweight.” I get what he meant a lot more now.

The thing is I always knew it would be like this once we get further removed from Boseman’s death. I literally remember when it was just a handful of people that wanted a recast (me included) and now the fan base is split on it, though more and more are coming to the recast side since it’s almost been two years since Chadwick passed away. It just goes to show that time really wasn’t on marvels side in this situation.

[MindofShadow]

Man I went on Twitter and the complaining about replacing or not replacing Bozeman is ridiculous. I love MCU movies & I love comics but damn. The intensity that is being brought to this discussion escapes me. People are way too invested in this stuff. I have a friend who said “I used to call myself a Star Wars fan until I got around real Star Wars fans. Then I realized I was a lightweight.” I get what he meant a lot more now.

All big fandoms are like this, it is quite sad.

Which is why I refuse to be too toxic about this BP stuff. Some people enjoy it or whatever. Cool for them. I don't. So I just kinda move on.

Just don't try and tell me I HAVE to like Wakanda Forever or Coates or Ridley just because I like the character. Or just because "support minorities!"

Nah Namor looks dope. Probably will look much better in live action.

.

He looks good without that ridiculous headdress and jaguar crap.

I don't htink it will look betterin live action because that actor is not that big lol. Promo art got him lookin like Hemsworth lol

Still #teamnamor

Still need to get that other thread going for this movie lol

[Mike_Murdock]

I never picked up the new comic run, which is why I've checked out of this thread, but I'll pop back in because of the new movie stuff. I've said before that I at least hoped they didn't kill off the character of T'Challa in the movie just in case they ever changed their mind with the recasting thing (and, also because it means two Black Panthers have died in a very short period of time), but it seems we're too far past that point.

I think the real focus here is Namor and his design. I think the little Aztec/Maya flourishes are fine. I don't see them as a big deal one way or the other. I was far more interested in the speedo vs. pants question before the promotional art popped up. In my opinion, this design looks like Namor (he even had the winged feet). But I wasn't sure if full-fledged Namor was appropriate for a Black Panther franchise since the last movie leaned on having gravitas. If they can get me to take Namor seriously, I will be impressed, but I'm worried that this movie will be tonally inconsistent at best. Maybe they'll full-on embrace the camp, I don't know.

[Klaue's Mixtape]

I highly doubt it was. They just introduced Wakanda and for the sequel they are going to introduce a second secret Nation? Come on Klaue, you know that ain't true. They don't have the too introduce Namor Atlantis attuma etc etc. While also giving more development to T'Challa and his already full cast that was borderline bloated, and to add an entire second society and flesh it out?

They are going to be bloated with Shuri Okoye Nakia, M'Baku, Ramonda, Ross, and now Riri as it stood. Throwing is Namor and attuma and whomever else from his cast. This is going to be so bloated and busy that it's going to be a noisy mess

Yeah uh its fairly obvious Namor is only in this to effectively bring in a major character to substitute T'Challa's loss. A proper BP sequel should have expanded on the general setting of the franchise and introduce an actual BP villain like Achebe.

Bringing in Namor is sorta like how Scarlet Witch, America Chavez, and the Illuminati hijacked Doctor Strange 2 into being all about them instead of actual Doctor Strange stuff.

Yall realize how much they'd have to shift around in a short period of time to fit in Namor and his people?

This was the plan all along. Remember how in 2019 Coogler wouldnt reveal the title and the rumors were that it was going to give away what it was about i.e Two Kings.

Wakanda Forever being the titled was purely because of Boseman's and T'Challa
s death.

[Klaue's Mixtape]

All big fandoms are like this, it is quite sad.

Which is why I refuse to be too toxic about this BP stuff. Some people enjoy it or whatever. Cool for them. I don't. So I just kinda move on.

Just don't try and tell me I HAVE to like Wakanda Forever or Coates or Ridley just because I like the character. Or just because "support minorities!"



He looks good without that ridiculous headdress and jaguar crap.

I don't htink it will look betterin live action because that actor is not that big lol. Promo art got him lookin like Hemsworth lol

Still #teamnamor

Still need to get that other thread going for this movie lol

I didnt like the Jaguar headdress at first but its growing on me.

Truth is he'll probably only wear it one time. Similar to how Killmonger just wore that mask one time but it got promoted to hell.

[BlackClaw]

Yall realize how much they'd have to shift around in a short period of time to fit in Namor and his people?

This was the plan all along. Remember how in 2019 Coogler wouldnt reveal the title and the rumors were that it was going to give away what it was about i.e Two Kings.

Wakanda Forever being the titled was purely because of Boseman's and T'Challa
s death.

I always had a feeling they’d try and put Namor in the sequel since I predicted Marvel would go for a “go big or go home” approach for post endgame films. Still if I were in charge (and if Chadwick was still alive) I’d save Namor for a third film.

[Klaue's Mixtape]

I always had a feeling they’d try and put Namor in the sequel since I predicted Marvel would go for a “go big or go home” approach for post endgame films. Still if I were in charge (and if Chadwick was still alive) I’d save Namor for a third film.

That's exactly it. They were trying to keep up with this phase. I woulda saved Namor for a 3rd film all along, but I think Feige pushed that deal along.

[Blanks]

I think I’m done with any and all things BP related now. I may not even finish this current story arc, since all things indicate that Marvel wants to bury T’Challa, both in print and on film. I’m not gonna spend another dollar. They have pretty much ruined my two favorite characters, T’Challa and Ben Reilly (Scarlet Spider).

I’m not gonna be checking out the movie, not on my dime. One of my friends invite me to go out and see it, if they buy the ticket, sure. But no. Not another dime from me Marvel.

Part of me, a small part of me, prays that it’s all a fake out, and at the end of the movie, we see a new recasted actor for T’Challa.

Hell… since the MCU exists with animated features too… they can easily have T’Challa ALWAYS in suit, and in animated films casted with another voice actor. We don’t have to see the live action T’Challa face… just don’t kill him off.

I’m not optimistic though.

[Username taken]

Just saw that Namor image, I can’t say I like it. Maybe it’ll look better in live action but the facial hair doesn’t work at all for me. I don’t think grafting Mesoamerican imagery onto the Atlanteans is necessary at all. Marvel Atlanteans aren’t generally human looking, so there’s no need to tie them to a specific culture.

Regarding BP at Marvel, Redjack basically said everything that needed to be said. Current creatives have introduced elements into Wakanda that run completely contrary to why that civilization was created in the first place. Introducing real world elements into Wakanda breaks the foundation of the concept.

Marvel editorial is really to blame here. BP has been handed off to “non-comic book” writers for the last couple of years now. They are not doing this with their “established” franchises like X-men, Hulk, Thor, Spider-man or even Daredevil. I think the reason for this is because 1. They want to bring in readers that might accompany writers of reknown like Coates and Ridley 2. The shortage of black writers in the comics sphere. This is really more indictment on the systemic racism of the industry that only a handful of black writers are given significant opportunities. Worse still is when they do, they pigeon hole them into only writing black characters (this is changing but its changing very slowly and it’s something that Christopher Priest called out).

Let’s be honest here, it doesn’t seem that Ridley or Coates are not really long-term fans of BP and the mythos. Coates especially spent a disproportionate amount of time deconstructing T’Challa and demystifying Wakanda. He was so obsessed with his crusade against white supremacy and colonialism that he used fictional African characters to address it. HOWEVER, IT DOESNT MAKE SENSE. You can’t build up a competent hero when everyone around him seems to be constantly talking him down and for some reason seems to always be on the wrong side. Introducing problems that some African countries are struggling with into Wakanda re-enforces the stereotypes around black Africans. Coates failed on a conceptual level here.

Worse than all this is the thought that BP is about Wakanda and not T’Challa himself, this has to be the most destructive and offensive school of thought to have been mainstreamed. I first discovered BP in the old Avengers books and when I picked up his books, they were about the character (even the McGregor era focused on T’Challa). Now, it seems the writers are trying very hard to “diminish” the character because he’s too noble or intelligent or something(??). Same thing is happening with Thor where everyone talks crap to him even Angela that’s pretty much a professional *******. I don’t know if it’s meant to be some feminist thing but Angela is a very, very grating character…kind of like Omolola so far. Even Tony Stark isn’t spared because Patsy Walker has pretty much been talking **** to the guy despite all his selfless actions in the past (and she turned down his proposal just to top it all off).

Marvel editorial really needs to get it together on not just BP but some of their other minority characters (see the recent Miles Morales fiasco). It’s not just enough to handover a character to a minority creator, what do these creators want to do with the character? And why not handover these characters to some writers that have experience in the industry and actually have “love” for the characters. Redjack’s run on GL shows how much he regards John Stewart and he’s elevated the guy to “godly status”. Hickman and Aaron’s handling of T’Challa shows they are actually familiar with the character and want show how good he is, it’s a stark contrast to what Coates and now Ridley is doing with the character.

[Agent Z]

Ever heard of having it all?? Never stopped the Borg from going after everyone.

Maybe not the best comparison there.

[Ezyo1000]

Man I went on Twitter and the complaining about replacing or not replacing Bozeman is ridiculous. I love MCU movies & I love comics but damn. The intensity that is being brought to this discussion escapes me. People are way too invested in this stuff. I have a friend who said “I used to call myself a Star Wars fan until I got around real Star Wars fans. Then I realized I was a lightweight.” I get what he meant a lot more now.

It's easy to not understand why people are so fired up about if one has never grown up and not seeing heroic characters that look like you doing badass stuff. Seeing people that look like you Being non-existent sucks, but being the sidekick, the joke, the punching bag, vilified, or some stereotype sucks worse.

So when you have a character who was literally created at the height of civil unrest and was created to dissolve the stereotypes around Black people and show that they can be just as heroic and special as their white counterparts, and said character has such historical and social relevance, being cast aside like garbage, and the people doing it are saying isht like "Is just a mantle, he's just one in a long line (which originally he wasn't, he was the first) and hey look we have these Black stand-ins" it affects people.

Representation matters. And its people who are always represented that come in and ask what the big deal is are the ones who don't understand it because they have never NOT been represented.

Not necessarily saying that your one of those people but just food for thought.

[Ezyo1000]

Yall realize how much they'd have to shift around in a short period of time to fit in Namor and his people?

This was the plan all along. Remember how in 2019 Coogler wouldnt reveal the title and the rumors were that it was going to give away what it was about i.e Two Kings.

Wakanda Forever being the titled was purely because of Boseman's and T'Challa
s death.

Like how Feigi claimed less than 3 months after Chad's passing that Coogler was basically done with the script and Chad death didn't change all that much because the sequel was ALWAYS about Wakanda as it was the real character? Only for that **** to be disproven by the cast and Coogler himself because he had barely even started the draft?

Yeah, I'm calling bullshit on that one. Again, the BP cast WITHOUT adding Namor and however many more from his franchise to the sequel was already damn near bursting before Chad's passing. Now that they are adding Riri, another Dora, Namor, attuma and possibly another atlantean? Bloated AF.

It took them forever to even confirm officially that BP was getting a sequel despite it's number and we all knew it was a guaranteed deal.

[MindofShadow]

I didnt like the Jaguar headdress at first but its growing on me.

Truth is he'll probably only wear it one time. Similar to how Killmonger just wore that mask one time but it got promoted to hell.

The fact he is powered by a (cat) god at all is just weird and unnecessary.

The "culture" they are adapting is going to either be ridiculously superficial.... or the movie is barely going to be in Wakanda outside of a funeral of sorts.