YIBAMBE! T’Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2022

[LukeCagefan]

Obviously can't retire the franchise. But they could of delayed it. They barely changed the original release date despite Chad's passing and being full fledge into Covid. They didn't need to push this movie out as fast as they did.

That's why I don't believe Kevin Fiege and I smell ulterior motives. Chadwick wasn't a Paul thing. He didn't die during filming. They could've delayed the film and waited until it was appropriate for a recast. The wanted to hand the franchise to the chicks and there were rumors of Shuri becoming Black Panther before the brotha passed.

[jwatson]

I was not framing your thoughts. My response was in no way about you and your thoughts and feelings. We've been down this road before...your post elicited a thought which I shared...that is all. Don't take it personal because 1 it's not an attack. 2 it's absolutely not about you.

I didnt take it personal just to be clear but if i'm used as the quote i'm going to make sure my view is in the response and clear or if i'm responding i will make sure i let the others know the poster isn't the one im referring to. it just feels like respect, which is basically what i feel is missing from what we do know of how chad handled his own situation and this isn't about you but my mind is on it while i'm typing


At some point as human beings tact comes in, is promoting your emotional struggle or your difficulty with someone elses situation when they themselves really worth it. Like i know free will and all and we all have a right to speak on our pain and our struggle and what not but at what point do we also have to realize and take responsibility for what that may do for the legacy someone else has tried to carve and worked hard for to leave behind to display our own pain on their journey. It feels like that episode of American Dad when Steve was called an emotional passenger or something like that when Snott lost his dad. People like that just don't feel good to be around for me.


**To be clear reading the post and the response the implication exists to someone not familiar to my posts or views that my singular out of context statement was because i was some kind of BP fan which we both know not to be the case.**

[Devaishwarya]

And my point was...They are perhaps thinking that what they are doing is perfectly respectful.
And we are not in their position to say with any certainty what that entire situation has been like for them both from a professional perspective and a personal one. Yes we've all seen and heard the press releases and soundbites but we are not Angela or Lupita or Ryan with the professional responsibility to push through that professional and personal loss and still do their job to the best of their abilities.

If I was in that position under those circumstances I may very well have made the same choices and decisions. Or not.
Thank the Goddess I'm not.

[dkrook]

Perhaps...(not having read the article or seen the movie)...just perhaps...they see their characters having to step up and rise in the face of grief and pain to be as great as the man who fell so as to overcome the new trials they're about to face. And they're not interpreting it (again not having read the article) from an aggrieved T'Challa/comic fan perspective of stepping on Chadwick's grave and death to finally achieve "woman power" prominence (a prominence already achieved by at least Lupita and Dania in their previous filmographies).

Perhaps they, being in the moment and on set and in the full emotion of everything that has happened since the making of the first movie to now, see it entirely differently. And who are we, regardless of how we feel, to invalidate that?

Who are we..? Easy, we are the fans that have followed what may be one of the most inspirational, endearing, and complex fictional black male heroes created in America. We are fans that have carried the pain of seeing a hero that looks like us become a symbol for the struggles we have to endure and overcome while remaining strong and dignified! We are fans know well of the potential long held, but long denied only because of shared connectivity to being black, written in fiction for him and reality for us. I'll never stand for black women to be cast down. However what is happening is looking at the muting, and perhaps erasure of T'Challa. Considering the long wait for him combined with his overarching on expectations is just wrong. If the director was feeling some kind of way for the actor then truly let Marvel delay the movie a year, but just cutting T'Challa arc short, sorry just not acceptable. Down with The King for Life! If they gave white women movies then let Marvel make black women movies. Put the work in!

[jwatson]

And my point was...They are perhaps thinking that what they are doing is perfectly respectful.
And we are not in their position to say with any certainty what that entire situation has been like for them both from a professional perspective and a personal one. Yes we've all seen and heard the press releases and soundbites but we are not Angela or Lupita or Ryan with the professional responsibility to push through that professional and personal loss and still do their job to the best of their abilities.

If I was in that position under those circumstances I may very well have made the same choices and decisions. Or not.
Thank the Goddess I'm not.

Last thing i'm going to say because i find my spirit won't stay silent. They know. I thought we are suppose to take the queue of the victims and cancer is one hell of a serial killer.

[dkrook]

Would you say that he is joining the ranks of Coates and Ridley in having a negative effect on T'Challa's character?

Hell yeah, fam! His T'Challa was just mid. There was something that bugged me even more after repeated viewing. T'Challa seemed more and more like a passenger than a driver in his own movie. Like agency was diluted.

[Ekie]

Hell yeah, fam! His T'Challa was just mid. There was something that bugged me even more after repeated viewing. T'Challa seemed more and more like a passenger than a driver in his own movie. Like agency was diluted.

Because it was.
It was Ryan's goal to tell a story about representation. He did that

It was his goal to give the female characters agency. He did that.

But he did it at the expense of the hero we came to see.

BlackPanther/Chadwick was HUGE after Civil War before Ryan was even an option for a solo. The hype was there with Chadwick/T'Challa.
He dropped that ball and left the franchise in a confused and fractured state with ppl no longer seeing the importance of the hero to his very own story and an immediate power struggle for control of the franchise between femcels, MichaelBkillmonger bros and actual BlackPanther fans.
Didn't even give an origin story or flashbacks to fill in questions the audience might have about the title character Did that for his friend Michael B Jordan throughout the movie though.

Now he’s just a mantle in the eyes of the casual marvel audience and it's "the woman's time to rise!" While they point men to MBaku as a pacifier.

Nerfing and gifting away everything that made T'Challa as an individual character great is unforgivable. I hope he moves away from the franchise after this movie but I doubt it. Him and Michael B Jordan will likely latch themselves onto this IP for a decade.

In the end he is one of the most destructive things to ever happen to the character and I seriously doubt he was gonna "fix" things in a sequel unless it was written by someone else.

Disclaimer: I enjoyed the representation experience though.

[LukeCagefan]

Because it was.
It was Ryan's goal to tell a story about representation. He did that

It was his goal to give the female characters agency. He did that.

But he did it at the expense of the hero we came to see.

BlackPanther/Chadwick was HUGE after Civil War before Ryan was even an option for a solo. The hype was there with Chadwick/T'Challa.
He dropped that ball and left the franchise in a confused and fractured state with ppl no longer seeing the importance of the hero to his very own story and an immediate power struggle for control of the franchise between femcels, killmonger bros and actual BlackPanther fans.
Didn't even give an origin story or flashbacks to fill in questions the audience might have about the title character Did that for his friend Michael B Jordan throughout the movie though.

Now he’s just a mantle in the eyes of the casual marvel audience and it's "the woman's time to rise!" While they point men to MBaku as a pacifier.

Nerfing and gifting away everything that made T'Challa as an individual character great is unforgivable. I hope he moves away from the franchise after this movie but I doubt it. Him and Michael B Jordan will likely latch themselves onto this IP for a decade.
In the end he is one of the most destructive things to ever happen to the character and I seriously doubt he was gonna "fix" things in a sequel unless it was written by someone else.

This post was epic.

[Ezyo1000]

It's cute to sit here in front of our devices and say what they should and shouldn't have done...when none of us are (were) in that situation on that movie set, a member of that ensemble cast, sitting in the executive boardrooms, making the difficult decisions in such a difficult moment.

It's pretty easy to say "Hey we just lost our lead of a billion dollar franchise and we are in the middle of a pandemic... Maybe we should delay the movie"...

[Devaishwarya]

Easier said than done...but I'm not an acclaimed actor, writer, director, producer so what do I know?

[jwatson]

Easier said than done...but I'm not an acclaimed actor, writer, director, producer so what do I know?

I'm sorry dev i am sure your a great person but this is irritating. Someone being an acclaimed anything doesn't make how they feel more important than someone who isn't. In fact it cost a fan more to support something than an acclaimed person who is getting paid to create something. It feels beyond patronizing.

[Ezyo1000]

Easier said than done...but I'm not an acclaimed actor, writer, director, producer so what do I know?

Yes it is that easy. Lost the lead, in the middle of a pandemic with out a clear end in sight... All BEFORE the script was even done. They hadn't shot anything, they weren't even in production.
They could of waited.

They should of. Instead they kept pushing, trying to downplay T'Challa, focus on Wakanda, or the mantle, and then KEPT on talking about Chad's passing and how everyone was just having a tough time. Ignoring Chad's wishes, ignoring Chad's families words, and have been advertising Chad's image and his death for their movie.

[Devaishwarya]

That's not the point of my response, JWat
We fans can certainly feel however we want/need to feel. I'm not disputing that. But we are not in the position to make any of the major decisions that those persons I mentioned have/had to, even amidst all of what they themselves must have been feeling. It's not about feelings (ours or theirs...which are just as valid) but having to make some seriously important decisions going forward despite said feelings.

[Toonstrack]

Before this was copium but... I got a surprise for you... T'challa and real Cap are gonna fight soon too lol.

But im sure its nothing, nothing to see here right?

It is only "agreeing" when they use that same energy to go after democracy like they did the monarchy.
.

Well, I have no problem with tChalla fighting Steve either, that doesn't necessarily mean they aren't close. A lot of heroes fight each other and then hug it out later as it were lol.

As for the democracy thing, I mean I agree with that and I also think that's coming down the line but I for one am ok with them letting tchalla be free of the monarchy politics for a bit. In fact I thought it was wierd that he was chilling in Wakanda when he took a break and is hanging with the avengers back in his own book.

Ya know whats sad is that even if they aren't that close, there's no reason not to be friendly.

It was something I really like about T'Challa, sure he's stoic and very reserved but he is unfailingly polite. Like he is honestly a nice guy and never tries to be rude with anyone unless they do something warrant his disdain.

Well given the context was that sam had snuck into wakanda masquerading as a citizen i can see why tchalla was a little upset initially.

[Toonstrack]

Hell yeah, fam! His T'Challa was just mid. There was something that bugged me even more after repeated viewing. T'Challa seemed more and more like a passenger than a driver in his own movie. Like agency was diluted.

How?

T'Challa does nearly everything in the movie. He freed the kidnappers in the beginning. He defeats Mbaku to retain the throne. He personally investigated the lead with Klaue which he didn't even have to do(how often do you see a king go on extraction missions personally?). He kidnaps klaue almost entirely on his own(shuri provides driving assistance). He saves Ross, which allows sharing to later rehabilitate him. He fights Killmonger, and sure he is initially defeated, but literslly wills himself to return to the land of the living, gains the alliance of the jabari, outsmarts, and kills Killmonger himself with help from the others... but the killmonger stuff is all him. In the end he starts the wakandan outreach program. In what way did he not have agency? Theres hardly any decisions made in the movie he isn't a part of or at the forefront of.

He has more agency in this movie than Cap does in his entire trilogy.