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  1. #3781
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    This I'm assuming unfinished commission by the fabulous @ro_asif has me a little gagged. He tweeted it not long ago:

    Source: https://twitter.com/ro_asif/status/1529255057551663104

    Jean Grey in the words of Walt Whitman, from his masterpiece Leaves of Grass, "Song of Myself" (51 and 52):

    "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)"

    "Failing to fetch me at first keep encouraged, Missing me one place search another, I stop somewhere waiting for you."

  2. #3782
    Astonishing Member Grey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Regent View Post
    Sweet Goddess... which artist is responsible for this rebellion XD Attachment 121291
    A lot of times, printed comics give better context for these kinds of images.

    Likely, this was a tiny image on that particular page, and zoomed in, it looks a atrocious. At original size, it’s likely normal as it’s hard to draw detail at that level.

    That being said, I don’t know if it applies to this particular image as it’s been so long since I read that issue. And there are plenty of bad images out there that aren’t due to above explanation. But one downside with digital comics is that zooming in for clips can make art look terrible when it’s original version looks perfectly fine and suitable for the page.
    Your favorite superhero- the one you visit these forums to talk about. Would they talk to others the way you do on this message board?

  3. #3783
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    Jean Grey in the words of Walt Whitman, from his masterpiece Leaves of Grass, "Song of Myself" (51 and 52):

    "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)"

    "Failing to fetch me at first keep encouraged, Missing me one place search another, I stop somewhere waiting for you."

  4. #3784
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercury View Post
    Later, when Byrne replaced Cockrum as the artist of the book, he made a concerted effort to push for Jean to be downplayed and excluded from stories because he found her to be too powerful as Phoenix, going as far as saying, "I didn't like Phoenix since the word go. Because she instantly made the rest of the X-Men fifth wheels, you know? And she wasn't even an X-Man." That last comment stings because she certainly was an X-Man—one of the founding members and the first female X-Man, in fact, and later revealed to have been Xavier's first student—even if she had been written off the team prior to Claremont taking over. (Below is the page containing Byrne's quote.)
    Byrne is a piece of work man lol.

    For someone who downplayed Jean like this, he sure liked Dark Phoenix enough to do a version of it with Wanda in Darker Than Scarlet (Which unlike Jean's Dark Phoenix nonsense, doesn't work with Wanda's character), and then again on DC with Dark Angel (Which, from what I hear just made Donna into a bigger mess)

    To be clear, both Cockrum and Claremont conceived of Jean as the X-Men's, and perhaps Marvel's, first female cosmic superhero.
    Given the characters available at the time, I can't see anyone else taking that role, we had Frankie who became Galactus' herald (Basically Firelord, but a woman and more naked), but that was 6 years after Jean became Phoenix, and I'm not sure if she did much in Silver Surfer's comics afterwards, and it doesn't look like she showed up much, there's also Carol as Binary, but that was also 6 years after Jean, and her appearances when she was in space weren't consistent, but it's possibly more than Frankie and she was powerful (In X-Men Spotlight on Starjammers, it's said her potential is infinite and that's how she defeated Zenith, but in practice that wasn't the case even before she lost the Binary powers, though maybe there was some self limit going on, her most impressive feat I remember was powering up the sun in Quasar#34, something about a White Hole).

    At best, I could see some woman from Thor getting something like that ('Cause Asgardians can be pretty damn powerful), but I really doubt that was gonna happen at the time, and I'm not even sure if any female Asgardian can be considered Cosmic besides Jane as Thor (And I mean by having actual feats to back it up and not just being said to be tough), though I admitedly don't know too much about Thor right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mercury View Post
    These are good points. Like you, I think the oldest statement is "most likely to be the truthful one." (Also, I love how you express yourself. Reading you is like being on a ride.)
    Thanks, though I hope you don't mean a ride that ends on a car crash .

    You fucking cutie! I'm squealing, lol. And I think you are a fan, mister, but you're still processing your conversion...
    Possibly, I think to myself Jean is my third favorite redhead at Marvel, but uh, I'm checking out random stuff from her and hanging out here more than the second favorite, Daredevil, who I'm not even thinking of much lately, not talking in his thread, and I don't even feel like finishing Devil's Reign, so yeah, maybe she's second favorite now and I didn't realize it yet, or maybe it's the X-Men mood I'm in, not sure now lol.

    I get all of this, but what I said above still applies. In either case, I'm glad that you're interested enough to pop in here and take part in the discourse.
    Thanks again.

    I find it amazing that they made her weaker in XTAS than she was in comic books in the 1960s. Like, WTF? Thankfully, we have Beau DeMayo—a huge Jean fan with a tattoo of her on his forearm—as executive producer and head writer of the revival. He's pretty much confirmed that we're getting the opposite of what we got for Jean in the original run of the animated series, so I'm psyched.
    Yeah I think at best you can say 90's cartoon Jean could lift heavier stuff more consistently compared to Lee/Kirby Jean, but that's undercut by her just being less competent overall, and tripping at random like she's a Smash Brawl character lol.

    Since you mentioned that possibly Claremont and Morrison both made Jean look weaker than usual so Phoenix related feats are more impressive, I do wonder if they were planning to do something like that with Jean in the 90's cartoon but then botched the execution too much.

    Huh. I'll have to pay closer attention to old-school Mags during my rereadings, lol.
    A telling example of him becoming weaker and more cowardly was in X-Men#6, where he ran away... Just because, despite still being able to fight, and having most of the Brotherhood available, and you could even make a point about the X-Men being tired from fighting Namor.

    It would be slightly more understandable if he decided to leave because Namor was about to fight him and he thought Namor was too much (And indeed Namor's power was comparable to Hulk's, and the story made it clear Namor is above all the X-Men at the time), but Namor just left, and then Magneto decided to run away, again, just because.

    Even without that ****, compare Magneto from X-Men#1, #17 and #18, where he fights the X-Men really well by himself, with Magneto from X-Men#4, #5, #6, #7, #11, and his competence and even how many powers he has are worse (I think when he was around the Brotherhood his powers were nerfed to being just "control metal" generally, though he kept stuff like telepathy and whatnot, I could be wrong, but he still was less impressive with Brotherhood around).

    He still had moments where he looked powerful, such as his fight against Blob in X-Men#7 (He managed to knock down Blob, which both X-Men#3 and #7 made it clear it's not easy to do), but the competence and how many powers he has are worse.

    He even points out in X-Men#18 that everyone else from the Brotherhood were holding him back:



    Oh, you're totally endearing and adorable. I've thought that for a long time. It's the way you communicate your thoughts on here and, of course, now all of these squeal-inducing memes, lol.
    Thanks again, for the third time lol.

    Though don't expect memes to be done frequently, or even much after this, I randomly remembered that moment with Spidey and Johnny and found it fitting to use here, and that MJ with Spidey one I was waiting to use that page for something for a long time and your reaction on the other post was just perfect to use it for lol.

    So yeah, the creativity was all used up with those two, and another one may take a long time to be made, specially since I think overdoing it with memes gets obnoxious.

    Actually, I think it'll be right up your alley, especially early-Claremont. I look forward to reading some of your thoughts on those first issues.
    It'll take a while for me to reach Claremont, right now I'm checking out Thor and Defenders among the older comics (Defenders more than Thor, older Thor are shorter stories but I get annoyed whenever he has to deal with Communists since those villains are meh, I don't really care about Jane and Thor's random powers are too random at times), older X-Men is kinda boring to me, Lee/Kirby didn't do too much to impress me besides the Juggernaut issues (I really like how powerful Juggernaut was made 'cause that made it clear the X-Men aren't holding back when dealing with him, and the battle was a struggle even then), and so far Roy Thomas is just following their footsteps and isn't managing to grab my attention.

    If it becomes interesting more consistently then reaching Claremont will be faster, but right now, I read an issue or two on a whim, then move on to something else 'cause X-Men didn't grab my attention enough.

    But yeah I can see why X-Men got cancelled back then, compared to other stuff Marvel had at the time, they felt less creative, but it's understandable, Lee and Kirby came up with a lot of things from Marvel, and while Kirby was a scarily creative, that has a limit, specially with the work output he had, and unfortunately I felt that X-Men showed the limit more clearly, specially when they had to compete with F4, and F4 had more stuff going on with the weird concepts Kirby came up with.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    I haven’t read much since hickman’s era started. What roles has exodus had? I don’t necessarily mean power wise. But I barely hear of him when I scan the forums.
    I think all he did before Immortal X-Men was talk **** about Wanda, then Trial of Magneto happened and he stopped talking **** about Wanda.

    He's in the Quiet Council but I don't remember him doing anything much besides randomly voting, not even sure if he talked much there now that I think of it.

    So yeah, if I'm right about this, he wasn't doing much until Immortal X-Men.
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 05-25-2022 at 02:19 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    We all know that BND was a collective mid-life crisis from Marvel back then

  5. #3785

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercury View Post
    You aren't nuts, you are something else that can't be said here 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

  6. #3786
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subliminally View Post
    See to me the fact that she can use her TK to rebuild her body from scratch should automatically classify her as a OL telekinetic. Like no shade, but I've yet to hear anything abt Exodus' TK other than him rebuilding Xavier's brain.
    I always thought Exodus' healing powers were a separate power, but ever since he rebuilt Xavier's brain ,I actually think he does that to himself too using TK to reconstitute his damage at cellular(maybe atomic) level

  7. #3787
    The Red Dragon Tank's Avatar
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    This is gorgeous and the suit drawn right. I love how the green on her upper body shines like it’s the metallics on a butterfly or chrysalis.

    Her tiara is an actual tiara instead of a face mask.

    But fyi this was done way last year, so i’m not sure the fire has any specific connotations versus some of the more recent Axe covers. Glad it’s a cover though, because it’s one of my fave images in this costume.

  8. #3788
    Beware! Daedra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    I haven’t read much since hickman’s era started. What roles has exodus had? I don’t necessarily mean power wise. But I barely hear of him when I scan the forums.
    Strange he always posts here, you should encounter his posts quite often to be honest…
    Ommadon: “By summoning all the dark powers I will infest the spirit of man So that he uses his science and logic to destroy himself. Greed and avarice shall prevail, and those who do not hear my words shall pay the price. I'll teach man to use his machines, I'll show him what distorted science can give birth to. I'll teach him to fly like a fairy, and I'll give him the ultimate answer to all his science can ask. And the world will be free for my magic again.”

  9. #3789
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Byrne is a piece of work man lol.

    For someone who downplayed Jean like this, he sure liked Dark Phoenix enough to do a version of it with Wanda in Darker Than Scarlet (Which unlike Jean's Dark Phoenix nonsense, doesn't work with Wanda's character), and then again on DC with Dark Angel (Which, from what I hear just made Donna into a bigger mess)
    Oh my god—EXACTLY! Don't even get me started on that. What's interesting, though, is that Byrne claimed to be a big Jean fan. However, her transformation into Phoenix proved to be too disconcerting for him. And while I totally understand his point that having her on the team at full power "made the rest of the X-Men fifth wheels," I don't fully buy it either. I mean, as Claremont pointed out, Thor was integrated into the Avengers, so why couldn't Phoenix be?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Given the characters available at the time, I can't see anyone else taking that role, we had Frankie who became Galactus' herald (Basically Firelord, but a woman and more naked), but that was 6 years after Jean became Phoenix, and I'm not sure if she did much in Silver Surfer's comics afterwards, and it doesn't look like she showed up much, there's also Carol as Binary, but that was also 6 years after Jean, and her appearances when she was in space weren't consistent, but it's possibly more than Frankie and she was powerful (In X-Men Spotlight on Starjammers, it's said her potential is infinite and that's how she defeated Zenith, but in practice that wasn't the case even before she lost the Binary powers, though maybe there was some self limit going on, her most impressive feat I remember was powering up the sun in Quasar#34, something about a White Hole).

    At best, I could see some woman from Thor getting something like that ('Cause Asgardians can be pretty damn powerful), but I really doubt that was gonna happen at the time, and I'm not even sure if any female Asgardian can be considered Cosmic besides Jane as Thor (And I mean by having actual feats to back it up and not just being said to be tough), though I admitedly don't know too much about Thor right now.
    Thank you for this little recap of potential candidates for Marvel's first female cosmic superhero. I really need to do a deep dive into this to settle the matter once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Thanks, though I hope you don't mean a ride that ends on a car crash .
    Haha. No. You just have a very fluid way of expressing your thoughts, which I quite enjoy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Possibly, I think to myself Jean is my third favorite redhead at Marvel, but uh, I'm checking out random stuff from her and hanging out here more than the second favorite, Daredevil, who I'm not even thinking of much lately, not talking in his thread, and I don't even feel like finishing Devil's Reign, so yeah, maybe she's second favorite now and I didn't realize it yet, or maybe it's the X-Men mood I'm in, not sure now lol.
    AHA! lol. She's certainly an enchanting character. The more you dive into her history, the more she grips you. She's been so many things in so many stories and to so many people—she "contain[s] multitudes," after all—but she's also always been essentially the same: fiercely assertive yet deeply empathic. She's a character full of surprises. One moment she can die on you, and the next moment she can be the single most powerful being in all of creation. She can be the most vulnerable—some consider this a weakness—or the most impenetrable. I see her as this great big mysterious and mercurial myth that's constantly shifting and changing and evolving. I mean, that's really what all comic book characters are, but I think my description especially applies to her.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Yeah I think at best you can say 90's cartoon Jean could lift heavier stuff more consistently compared to Lee/Kirby Jean, but that's undercut by her just being less competent overall, and tripping at random like she's a Smash Brawl character lol.

    Since you mentioned that possibly Claremont and Morrison both made Jean look weaker than usual so Phoenix related feats are more impressive, I do wonder if they were planning to do something like that with Jean in the 90's cartoon but then botched the execution too much.
    I actually recently thought about this, i.e., that they downplayed her power in the animated series to highlight her transformation into Phoenix. And yes, they certainly went overboard with it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    A telling example of him becoming weaker and more cowardly was in X-Men#6, where he ran away... Just because, despite still being able to fight, and having most of the Brotherhood available, and you could even make a point about the X-Men being tired from fighting Namor.

    It would be slightly more understandable if he decided to leave because Namor was about to fight him and he thought Namor was too much (And indeed Namor's power was comparable to Hulk's, and the story made it clear Namor is above all the X-Men at the time), but Namor just left, and then Magneto decided to run away, again, just because.

    Even without that ****, compare Magneto from X-Men#1, #17 and #18, where he fights the X-Men really well by himself, with Magneto from X-Men#4, #5, #6, #7, #11, and his competence and even how many powers he has are worse (I think when he was around the Brotherhood his powers were nerfed to being just "control metal" generally, though he kept stuff like telepathy and whatnot, I could be wrong, but he still was less impressive with Brotherhood around).

    He still had moments where he looked powerful, such as his fight against Blob in X-Men#7 (He managed to knock down Blob, which both X-Men#3 and #7 made it clear it's not easy to do), but the competence and how many powers he has are worse.

    He even points out in X-Men#18 that everyone else from the Brotherhood were holding him back:

    Huh. Interesting.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Thanks again, for the third time lol.

    Though don't expect memes to be done frequently, or even much after this, I randomly remembered that moment with Spidey and Johnny and found it fitting to use here, and that MJ with Spidey one I was waiting to use that page for something for a long time and your reaction on the other post was just perfect to use it for lol.

    So yeah, the creativity was all used up with those two, and another one may take a long time to be made, specially since I think overdoing it with memes gets obnoxious.
    You're welcome. And I love the memes but I get what you mean about using them judiciously.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    It'll take a while for me to reach Claremont, right now I'm checking out Thor and Defenders among the older comics (Defenders more than Thor, older Thor are shorter stories but I get annoyed whenever he has to deal with Communists since those villains are meh, I don't really care about Jane and Thor's random powers are too random at times), older X-Men is kinda boring to me, Lee/Kirby didn't do too much to impress me besides the Juggernaut issues (I really like how powerful Juggernaut was made 'cause that made it clear the X-Men aren't holding back when dealing with him, and the battle was a struggle even then), and so far Roy Thomas is just following their footsteps and isn't managing to grab my attention.

    If it becomes interesting more consistently then reaching Claremont will be faster, but right now, I read an issue or two on a whim, then move on to something else 'cause X-Men didn't grab my attention enough.
    Well, it's hard for the original run to grab anyone's attention, especially considering what came after and today's standards overall. It's tame, though it has its charm, and is fascinating if only to peruse to hunt for seeds and clues pertaining to the O5, their history and their core characteristics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    But yeah I can see why X-Men got cancelled back then, compared to other stuff Marvel had at the time, they felt less creative, but it's understandable, Lee and Kirby came up with a lot of things from Marvel, and while Kirby was a scarily creative, that has a limit, specially with the work output he had, and unfortunately I felt that X-Men showed the limit more clearly, specially when they had to compete with F4, and F4 had more stuff going on with the weird concepts Kirby came up with.
    Well, it's clear that there was nothing wrong with the core concept of the X-Men; only how the creators chose to execute and explore, or not explore, it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Warlioncomics View Post
    You aren't nuts, you are something else that can't be said here ����������
    You are so terrible. I'm chatting with you right now via DMs and just saw this message... I'll get you yet!
    Jean Grey in the words of Walt Whitman, from his masterpiece Leaves of Grass, "Song of Myself" (51 and 52):

    "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)"

    "Failing to fetch me at first keep encouraged, Missing me one place search another, I stop somewhere waiting for you."

  10. #3790
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    Do you guys think Jean will appear or at least have a cameo in X Men Red? They have been foreshadowing that Cable will either lose control of his TO/TK due to Brand's machinations. If he does lose control of it it would be weird for Jean to not get involved (or at least make a cameo or something) considering that, aside from Cable himself, I think she's the only one who can really stabilize Cable's TO (She was the one who taught him how to do it and was the one doing it for him when he was a kid) plus I dont think she will be too happy with Brand messing with Cable's virus.
    JeanAndCable.jpg

    training.jpg

    sentence.jpg
    But yeah, if theres going to be a Cable going out of control because of TO sub plot Jeans should be in it.
    Last edited by MkDiz; 05-25-2022 at 02:01 PM.

  11. #3791
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    Better yet...he could help himself. He's had more than enough time and experience knowing how to handle his powers by himself. IOW...He's a grown man, why would he need his mommy?
    My Summer rain. My rooftop in Japan. My quiet in the storm. *cries* Al Ewing is GOD...Praise His name! Uplift Him in song! Glorify His works!

  12. #3792
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    Better yet...he could help himself. He's had more than enough time and experience knowing how to handle his powers by himself. IOW...He's a grown man, why would he need his mommy?
    Brand is specifically targeting Cable's TO. The reason why the Progenitors attacked Mars was so that Brand can get a sample of his TO and analyze it. He can control it normally but Brand seems like she's really planning something with Cable's TO/TK so he'll need all the help he can get.

    Plus didnt you see the retcon? Cable apparently has no control over his powers anymore, which if you look at my posts is something that I'm really salty about. But hey, its Krakoa, maybe someone's just going to vaporize him again and be done with it. Maybe they'll show how powerful Jean is by showing her vaporizing Cable while she's chilling with Wolverine.

    Eh whatever, I kinda expected that if I brought up a possible Cable/Jean team up/interaction someone's gonna go "why need mommy?"
    Anyway, good day to you
    Last edited by MkDiz; 05-25-2022 at 02:37 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MkDiz View Post
    Brand is specifically targeting Cable's TO. The reason why the Progenitors attacked Mars was so that Brand can get a sample of his TO and analyze it. He can control it normally but Brand seems like she's really planning something with Cable's TO/TK so he'll need all the help he can get.

    Plus didnt you see the retcon? Cable apparently has no control over his powers anymore, which if you look at my posts is something that I'm really salty about. But hey, its Krakoa, maybe someone's just going to vaporize him again and be done with it. Maybe they'll show how powerful Jean is by showing her vaporizing Cable while she's chilling with Wolverine.

    Eh whatever, I kinda expected that if I brought up a possible Cable/Jean team up/interaction someone's gonna go "why need mommy?"
    Anyway, good day to you
    Even if he does not fix it by himself, there are healers and scientists. A grown man, even if he needs help should not alway turn to mother.

    Cable is an extremely resourceful time travel who has survived all sorts of things and come back from the dead even before Krakoa, plus he was on his own since age 13.

  14. #3794

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    Quote Originally Posted by MkDiz View Post
    Do you guys think Jean will appear or at least have a cameo in X Men Red? They have been foreshadowing that Cable will either lose control of his TO/TK due to Brand's machinations. If he does lose control of it it would be weird for Jean to not get involved (or at least make a cameo or something) considering that, aside from Cable himself, I think she's the only one who can really stabilize Cable's TO (She was the one who taught him how to do it and was the one doing it for him when he was a kid) plus I dont think she will be too happy with Brand messing with Cable's virus.
    JeanAndCable.jpg

    training.jpg

    sentence.jpg
    But yeah, if theres going to be a Cable going out of control because of TO sub plot Jeans should be in it.
    X-men red will probably include a Summers arc in which they fight against Vulcan/help him
    Cable is basically one of the characters who are way overpowered and needs to be contained somehow , that’s why Ewing retconned him to be like his counterpart Nate Grey as Nate’s TK was so powerful that it was killing him & seemingly what killed his physical body in X-men disassembled is that

    While Jean can’t be happy over people messing with her kid he is able to handle things pretty well because he’s older than her , he’s an expert soldier not just a normal hero & according to Cable reloaded, Duggan’s Cable 12 and solicitations Cable knows stuff about the current era and is playing a long game
    Also Jean caring about what people do to Cable kinda seems weird considering that she’s dating the dude who killed Cable’s son

    The Summers in the current era have the weirdest plots /are the weirdest plot devices

  15. #3795
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    Better yet...he could help himself. He's had more than enough time and experience knowing how to handle his powers by himself. IOW...He's a grown man, why would he need his mommy?
    It's not about needing his mommy, who, if we want to get really technical, is Madelyne, but about having someone he trusts and loves, and who feels the same towards him, offer him support. It could be a moving side plot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Warlioncomics View Post
    Also Jean caring about what people do to Cable kinda seems weird considering that she’s dating the dude who killed Cable’s son
    Yes, she and Logan have kissed around 3-5 times in the last 3 years, mostly under platonic circumstances, save for that one time in the hot tub; therefore, they're dating. Actually, they've been having sex four times a month in the caverns of the Blue Area of the Moon, are on the cusp of marriage, and are pregnant. Katherine, or "Shine," will be making her Krakoan debut shortly.

    Also, speaking of caring, or loving, for that matter: Scott caring about, nevermind loving, Jean seems kinda weird considering the fact that he didn't think to tell her that her clone was being resurrected, acting as if Jean was a "complication" to work around (see Hellions #18), even though she cared more for Madelyne and Nate's wellbeing upon her return from stasis than he ever did.

    Let's not even get into him carrying on a telepathic affair with and likely also "dating" the woman who not only was instrumental in facilitating Mastermind's abuse of Jean but also flooded her time-displaced teenage self with her own memories of having sex with Scott, whose teenage mind she also later controlled and personality she tried to rewrite.

    See what I did there? We can do this all day. I will not have you casting moral judgments on Jean when your favorite character gets away with doing what he does. You know, I'm trying to love Jean and Scott's pairing the way I used to, but takes like yours make it really hard.

    Now, do it again.
    Jean Grey in the words of Walt Whitman, from his masterpiece Leaves of Grass, "Song of Myself" (51 and 52):

    "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)"

    "Failing to fetch me at first keep encouraged, Missing me one place search another, I stop somewhere waiting for you."

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