Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2022

[Mercury]

I manly post to point out stuff that I don’t appreciate, it’s my way of helping marvel get better, I deserve a medal for my feedback.

You might consider joining Twitter and offering your feedback to the creators directly and, of course, respectfully. I doubt anyone from Marvel frequents these threads, which is why I find it puzzling when people say that they voice their negative opinions here, in Jean's appreciation thread, as a way of catalyzing change.

Then again, I understand if that's not what you want to do. As I've shared before, my way of getting my point across to creators is by sharing panels and pages of Jean's history that either reinforce the direction in which I believe she should be taken or that contradict depictions I find troublesome in one way or another. So far, the creators I've spoken to have been open, generous, and grateful.

I see what I do more as informing than persuading. Ultimately, every writer can't know every single aspect of every single character, so I think a lot of them are grateful to have something they had never seen before about a character that they're writing. It's like adding tools to their toolbox.

[jwatson]

I do get the concern for Jean’s usage, but I think we should at the very least trust Mercury’s take if it is so difficult to believe in what Gillen says. Yes, Mercury does get excited over a lot, but they are most certainly incredibly accurate in news about Jean is portrayed usually.

Not to mention we have wanted a spicier Jean and already we are seeing snippets of it in this preview alone from just a single line, which no one can deny is the most personality Jean has had in that one phrase in comparison to Hickman’s Jean comparatively. We have seen Gillen’s view of Jean before through his previous X-Men stories.





Critique is fine, but pre-judging in my opinion is not a real good thing. Speculation is fine. Excitement is good. But tempering expectations are also reasonable to do. But let’s actually read the whole thing before writing Gillen’s work on Jean off as good or bad.

@jwatson doesn’t really like Gillen’s writing anyways and it’s completely fine for them because they have legitimately given Gillen’s work a try and didn’t like anything. But I think everyone else should at the very least see what he does with Jean before saying anything, especially if we liked what he has brought so far.

Example: I was pretty underwhelmed by Jean’s portrayal in the first issue of A.X.E. She came at the tail end of a battle and completely missed out on a psychic fight that really showed off the power of the psi’s of the Quiet Council after Druig attests that no single Eternal can fight the psi’s in combat, despite literally being a nation of psychics.

Is that gonna make me judge an entire issue off of a preview? No. Would I like to see Jean wrecking Eternals right out of the gate? Yeah, but I am not gonna nitpick the issue for what I see is only a couple of pages in a battle that had already started before Exodus had even arrived. I will reserve that judgement for when the issue comes out.

His Darth Vader, Doc Alphra and Young avengers and his Eternals (which instead of getting a proper conclusion turned into an event)were good. So i wouldn't say i don't like anything he writes. I was actually pimping him as a good writer from those but my initial thing was none of his marvel books have diversity to which i got jumped on by people saying "well check his creator owned stuff". But what he has presented in his recent stuff has not been good to me and i am one who can understand when a franchise lacks diversity and it makes sense like FF being a family, etc. But to come into a franchise with so much of it and basically erase it for his event is not a good look. Then the material just nosedived from there. Just to clear that up.

[Mercury]

But to come into a franchise with so much of it and basically erase it for his event is not a good look. Then the material just nosedived from there. Just to clear that up.

If I may ask, how did Gillen "erase it"? If I remember correctly, he gave Ewing the option of deciding how big Uranos' attack on Arrako would be. If that was the case, it was Ewing who chose to go all out, which makes sense because it would give him more pathos to work with.

[jwatson]

If I may ask, how did Gillen "erase it"? If I remember correctly, he gave Ewing the option of deciding how big Uranos' attack on Arrako would be. If that was the case, it was Ewing who chose to go all out, which makes sense because it would give him more pathos to work with.

I'm not going to answer a question that edits my post and takes all the context out. This isn't a point of too many characters to quote.

[Mercury]

I'm not going to answer a question that edits my post and takes all the context out. This isn't a point of too many characters to quote.

I reread your post and realized by "erase it" you meant that Gillen has erased the franchise's diversity in this event. I still think that's a premature call to make since, again, we've seen less than 10% of this event and, as I noted, Ewing may have been the one who decided how far to go with Uranos' decimation of Arrako.

[PyroFN]

His Darth Vader, Doc Alphra and Young avengers and his Eternals (which instead of getting a proper conclusion turned into an event)were good. So i wouldn't say i don't like anything he writes. I was actually pimping him as a good writer from those but my initial thing was none of his marvel books have diversity to which i got jumped on by people saying "well check his creator owned stuff". But what he has presented in his recent stuff has not been good to me and i am one who can understand when a franchise lacks diversity and it makes sense like FF being a family, etc. But to come into a franchise with so much of it and basically erase it for his event is not a good look. Then the material just nosedived from there. Just to clear that up.

This was indeed what I was referring to when I said you didn’t like Gillen’s writing. It wasn’t meant to be all-encompassing, but rather based on recent stories. Considering this has been the path Gillen has been on, I don’t imagine that opinion to change anytime soon. It’s not a pronouncement, since humans change their minds all the time, but it is the current pattern going so far.

[MechaJeanix]

I think KG will do great with Jean. I am looking forward to JD 2 this Wednesday.

I also agree that the negativity in this thread can be exhausting, it often kills the excitement some of us have when we want to come here and share our enthusiasm for a hobby that we sometimes incorrectly assume we all enjoy! (lol yikes!). This isn't new to me because even during my fav run (Grant Morrison's New X-men) there were vocal detractors that often sucked all the fun out of the experience. It is fine that we disagree and it is fine that some of us do not enjoy the X-men anymore, but sometimes it does feel like groundhog's day in this thread when the constant criticisms are the same and repeated over and over. Granted a lot of our discussions are the same and have been for years, but the constant negativity (for me and some others at least) makes it almost unbearable to participate sometimes.

Also since comics usually just come out once a month we can be impatient. We also were spoiled by the Teen Jean era and X-men Red because Jean had such a large role and we wanted that to continue. Most of us are still burned from all the years Jean was dead and we had so many teases about her return but it was just trolling (and that lasted too long - but luckily that era is long over). Currently Jean is a major player in Duggan's book and in an big event. There are things to be excited and positive about. Hopefully soon we will all have things we can appreciate and enjoy..time will tell!

[The Thunderbird]

It's too early to judge how Jean will be treated during this event. Personally I'm not too worried about Jean. She does basically have her own issue after all so there's plenty of space for her there. With loads of characters in the main books I don't really expect her to take on too much of the spotlight so I'll be surprised if she does.

At least Jean's no longer wearing the miniskirt.

[MarquisAsh]

I’m not too worried about Jean. I’m sure she will be as confident in herself as we want her to be. I hope she finally unleashes her true abilities since these beings are “Eternal” so they should be able to take it.

[Micabe]

I’m not too worried about Jean. I’m sure she will be as confident in herself as we want her to be. I hope she finally unleashes her true abilities since these beings are “Eternal” so they should be able to take it.

Neither am I... If Jean can solo the Shi'ar Imperial Guard she'll do fine against the Eternals.

[Havok83]

I suspect he will reaffirm what Duggan has already subtly established: Jean's choice to reclaim the Marvel Girl garb and moniker was a conflicted one that left her feeling insecure. I also have a hunch Gillen might be exploring this in A.X.E.: X-Men #1. In either case, something tells me fans will still complain.

Interestingly enough, she appears on the roster in Judgment Day #1 as Jean Grey, not Marvel Girl.

I dont think that means anything. She's appeared as such throughout the Krakoa era. Its not something thats been consistent and she goes back and forth between both names in the roster page

[Exodus]

AIPT: Another X-Fan in search of clarity (X-Fans love clarity), Uncanny X-Man wanted to know what the deal is with Jean Grey’s codename. Did Jean ditch the Marvel Girl moniker?

Jordan: She certainly seems to have, yes. She specifically said, “I was Marvel Girl. Now I am Jean Grey.” I think this is a hard one to answer without talking about the real world, right? In the reality of X-Men, Jean’s a weird character because she’s one of a few who don’t have a name that sticks. We tried to go back to Marvel Girl and it seems not to have taken or stuck. We had specific reasons for doing it. We’ve talked about them before — and they’re the same as the dress, which, obviously, also didn’t stick quite as long. In people’s brains, she’s wired in as Jean Grey. For some, she’s Phoenix as well, but obviously, she doesn’t have the Phoenix Force now, so we’re not calling her Phoenix. The other characters like that…

https://aiptcomics.com/2022/08/08/x-...ordan-d-white/

...Yes, there is a name that sticks...P.H.O.E.N.I.X.

there is also more conversation about the decision to give her the green dress back.

[Daedra]

AIPT: Another X-Fan in search of clarity (X-Fans love clarity), Uncanny X-Man wanted to know what the deal is with Jean Grey’s codename. Did Jean ditch the Marvel Girl moniker?

Jordan: She certainly seems to have, yes. She specifically said, “I was Marvel Girl. Now I am Jean Grey.” I think this is a hard one to answer without talking about the real world, right? In the reality of X-Men, Jean’s a weird character because she’s one of a few who don’t have a name that sticks. We tried to go back to Marvel Girl and it seems not to have taken or stuck. We had specific reasons for doing it. We’ve talked about them before — and they’re the same as the dress, which, obviously, also didn’t stick quite as long. In people’s brains, she’s wired in as Jean Grey. For some, she’s Phoenix as well, but obviously, she doesn’t have the Phoenix Force now, so we’re not calling her Phoenix. The other characters like that…

https://aiptcomics.com/2022/08/08/x-...ordan-d-white/

...Yes, there is a name that sticks...P.H.O.E.N.I.X.

there is also more conversation about the decision to give her the green dress back.

I read the interview as well but I wasn’t able to gather any new insight regarding the “reasons” that led the Jean Grey from x-men red to revert into her marvel girl persona, maybe the upcoming issue centering on her relationship with the phoenix will finally give us a definitive answer.

[andreikes]

I read the interview as well but I wasn’t able to gather any new insight regarding the “reasons” that led the Jean Grey from x-men red to revert into her marvel girl persona, maybe the upcoming issue centering on her relationship with the phoenix will finally give us a definitive answer.

The midlife crisis hits everyone

[Daedra]

The midlife crisis hits everyone

The good news is we are back on the right track, looks like the crisis has come and gone. Incidentally JDW did talk about the x-men ages as well and according to him due to the resurrection protocols people like scott or Jean are around 27 years old (if I am quoting him right.)