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  1. #811
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotman View Post
    Oh absolutely. I don’t think I’ve ever seen self sabotage like that with a character before. David Walker and Ivan Reis gave them the perfect version of the character and they flushed it. That Vic Stone was finally the tech god of the future that they had been trying to create and DC said “nah, let’s just revert him to tragic clunky Frankenstein.”
    When you do NOT control EVERYTHING including editing stuff like that happens.

    We saw with New 52 Static, Jason Rusch and John Stewart.
    You can not just have a strong writer-you need a stronger EDITOR.

    You can't have an editor default Xanshi-something that even 90s John Stewart trading cards kept mentioning (I own them).

    How many times In mainstream Dc have we see John's family since 1988? Or his wife get mentioned?

    He has an adopted brother-whose to say that brother is not the father of Jakeem Thunder? Exxy from Cyborg?

  2. #812
    Incredible Member ducklord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Thanks for everything you contributed. Mark Shaw really does seem like a Great Choice as an arch enemy for Big John. Would love for some writer to explore that.

    And the point you make about him having an earthbound background, as well as potential for sagas in space make him a really cool to diversify where their battles could push them against each other.
    Of course, right now Shaw's potential is being peed away as Leviathan... a complete heel turn that STILL HASN'T BEEN EXPLAINED.

    (I have nothing against characters undergoing radical transformations - I just want a freakin' origin story. Even the last-second Hawk-is-Monarch swerve *tried* to show us how it happened).

  3. #813
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ducklord View Post
    Of course, right now Shaw's potential is being peed away as Leviathan... a complete heel turn that STILL HASN'T BEEN EXPLAINED.

    (I have nothing against characters undergoing radical transformations - I just want a freakin' origin story. Even the last-second Hawk-is-Monarch swerve *tried* to show us how it happened).
    Don't worry, Mark was mercifully killed off.

  4. #814
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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  5. #815
    Astonishing Member Sodam Yat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    I'm not sure what you mean by that, he wrote John a total of what 2 times? both which were very brief outtings, of which he mentioned Xanshi one of those two times and did it far more tastefully than most writers. let's not pretend the man "can't let go" as if he spent 12 issues spinning his wheels...

    Xanshi isn't the problem, mediocre writers doing a mediocre job with John has always been the problem. the solution isn't to just abandon a good writer because they mention an old story nor is it to hedge our bets on a meh writer just because they're doing an ok-ish job trying hard to do "something new". there is a balance that needs to be met, John needs a strong character driven writer who knows his history and can write with nuance. Ridley fits that bill better than most.
    Writing a character less than two times can determine whether the writer has good quality for the character. Doesn't need more. There's more to John than Xanshi. I've seen other writers that did way better than John Ridley and they only did a single issue with him.

    Come on, Cosmic Odyssey is just as old as me. It's over 3 decades old. You're saying there's no other story references for writers to pick up on after that story?

    Anyways, Xanshi was brought up twice both the times he's written John. Even when he written John in the Valentines Day Special, one of the main purpose for the story was to learn about John's failure to save Xanshi. The story led to John being the blame on why Yrra is the way she is. It pointed out his failure to save the planet led to even more consequences. Just when that wasn't enough. It acknowledged that his failure is what caused her to kill hundreds of Green Lanterns. There wouldn't be a Yrra villain without John's troubled past. Even how the Zamarons were written wasn't all that good, either. Hell, John and Yrra didn't even really speak to each other in this story and it's supposed to be a valentines day special. So I don't see how that's more tastefully than other writers. There was nothing cool or exciting about the story.

    It's no different than how Geoff Johns would write John in a book that's solely about him. And Geoff Johns is not even considered a mediocre writer. Peter Tomasi isn't considered a mediocre writer and he doesn't write John well. The problem we have is a lack of interest and passion that drives these writers to give John the potential that he deserves. Van Jensen doesn't have a big name like Geoff Johns, John Ridley, Judd Winick, Peter Tomasi, and more. But he did way more than what those writers ever did. He was creative. That's because he saw more into John than what those writers did. There was clearly more passion in his works with John.

    Robert Venditti is considered a mediocre writer to readers from what I see, but yet, he does a better job than John Ridley at writing John. I would rather for him to write John than John Ridley.

  6. #816
    Astonishing Member Sodam Yat's Avatar
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  7. #817
    Incredible Member ducklord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    Don't worry, Mark was mercifully killed off.
    (goes off and looks that up)

    Well, that's a complete and utter waste of a character.

    I mean, I was never the biggest fan of Mark Shaw (although I really dug his early Manhunter/Privateer/Star-Tsar phase), but kee-ripes, this whole Leviathan thing has just been an outright case of shared universe malpractice.

  8. #818
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ducklord View Post
    (goes off and looks that up)

    Well, that's a complete and utter waste of a character.

    I mean, I was never the biggest fan of Mark Shaw (although I really dug his early Manhunter/Privateer/Star-Tsar phase), but kee-ripes, this whole Leviathan thing has just been an outright case of shared universe malpractice.
    After Ultimate Iron Man was published, Mark Millar removed it from continuity by saying it was an anime in the Ultimate Universe. He got rid of a 6 or 12 issue book with 1-2 pages. I imagine someone could fix the Mark Shaw thing just as easily. I mean, the MCU even did something like that with the Mandarin

  9. #819
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sodam Yat View Post
    Writing a character less than two times can determine whether the writer has good quality for the character. Doesn't need more. There's more to John than Xanshi. I've seen other writers that did way better than John Ridley and they only did a single issue with him.

    Come on, Cosmic Odyssey is just as old as me. It's over 3 decades old. You're saying there's no other story references for writers to pick up on after that story?

    Anyways, Xanshi was brought up twice both the times he's written John. Even when he written John in the Valentines Day Special, one of the main purpose for the story was to learn about John's failure to save Xanshi. The story led to John being the blame on why Yrra is the way she is. It pointed out his failure to save the planet led to even more consequences. Just when that wasn't enough. It acknowledged that his failure is what caused her to kill hundreds of Green Lanterns. There wouldn't be a Yrra villain without John's troubled past. Even how the Zamarons were written wasn't all that good, either. Hell, John and Yrra didn't even really speak to each other in this story and it's supposed to be a valentines day special. So I don't see how that's more tastefully than other writers. There was nothing cool or exciting about the story.

    It's no different than how Geoff Johns would write John in a book that's solely about him. And Geoff Johns is not even considered a mediocre writer. Peter Tomasi isn't considered a mediocre writer and he doesn't write John well. The problem we have is a lack of interest and passion that drives these writers to give John the potential that he deserves. Van Jensen doesn't have a big name like Geoff Johns, John Ridley, Judd Winick, Peter Tomasi, and more. But he did way more than what those writers ever did. He was creative. That's because he saw more into John than what those writers did. There was clearly more passion in his works with John.

    Robert Venditti is considered a mediocre writer to readers from what I see, but yet, he does a better job than John Ridley at writing John. I would rather for him to write John than John Ridley.
    I couldn’t have said this better myself.

  10. #820
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sodam Yat View Post
    Thanks for linking— Good read

  11. #821
    Astonishing Member Redjack's Avatar
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    hmmmm


  12. #822
    Astonishing Member Sodam Yat's Avatar
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    I love that art!

  13. #823
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    Quite intriguing

  14. #824
    Extraordinary Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Looks fun, hope it was a good time drawing this
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
    Words to live by.

  15. #825
    Astonishing Member Redjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    Looks fun, hope it was a good time drawing this
    definitely more fun than just writing "buckle up."

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