Zatanna Zatara Mistress of Magic Appreciation Thread 2022

[John Venus]

Hell yeah, reading this really make me want to see it's realized. Lot of potential stories and various approach, would also like to add Zee various pets like her white tiger, meatpie from her webtoon or her rabbits xd.

Pralaya could be the grand finale boss at her third season.

I wonder what good character flaws for Zatanna to overcome? Could her DC SHG flaws of being prissy, vain, attention seeker could be implemented on more serious series?

Self doubt is kinda so-so for me, as long as it's doesn't make her numb. Guilts or self doubts if she is good enough even after she has done her best could be good though.

Back in the Satellite era, her main flaw was a need to prove herself which lead to her over compensating herself and resulted in a brief power loss. It also sometimes lead to her not being able to see her strengths.

The Keanu Constantine movie is bad news. Zaslav didn't trust JJ so he took away Constantine. I doubt JJ will be willing to make a solo Zatanna movie knowing that it wouldn't lead to JLD.

BTW how did they come up with the name JLD for the team? When Madam X gathered them all, none of them had anything to do with the JL except for Zatanna.

I think it's just the consolation prize. JJ couldn't get the JLD project made in time and Zaslav is looking to cut costs so instead of doing the work of making a new show they just choose to make a sequel to Keanu's Constantine.

That actually kind of reminds me of Bloodspell where Zatanna quickly changes the subject when Black Canary asks if all the money she gets from her personal merchandise goes to charity like it does for the other JL members .

Her wealth was also brought up in her own ongoing. Zach learns that she gets paid millions and Zee explains that she has to pay her crew, set designs and for the animals she has to take care as well.

[Edwin30]

Here's the Sweeney Boo cover. Batman vs. Robin #4 variant.

I remember I posted a sneak peek of this cover a week or two ago. Glad to see it came out so fine. We were worried it might be a commission and we won't get to see the full picture.

BTW Zee is in 3 of the covers of this event. I think she still has some part to play.

[Rac7d*]

I remember I posted a sneak peek of this cover a week or two ago. Glad to see it came out so fine. We were worried it might be a commission and we won't get to see the full picture.

BTW Zee is in 3 of the covers of this event. I think she still has some part to play.

Yeah but it’s feeling like black canary in deathstroke

[starduck]

https://twitter.com/mindyleedoodles/...Xfp-YYRA-XFIEA

Love it. she looks like an umbran witch from bayonetta

[Mai Zen]

Back in the Satellite era, her main flaw was a need to prove herself which lead to her over compensating herself and resulted in a brief power loss. It also sometimes lead to her not being able to see her strengths.

I like that take. With that, You know Zee would actively push herself.

Another one trait I like from Zatanna is how she can be vengeful despite her good natured personalities. The inherent contradiction is interesting for me. I like this saying, “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”

[Vordan]

Gaiman writes a fun Zatanna:



From the 90s Books of Magic mini

[Frontier]

Gaiman writes a fun Zatanna:



From the 90s Books of Magic mini

This looks fun (and was back when they were trying to act like Zee outgrew her classic look even though she still looks amazing in it), although I keep hearing that after this Zatanna is an idiot that ends up getting that kid in trouble because she brought him to the last place he should've gone.

[Vordan]

This looks fun (and was back when they were trying to act like Zee outgrew her classic look even though she still looks amazing in it), although I keep hearing that after this Zatanna is an idiot that ends up getting that kid in trouble because she brought him to the last place he should've gone.

Yeah didn’t get that far. It’s kind of hard to say whether it was the “wrong” thing to do because the whole mini is about introducing Tim to all the corners of the magic side of the DCU. Zatanna shows him the evil side, and it’s not even the most dangerous place they take Tim by far. The Trenchcoat Brigade are also major assholes and idiots at times themselves in this mini so I think it’s just how Gaiman writes magic users to compensate for how powerful they are.

[Mai Zen]

Gaiman writes a fun Zatanna:



From the 90s Books of Magic mini

That's a cool page. I also like Zatanna and Tim interactions on the Book of Magic series

[Frontier]

They should depict Zee with apprentices more...you know you're a DC Hero when you've got a sidekick or two .

Also obvious between the legs shot is obvious .

[Edwin30]

I was rereading JLD 2018. I think Ram V really rushed the battle with UDM. It sucks because Tynion spent a lot of time setting him up and then Ram V finished him within 2 issues so he could set up his own villain- Merlin. However Ram V didn't get to finish his own story. Got cut short due to Dark Crisis. I wonder if he'll pick it up after Dark Crisis.

[Vordan]

That's a cool page. I also like Zatanna and Tim interactions on the Book of Magic series

Just about to start reading that, nice to know she show up in it!

[John Venus]

I like that take. With that, You know Zee would actively push herself.

Another one trait I like from Zatanna is how she can be vengeful despite her good natured personalities. The inherent contradiction is interesting for me. I like this saying, “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”

Yeah, Zee does have a dark side. I guess when you're that powerful and you feel rightfully angry over something you're going to end up using your powers in a darker way. Good impetus for a 'good intentions pave the way to hell' kind of story (but not in how Identity Crisis did it).

Yeah didn’t get that far. It’s kind of hard to say whether it was the “wrong” thing to do because the whole mini is about introducing Tim to all the corners of the magic side of the DCU. Zatanna shows him the evil side, and it’s not even the most dangerous place they take Tim by far. The Trenchcoat Brigade are also major assholes and idiots at times themselves in this mini so I think it’s just how Gaiman writes magic users to compensate for how powerful they are.

"Hey, Zee. This kid is being sought out by powerful mages. Can you watch after him?"

"Okie dokie."

~A few minutes later~

"Hey, Tim! Wanna got to a bar full of magical weirdos, I will totes protect you!"

::fails to protect Tim Hunter and Constantine had to pull a big damn heroes moment to save Tim::

The story made Zee look like an idiot. The other magical heroes don't come off looking good either. Everyone except Constantine and Deadman are idiots or assholes.

It's one of the reasons why I began to dislike John Constantine and then it bloomed into full blown dislike after JLD Vol 1 kicked off. It doesn't help that Peter Milligan, Tom Taylor and Ram V their cues from that book on their stories with 'Constantine is cooler than all other magical characters/Zatanna is just a damsel side piece' tropes that have become all too common.

I was rereading JLD 2018. I think Ram V really rushed the battle with UDM. It sucks because Tynion spent a lot of time setting him up and then Ram V finished him within 2 issues so he could set up his own villain- Merlin. However Ram V didn't get to finish his own story. Got cut short due to Dark Crisis. I wonder if he'll pick it up after Dark Crisis.

Ram V is an amazing writer but his handling of Zatanna was terrible.

It's obvious he is drawing from Gaiman's Books of Magic take on Zatanna which was very OOC and inconsistent with her prior appearances. She was on the JL at that point, even served as chair lady, she defeated Starro almost single handedly, defeated the demon Hellrazer and faced off against threats from the multiverse as well. It should have been *her* that the demons were terrified of.

[superduperman]

Yeah, Zee does have a dark side. I guess when you're that powerful and you feel rightfully angry over something you're going to end up using your powers in a darker way. Good impetus for a 'good intentions pave the way to hell' kind of story (but not in how Identity Crisis did it).



"Hey, Zee. This kid is being sought out by powerful mages. Can you watch after him?"

"Okie dokie."

~A few minutes later~

"Hey, Tim! Wanna got to a bar full of magical weirdos, I will totes protect you!"

::fails to protect Tim Hunter and Constantine had to pull a big damn heroes moment to save Tim::

The story made Zee look like an idiot. The other magical heroes don't come off looking good either. Everyone except Constantine and Deadman are idiots or assholes.

It's one of the reasons why I began to dislike John Constantine and then it bloomed into full blown dislike after JLD Vol 1 kicked off. It doesn't help that Peter Milligan, Tom Taylor and Ram V their cues from that book on their stories with 'Constantine is cooler than all other magical characters/Zatanna is just a damsel side piece' tropes that have become all too common.



Ram V is an amazing writer but his handling of Zatanna was terrible.

It's obvious he is drawing from Gaiman's Books of Magic take on Zatanna which was very OOC and inconsistent with her prior appearances. She was on the JL at that point, even served as chair lady, she defeated Starro almost single handedly, defeated the demon Hellrazer and faced off against threats from the multiverse as well. It should have been *her* that the demons were terrified of.

Constantine is to magic users in the DCU what Batman is to superheroes. Everyone else gets stupid around him so he looks cool. Garth Ennis had a term for Constantine when he was writing his book called a "wide boy". I guess over in England it's a term for someone who uses others until they are no longer useful and then discards them. We saw a little bit of this in the TV show.

[Frontier]

I'm at a point where I just see the JLD as holding Zatanna back.