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  1. #376
    Extraordinary Member Badou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakeNightwingGreatAgain View Post
    Ehh, this is something that's not exactly true either. Babs quite literally stays in Gotham 90% of the time! She doesn't really get out. BOP is in Gotham. Batfam is in Gotham. Her entire operation runs out of Gotham. She deosnt really do globe trotting or state hopping in any way. Remember, Babs whole thing is about being grounded and realistic. This is a direct contrast to do Dick, who likes to be able to be on the go and more of an idealist. In the same way Kory wouldn't be able to being half of Dick's stories, Babs wouldn't be able to either because it would go against her characterization. Babs is happy with her life being the way it is, the way she planned for it to be. There is also less of a need for Babs in most parts of the DCU because they already have more advanced tech than Babs can ever offer them. Babs is a product of her time and really hasn't been modernized at all to fit in with what Dick does. Seeing Babs lead the Titans in 88 was kinda cringe for this reason. She is perfect for Batfam and local stuff, but she certainly doesn't fit into every corner of the DCU and I dont think she actually wants to.
    There is a big difference in not being used and not fitting in. Babs has been used in the DCU as both Batgirl and Oracle, but it isn't as common as a Nightwing, Robin, or Batman because those other characters already operate in that space much more. So Babs gets put in her Birds of Prey book or tends to stay in Gotham as a result, but her role isn't that dissimilar to a Nightwing, Robin, or a Batman. So she can easily fit into bigger DCU stories because her character type (a Gotham hero) already works in those stories. A Starfire or other superpowered heroes can't fit in places like Gotham because characters with her level of ability simply don't work there. They can't tell their typical street level stories with her involved and there is a reason you don't see heroes like that flying around Gotham.

  2. #377
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badou View Post
    There is a big difference in not being used and not fitting in. Babs has been used in the DCU as both Batgirl and Oracle, but it isn't as common as a Nightwing, Robin, or Batman because those other characters already operate in that space much more. So Babs gets put in her Birds of Prey book or tends to stay in Gotham as a result, but her role isn't that dissimilar to a Nightwing, Robin, or a Batman. So she can easily fit into bigger DCU stories because her character type (a Gotham hero) already works in those stories. A Starfire or other superpowered heroes can't fit in places like Gotham because characters with her level of ability simply don't work there. They can't tell their typical street level stories with her involved and there is a reason you don't see heroes like that flying around Gotham.
    This is totally true.

    Barbara as Batgirl wouldn't be so different from Nightwing. If Nightwing can have adventures outside Gotham, Batgirl can too.

    Also, we have seen that Barbara's intelligence and tech skills have reached "JL levels". So, she will likely fit in JL more than other Batman family members.

    It's DC who doesn't seem to be interested in using her outside Gotham.
    Last edited by Konja7; 01-20-2022 at 04:04 AM.

  3. #378
    Mighty Member Avi's Avatar
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    I don't get this obsession to attach characters that are in a relationship at the hip.

    Dick and whoever heroine he is in a relationship with should have independent adventures from each other. They shouldn't be featured in each other's runs continuously. If that's what DC wants, they should just make a couples book for them.

    If Kory doesn't work because she is too overpowered, then Babs doesn't work because she is doing what Dick can do alone. Coincidentally, that's exactly what this week's Nightwing #88 shows.

  4. #379
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Well if they are not actually going to show readers the relationship then there isn’t much point in there even being a relationship. Not being around one another kind of defeats the purpose.

  5. #380
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avi View Post
    If Kory doesn't work because she is too overpowered, then Babs doesn't work because she is doing what Dick can do alone. Coincidentally, that's exactly what this week's Nightwing #88 shows.
    In fact, this is a pretty good point.

    I've already said that Barbara could work outside Gotham. However, it would be difficult that Barbara and Dick could work together in the same team outside Gotham, since their abilities could feel redundant.

    It's the same reason why you couldn't have Batman and Nightwing in the same team.
    Last edited by Konja7; 01-20-2022 at 06:12 AM.

  6. #381
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Um Dick wouldn’t exist if that didn’t work.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 01-20-2022 at 06:39 AM.

  7. #382
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Um Dick wouldn’t exist if that didn’t work.
    Do you think Batman and Nightwing could work together in Justice League?

    Dick was created as a sidekick for Batman. So, they definitely could work in the same team when Dick was a sidekick for Bruce.

    However, Bruce and Dick (as an independent hero) could feel redundant in a team outside Gotham.

  8. #383
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avi View Post
    I don't get this obsession to attach characters that are in a relationship at the hip.

    Dick and whoever heroine he is in a relationship with should have independent adventures from each other. They shouldn't be featured in each other's runs continuously. If that's what DC wants, they should just make a couples book for them.

    If Kory doesn't work because she is too overpowered, then Babs doesn't work because she is doing what Dick can do alone. Coincidentally, that's exactly what this week's Nightwing #88 shows.
    Why do you guys have problem with Babs activities all of a sudden
    She does the same for Bruce and no one says she is redundant. It helps to have someone on comms operating at base when in the field. But now it’s too much? This is a dynamic used for decades and in real life so what’s the problem?

    It helps mission success rate, provides backup, she is so helpful.

  9. #384
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    Quote Originally Posted by Konja7 View Post
    Do you think Batman and Nightwing could work together in Justice League?

    Dick was created as a sidekick for Batman. So, they definitely could work in the same team when Dick was a sidekick for Bruce.

    However, Bruce and Dick (as an independent hero) could feel redundant in a team outside Gotham.
    Bruce and dick are about as redundant as Batman and green arrow.

  10. #385
    Extraordinary Member Badou's Avatar
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    If multiple Green Lanterns or multiple Flash-type characters can work on the same team then I don't see why Bruce and Dick couldn't. There are plenty of teams that have overlap but for some reason people get really uneasy when it is specifically Bruce and Dick on the same team.

    Also it should also be stated that Dick and Babs have never dated while both were active heroes. They dated before when she was only Oracle. I get they are pushing this whole spine issue thing with her more and they are keeping her in the chair more which I don't like, but she is technically an active hero so it is a different type of dynamic than the two have had previously. So she should be much more independent than she was before as she can go out and do things on her own as a hero over having to just coordinate for others.

  11. #386
    Mighty Member ayanestar's Avatar
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    I personally enjoy seeing Batman and Nightwing work together, so why can't they be on the same team. Though I don't really want Nightwing on the JL team, but that's because that book has been a hot mess for years now, and I don't think much has changed since the last time I picked it up.
    Last edited by ayanestar; 01-20-2022 at 10:01 AM.

  12. #387
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    Quote Originally Posted by ayanestar View Post
    I personally enjoy seeing Batman and Nightwing work together, so why can't they be on the same team. I don't really want Nightwing on the JL team, but that's because that book has been a hot mess for years now, and I don't think much has changed since the last time I picked it up.
    I still haven’t recovered respect for them after the Titans shut down

  13. #388

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    This conversation is funny because Dick as Nightwing is redundant already. He only persists as a character because too many of us still support him, for better or worse. He can't even hold his own in- and out-of-universe in his most popular stint as Nightwing since at least Dixon was on the book lol.

  14. #389
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badou View Post
    If multiple Green Lanterns or multiple Flash-type characters can work on the same team then I don't see why Bruce and Dick couldn't. There are plenty of teams that have overlap but for some reason people get really uneasy when it is specifically Bruce and Dick on the same team.
    Do multiple Green Lantern or Flash type characters work on the same team? They have "family" crossovers in the same way the Bat Characters do, but the only time I can remember two or more of them on the same roster of a DCU team was the very brief time Simon Baz and Jessica Cruz were on the League - and they were being specifically pushed as double-act rookies rather than independent characters.

    Honestly, my own character preferences aside, it just seems a bit of a waste to have two characters from the same family on a team when part of the fun is the different areas of the DCU rubbing shoulders. Dick on a Bruce-less team? Sure, I'll read that - but if it's just that there's a spot going free, use it for Zauriel or Blue Beetle or someone.

  15. #390
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badou View Post
    If multiple Green Lanterns or multiple Flash-type characters can work on the same team then I don't see why Bruce and Dick couldn't. There are plenty of teams that have overlap but for some reason people get really uneasy when it is specifically Bruce and Dick on the same team.

    Also it should also be stated that Dick and Babs have never dated while both were active heroes. They dated before when she was only Oracle. I get they are pushing this whole spine issue thing with her more and they are keeping her in the chair more which I don't like, but she is technically an active hero so it is a different type of dynamic than the two have had previously. So she should be much more independent than she was before as she can go out and do things on her own as a hero over having to just coordinate for others.
    The only time I remember there being more than one GL on a team is Hal/John in the last JLA run and Jessica/Simon in the Bryan Hitch JL. It's not that common.

    I don't think a team has ever had two Flashes.

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