Damian wayne robin appreciation 2022

[Lal]

In terms of prominence in the DCU, it seems Damian is playing a much bigger role than Tim at the moment.

Damian was a key player in the Shadow war event that lead to Dark crisis and affected Deathstroke.
Damian is part of the main roster in Dark crisis, while Tim is relegated to a tie-in that literally everyone hates and so far is completely unrelated to anything.
Damian is getting a new series with Batman that is going to affect the entire DCU, while Tim will have a solo with a questionable creative team and will live on a boat.

[Morgoth]

Damian's advantage is that he now has much better writers than Tim.
I'm worried about Damian's fate during Batman vs Robin. There might be an interesting new magic-related status quo, or there might be another heel-turn.

[Astralabius]

The problem is, at least in my opinion, that bigger role doesn't equal good role.
Being a big player in an event that lead to dark crisis and seemingly being the cause for something being terribly wrong with the magic is...not ideal.
Escpecially since that whole Alfred situation showed that it took a lot of fans complaining about it for DC to stop acting like Alfred's death was Damian's fault (which it simply wasn't, people just need to read the entirety of City of Bane). So some of us are worried that Batman vs Robin might not be good for Damian.

I also find it strange how people talk about Waid writing Damian. To me it sounds more like he'll be writing Nezha, Batman and Zatanna. Damian is posessed. I'm really not sure how much acual Damian is going to be in this.

Tim, yeah, the creative team for his ongoing isn't the best, but he's showing up in a lot of books lately. Just this week he was not just in the YJ-tie-in, he was also in Nightwing and in two Urban Legends stories.

[dietrich]

In terms of prominence in the DCU, it seems Damian is playing a much bigger role than Tim at the moment.

Damian was a key player in the Shadow war event that lead to Dark crisis and affected Deathstroke.
Damian is part of the main roster in Dark crisis, while Tim is relegated to a tie-in that literally everyone hates and so far is completely unrelated to anything.
Damian is getting a new series with Batman that is going to affect the entire DCU, while Tim will have a solo with a questionable creative team and will live on a boat.

I get what you are saying and you are correct.
Personally though I'd rather have a great story and development over prominence.

Dark Crisis, yeah Damian is part of the main story but he's a bit player while the YJ kids get a story focused on them for several issues.

Prominence isn't always a guarantee that a character will get good steady material.

I don't know what DC is thinking with Tim's creative team. Honestly DC is failing both Damian and Tim.

Megan isn't a writer that fans of the YJ gen like and the artist they picked for Tim's solo doesn't fit the boy love/pretty boy genre that DC has been pushing Tim in of late.

What are the decision makers thinking.

[OOPS]

I think Damian's direction issues might be a little more complicated. I get the feeling they had a direction-Future State. That direction proved unpopular, and Fidio was no longer involved. But while I think Williamson and others tried to shift direction, being in the merge meant being in a freeze. I don't know of many companies that can initiate new contracts or projects during a merge. That would have left them with the remnants of 5G to work around. Those plans projects would have been the ones with existing agreements...which would flow from Waid's comments that Batman vs Robin flow from the stories a year ago.

I feel like a lot of writers have used Damian to prop up other characters...both practically and in figuratively. Which is my concern for the magic direction. Even in Crisis Damian is getting pulled into that non selling direction, which already failed with Jason.

Plus, moving Tim back to Robin, boosts Tim (in addition to checking a box). I think they think the role of Robin sells. Which, granted, it has. I'm just not sure it's going to sell with the new creative team, particularly with the themes that team wants to explore. But I also suspect being part of the merger process, they can't pivot now.

But on the Damian front, I just don't see a magic focus as being a good direction. Elevate other characters yes....but drag Damian into sells oblivion.

[Lal]

I think Damian's direction issues might be a little more complicated. I get the feeling they had a direction-Future State. That direction proved unpopular, and Fidio was no longer involved. But while I think Williamson and others tried to shift direction, being in the merge meant being in a freeze. I don't know of many companies that can initiate new contracts or projects during a merge. That would have left them with the remnants of 5G to work around. Those plans projects would have been the ones with existing agreements...which would flow from Waid's comments that Batman vs Robin flow from the stories a year ago.

I feel like a lot of writers have used Damian to prop up other characters...both practically and in figuratively. Which is my concern for the magic direction. Even in Crisis Damian is getting pulled into that non selling direction, which already failed with Jason.

Plus, moving Tim back to Robin, boosts Tim (in addition to checking a box). I think they think the role of Robin sells. Which, granted, it has. I'm just not sure it's going to sell with the new creative team, particularly with the themes that team wants to explore. But I also suspect being part of the merger process, they can't pivot now.

But on the Damian front, I just don't see a magic focus as being a good direction. Elevate other characters yes....but drag Damian into sells oblivion.

Waid is one of DC's top sellers right now, and so far he did a great job in World's finest.
I'm not sure if the magic niche is indeed great for Damian, but I don't think this series is going to tank in sales.
Being written by one of DC's top talent as well as having a big impact on the rest of the DCU will probably lead this mini to sell at least decently if not very well.

I completely get the concern that Damian will be portrayed badly, but it's entirely possible that we'll get Damian resisting the Demon's mind control and fighting back, or investigating what is happening to him or the magic users and discovering the truth about the demon and about the Al-Ghul line. It's not necessarily going to be bad.

As for the concept of "Damian is used to prop other characters" - I think it's just that other writers want to include Damian in their stories, but for some reason Williamson wanted Damian to be isolated to tell his own story. That's probably the reason why Damian was able to appear in non-Gotham like SSOK, but not the other way around.
I think we were meant to take from the book that the batfamily is giving Damian time and space to figure himself out alone, not being neglecting.

As for the mantle sharing - this one is indeed tricky.
I'm sure that Tim going back to Robin is meant to elevate his status, as well as to push the "queer Robin" agenda, but I'm not sure how well it's going to play out.
If this event will end with Damian graduating from being Robin before Tim, it'll make Tim look pretty bad. His much young brother already surpassed him and moved on, especially after Tim's failed attempts to graduate.
On the other hand, the two sharing the Robin mantle and Tim being the secondary Robin is also pretty bad, so I'm not sure if there's a good way around it.
Maybe Tim's new solo will be all about him getting a new mantle, it seems to be hinted at the YJ book, but I doubt this solo is going to sell well and establish a cool new identity on par with Nightwing.
To be honest, Damian seems much more likely to be able to evolve to his own unique mantle.
(For the record, I do believe Tim is still quite popular, and his solo could sell well, but the current creative team is just distancing possible readers.)

Anyway, I don't think Damian is going to become evil in this event, but him staying one of DC's main players (after ditching the villain idea) seems promising enough for me.

[dietrich]

https://yoko-hasagagua.tumblr.com

[Morgoth]

BATMAN VS. ROBIN #3
Written by MARK WAID
Art and cover by MAHMUD ASRAR
Variant covers by ALEX MALEEV
and MATEUS MANHANINI
'90s variant cover by CARLO BARBERI
1:25 variant cover by MARIO "FOX" FOCCILLO
1:50 variant cover by TONY S. DANIEL
$5.99 US | 48 pages | 3 of 5 | $6.99 US (card stock)
ON SALE 11/8/22
Batman has been on a breakneck journey throughout the DC Universe, from Wayne Manor to the House of Secrets and back again...but where there are clues there is a trail, and the world's greatest detective has followed this particular trail back to where he and Superman began this journey: Lazarus Island. With an entire island and army at Damian Wayne's disposal, does Batman stand a chance? We'll give you a hint: NO!

Damian is wearing Batman 666 outfit on the poster.

[dietrich]

Damian is wearing Batman 666 outfit on the poster.

I love that suit however I will repeat what i said a while back. are we leading up to batman 666? The Damian who exchanged his soul at age 14 to save Gotham. A magic Damian who is has connections to a devil/a demon.

[Morgoth]

Well, in that ''leak'' on 4chan (and it was actually right about JSA revival, so, who knows) it was mentioned, that Waid will write Damian as ''magical Batman'' after Dark Crisis and Batman vs Robin, so, who knows.
Also, it seems like Dark Crisis tie-in with Damian will have some connection to Batman vs Robin.

[dietrich]

Well, in that ''leak'' on 4chan (and it was actually right about JSA revival, so, who knows) it was mentioned, that Waid will write Damian as ''magical Batman'' after Dark Crisis and Batman vs Robin, so, who knows.
Also, it seems like Dark Crisis tie-in with Damian will have some connection to Batman vs Robin.

The Damian Dark Crisis tie in is also written by Waid isn't it? Seems like he's doing a lot with Damian. Outside of Knight's watch All the solicited material with Damian is written by Waid.

Are the 4chan rumours coming true?

[Morgoth]

The Damian Dark Crisis tie in is also written by Waid isn't it? Seems like he's doing a lot with Damian. Outside of Knight's watch All the solicited material with Damian is written by Waid.

Are the 4chan rumours coming true?

I don't remember all of them, but JSA was indeed mentioned there, although this may just be a guess.
I remember it mentioned that Damian would be in Justice League Dark, and it looks like the team members will be in one form or another in Batman vs Robin, Zatanna does seem to have a support role.

[Astralabius]

I don't remember all of them, but JSA was indeed mentioned there, although this may just be a guess.
I remember it mentioned that Damian would be in Justice League Dark, and it looks like the team members will be in one form or another in Batman vs Robin, Zatanna does seem to have a support role.

Hmpf. Not sure if I like that. So far Damian hasn't been handled well in the team books I've read and Damian in a team that usually consists of adults (at least as far as I'm aware) doesn't sound that exciting either.

I feel like DC often puts characters in teams when they don't really know what to do with them. And even if Damian had a major role, people wouldn't stop complaining that a 14 year old kid from the batman franchise has an important role in DC's magic team. Like when everybody complained about Damian leading the Teen Titans at the start of Rebirth.

[Morgoth]

If they're putting Damian in Justice League Dark, I'm betting it's just because they want a popular Bat-character in this team to sell the book.

[OOPS]

I don't know if I want to pay for a Justice League Dark type book for a panel here or there (I dont care for team books overall)...especially when I find the magic part of DCU kind of unappealing. I've no interest in Zatana, Constantine etc at all.

Plus it's like the path to obscurity taken by Signal and Jason with the All Caste.

Oh well. If it comes to that, I'll not have it pulled, but check reviews first then see if I want to buy.