Diamond Dame EMMA FROST appreciation

[CuteClops]

The problem that the post-SW world did was highlight that Emma didnt really have many strong ties within the X-men. She loved Scott and had to watch him die in front of her. Did was depressed and grieved alone. Did anyone of them check up on her? Did anyone stand by her? Did anyone try to recruit her to give her a fresh start and something positive to focus on? No. She was pretty much abandoned and that showed their true colors in terms of how they felt about her. A year went by and no one cared about Emma until she returned with her plan in IvX. Even going back to AvX, there was no loyalty to her. Regardless of all the years spent as an X-men, she didnt forge strong bonds which kind of tells me they never had a high opinion of her anyway

The X-hypocrites did the same with Scott.

[CuteClops]

I agree with this sentiment. Emma is at her best when she can be herself and doesn't have to try too hard to fit into a particular role. I think after Whedon left, too many writers tried to force Emma into Jean Grey's old role as Cyclops' girlfriend and the X-men's top telepath. That's just too limiting for someone like Emma. She does better when she can just follow her own path and I hope she gets a chance to do that at some point.

Emma and Jean, right? I think the same thing about Jean. She must stay away from Scott Summers, she need to go her way, away from Scott.

[ExodusCloak]

I agree with this sentiment. Emma is at her best when she can be herself and doesn't have to try too hard to fit into a particular role. I think after Whedon left, too many writers tried to force Emma into Jean Grey's old role as Cyclops' girlfriend and the X-men's top telepath. That's just too limiting for someone like Emma. She does better when she can just follow her own path and I hope she gets a chance to do that at some point.

You're giving Jean too much credit, Emma's relationship with Scott was completely different to Jeans. Different dynamic, actual humor injected into it. Additionally, Emma replaced Xavier and Old Wolverine not Jean

[WhiteQueenEmmaFrost]

So is it just me, or does it seem like Paniccia's replacement prefers Emma as a villain...? He said that Scemma brought Scott's character down, and that Emma is a great character just not with Scott. But then he said he prefers Emma when she's not trying to fit into the X-men... :/

https://twitter.com/cracksh0t/status/976053590136639488

https://twitter.com/cracksh0t/status/976191335844777984

There's a difference between "not with Scott" and "not with the Xmen" Scott & the Xmen aren't one in the same.

I think I'm just simply done. I'm tired of waiting for things to get better and wasting time with this crap. Xmen comics haven't been good in a looong time and I just honestly can't be bothered. This goes beyond Emma and I hope that people start seeing that it's a much larger issue. Go into any specific character thread and it's the same complaint. Continuity is being ignored, the quality isn't there, and more and more people are reading online instead of buying because it's not worth the money.

[Havok83]

Emma and Jean, right? I think the same thing about Jean. She must stay away from Scott Summers, she need to go her way, away from Scott.

well Scott is dead so by default they are already doing more with Jean than merely being his gf which is a good thing. Red has been a godsend in terms of expanding her beyond her usual cast of characters and giving her a more significant role

[CuteClops]

well Scott is dead so by default they are already doing more with Jean than merely being his gf which is a good thing. Red has been a godsend in terms of expanding her beyond her usual cast of characters and giving her a more significant role

Exactly. And when, and IF Scott comes back, he and Jean will never happen again. Never. Never, ever again.
You know, Jean and Emma deserve the best.

Jean can keep being a terrorist in Red and Emma could open a school, and everybody wins.

[ButterRum]

I loved Emma as a villain, too, minus the Deadly Genesis and Fraction retcons. I also love her as an X-Men and her past as a villain makes her evolution into the X-Men much more interesting. Because she's acts like a bitch is why people don't trust her and think she'll always resort to villainy.

Also, she's been involved with the X-Men since the early 90s!!!!!!

What sucks about the IvX thing is that Emma has been 100% loyal to the X-Men since Generation X. Emma is fiercely loyal to what she truly believes in, and that's why IvX was such a disservice to her character.


I can see why people think Emma brought Cyclops' character down, but I don't think people are considering that mutants were on the brink of extinction with multiple enemies trying to kill them all. Emma is a survivor, and her tactics were questionable and sometimes preemptive, and Emma understands you can't go kumbaya and hold hands when a species is being wiped out. It was weird that Cyclops kept the X-Force thing a secret even though he borrowed a thing or two from Emma. What's funny is that Wolverine was complicit in the plan, too, yet somehow Emma gets the blame for bringing Cyclops' character down. Anyways, she sure had influence on his dark decisions, but hopefully people understand the full context when they say "Emma brought Cyclops' character down." It's very possible that the situation mutants were in brought Cyclops' character down, as well.

Cyclops will be revived, and it's possible he'll be back as more lighthearted superhero, but let's remember that mutants are no longer extinct and so they can afford the super heroics and not have to worry their species is dying out.

There's a difference between "not with Scott" and "not with the Xmen" Scott & the Xmen aren't one in the same.

I think I'm just simply done. I'm tired of waiting for things to get better and wasting time with this crap. Xmen comics haven't been good in a looong time and I just honestly can't be bothered. This goes beyond Emma and I hope that people start seeing that it's a much larger issue. Go into any specific character thread and it's the same complaint. Continuity is being ignored, the quality isn't there, and more and more people are reading online instead of buying because it's not worth the money.

Yeah the only hope I'm hanging onto is that the X-Men just haven't been written well in nearly a decade and that other fans are complaining about their favorites, too, so, uhhhh, at least it's not only Emma?

[airdreams]

I'm kinda pessimistic about Emma's following development. Yes it'll be cool if she becomes the brand-new big bad for both X-Men, but I believe we all know what happens to (even important) antagonists - being awesome in one arc and then vanishing for a long time after defeated by protagonists.

That's why I hate to see her going back to villainy - not only do I prefer Emma as an bad heroine to a real villainess, but also her character has way more opportunities to further develop while she's one of the member of protagonists than when she's a villain. Wanna see her hidden "a great deal of pain" through her pride and confidence? Without enough appearance, it’s only a pie in the sky. Regular appearing means a bloody lot for all of comic characters.

Btw some keep complaining that Emma sometimes hasn't been depicted "right" as a hero, but the plain fact is that she could be depicted terribly wrong while being a villain too - it all depends on writers and editors, and given the limited appearance of being a villain, the wrong depiction is so hard to notice that people tend to believe it doesn't exist.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

The problem with Emma going all big bad is that it's kind of a copy of what happened with Maddy, after she and Scott split she went all crazy and big bad. If written well I don't have a problem with Scott/Emma, it can be fun for both...

[AbnormallyNormal]

I'm kinda pessimistic about Emma's following development. Yes it'll be cool if she becomes the brand-new big bad for both X-Men, but I believe we all know what happens to (even important) antagonists - being awesome in one arc and then vanishing for a long time after defeated by protagonists.

That's why I hate to see her going back to villainy - not only do I prefer Emma as an bad heroine to a real villainess, but also her character has way more opportunities to further develop while she's one of the member of protagonists than when she's a villain. Wanna see her hidden "a great deal of pain" through her pride and confidence? Without enough appearance, it’s only a pie in the sky. Regular appearing means a bloody lot for all of comic characters.

Btw some keep complaining that Emma sometimes hasn't been depicted "right" as a hero, but the plain fact is that she could be depicted terribly wrong while being a villain too - it all depends on writers and editors, and given the limited appearance of being a villain, the wrong depiction is so hard to notice that people tend to believe it doesn't exist.

She won't be the new big bad... she's already reforming away from being a villain...

[Havok83]

The problem with Emma going all big bad is that it's kind of a copy of what happened with Maddy, after she and Scott split she went all crazy and big bad. If written well I don't have a problem with Scott/Emma, it can be fun for both...

Not really. The Maddie and Emma situation is hardly comparable. Emma lost Scott in AvX. That didnt make her crazy and bad. IvX and X-men Blue is so much weaker than Inferno and the motivations given to Maddie

[LoganAlpha30X33]

I just meant that good X-lady loses Scott and then becomes big bad afterwards, I know that they're not an exact copy but some of the circumstances are similar...

[lurkerforyears]

I think IvX must have been very improvised on the go because of how bad it was, and that Marvel realizes both that it was terrible and that nobody likes it

The clearest example is Emma never got to wear the Crazy Judge Dredd Cyclops Widow costume

I think she may be in a team, but it will not be the official mansion one, perhaps something like Tieri's Weapon X at worst in terms of villainy, (Sabretooth, Wild Child, Sauron, Maverick, Kane, Mesmero, Marrow) but most likely something closer to x-force or Bunn's Uncanny.

[Havok83]

I think IvX must have been very improvised on the go because of how bad it was, and that Marvel realizes both that it was terrible and that nobody likes it

The clearest example is Emma never got to wear the Crazy Judge Dredd Cyclops Widow costume

I think she may be in a team, but it will not be the official mansion one, perhaps something like Tieri's Weapon X at worst in terms of villainy, (Sabretooth, Wild Child, Sauron, Maverick, Kane, Mesmero, Marrow) but most likely something closer to x-force or Bunn's Uncanny.

I can see her being used like Mystique was. Not an official X-man, but an affiliated ally

[RAWRlrus]

She won't be the new big bad... she's already reforming away from being a villain...

Hopefully. They've been pretty inconsistent with her portrayal. Hopeful this arc in Blue shows her better than SE blue arc, but I don't have much faith with them.