The Avengers Appreciation 2022

[Digifiend]

(Civil War II#8).

Best writing 10/10.

Someone praising Bendis? I thought people were glad to see him gone when he went over to DC. And DC fans seem glad that he's about to leave them too.

[Omega Alpha]

Someone praising Bendis? I thought people were glad to see him gone when he went over to DC. And DC fans seem glad that he's about to leave them too.

Wait, is Bendis leaving DC? Is he coming back to Marvel? I'd be happy to see in the Avengers again, only for the outrage hahaha

(Nah, seriously, he stayed for too long on that book, and his flaws became more accentuated over time there and elsewhere, as if often happens with comic writers, so I wouldn't be happy to see him at anything other than Daredevil. That said, considering how irrelevant the Avengers book became over the years compared to how they were in his and Hickman's time, I wouldn't be surprised if Marvel actually hired him again just for the headlines if he's interested)

[Triniking1234]

Man, Civil War II had to have been one of the dumbest events I have ever had to sit through. Watching people react in real time to how bad it was and the defenses to the story slowly eroding over time was priceless .

Bendis really had Clint kill Banner in cold blood.

[Nomads1]

In case it wasn't clear somehow, the scans are from the parody, not the actual Civil War II.

No, I understood it was a parody (I only read Civil War II once, couldn't bring myself to reread it, but I didn't recall a scene like that). It's just not much a parody, IMHO, because it brought up exactly what my problems with Bendis' writing are, and it's didn't exagerate SO much on the reality of it. The same kind of juvenile Beeves and Butthead humor, the heroes always being the butt of the "jokes" (and I use the word VERY losely).

Yeah I remember something about Wanda's power being used for that, but I forgot the exact details.

Anyways, so the characters were able to predict possible outcomes and were using this to be more proactive, that sounds like what Civil War II Dude can do, but now Stark is against it for some reason.

The main reason that it made a difference for me was that they never predicted the threat. They merely pinpointed hot spots were things could happen (without knowing what it was) and tried to be there to prevent the threat from escalating and getting out of hand. It was a different take from all those "proactive" teams that proposed to eliminate the threats before they became threats, which was basically profiling and the 'Minority Report' approach (if you stop a crime BEFORE it happens, is it a crime?).

Now, I can accept contradictions like this to an extent if the story gives a proper reason for this, but uh, Civil War II doesn't bother with anything, to the point Stark is insane enough to blame Carol and precognition on Rhodey's death, and then the last issue is like "Oh Tony kinda trusted you Carol, it's just those vague evil people from the future he doesn't trust!":

Yeat another beef I have with Bendis. Lack of originality. He gets ideas other writers have had, and better explored, gives it a tweak, passes of as his, and totally screws it up. What Beast is saying is basically the SAME argument Nighthawk presented to a defeated Hyperion about the flaws of their Utopia program, in Gru's legendary Squadron Supreme maxi-series.

(Civil War II#8).

Best writing 10/10.

Sarcasm, right?

Peace

[Frontier]

Bendis really had Clint kill Banner in cold blood.

Sometimes it just strikes me that Clint Barton is a murderer and he got away with it and people are chill about it (I know Bruce came back, but still).

[Lukmendes]

Someone praising Bendis? I thought people were glad to see him gone when he went over to DC. And DC fans seem glad that he's about to leave them too.

That was sarcasm lol.

Bendis really had Clint kill Banner in cold blood.

Bendis seems like he has a hate boner for Clint lol.

No, I understood it was a parody (I only read Civil War II once, couldn't bring myself to reread it, but I didn't recall a scene like that). It's just not much a parody, IMHO, because it brought up exactly what my problems with Bendis' writing are, and it's didn't exagerate SO much on the reality of it. The same kind of juvenile Beeves and Butthead humor, the heroes always being the butt of the "jokes" (and I use the word VERY losely).

At least the dialogue is better .

The main reason that it made a difference for me was that they never predicted the threat. They merely pinpointed hot spots were things could happen (without knowing what it was) and tried to be there to prevent the threat from escalating and getting out of hand. It was a different take from all those "proactive" teams that proposed to eliminate the threats before they became threats, which was basically profiling and the 'Minority Report' approach (if you stop a crime BEFORE it happens, is it a crime?).

That is quite reasonable.

Yeat another beef I have with Bendis. Lack of originality. He gets ideas other writers have had, and better explored, gives it a tweak, passes of as his, and totally screws it up. What Beast is saying is basically the SAME argument Nighthawk presented to a defeated Hyperion about the flaws of their Utopia program, in Gru's legendary Squadron Supreme maxi-series.

Oh, wasn't aware of that.

Sarcasm, right?

Peace

Definitely, I don't mock something only to give it a 10/10 without being very sarcastic, I'm not a reviewer lol.

Sometimes it just strikes me that Clint Barton is a murderer and he got away with it and people are chill about it (I know Bruce came back, but still).

Heroes sometimes get away with literal murder yeah lol.

[Anthony W]

Tom Brevoort has said before that angry fans buy stuff, and Civil War is an example of this, Avengers vs X-Men is just a continuation of that.

Angry fans buy things...until they stop buying things LOL

[Lukmendes]

Angry fans buy things...until they stop buying things LOL

Yep, that's the entire fucking problem with Brevoort's strat, it does work, but only on the short term, because if you piss off fans long enough, they'll eventually quit, maybe not permanently, and definitely won't happen with all at the same time, but that still hurts the sales eventually.

Post-90's Marvel is even an example of this, after the entire industry crashed, part of the early 2000's actually had to make an effort in getting fans back, since Marvel was almost bankrupt, so they had to try to tell actually interesting stories instead of pissing off the three fans they had left, stuff like Ultimate got a lot of new readers, but then the same guys decided to go back to the Brevoort method and made Civil War happen, genius...

[Digifiend]

Wait, is Bendis leaving DC? Is he coming back to Marvel? I'd be happy to see in the Avengers again, only for the outrage hahaha

His only remaining solicited DC book is Justice League vs Legion of Super-Heroes #6. His creator owned stuff already moved to another publisher. So yeah, he seems to be finished at DC Comics.

[Anthony W]

His only remaining solicited DC book is Justice League vs Legion of Super-Heroes #6. His creator owned stuff already moved to another publisher. So yeah, he seems to be finished at DC Comics.

Can Marvel Comics even afford Bendis now? LMAO.

[Shadowcat]

Someone praising Bendis? I thought people were glad to see him gone when he went over to DC. And DC fans seem glad that he's about to leave them too.

He’s still with DC, it’s just that his exclusive wasn’t active anymore. He’s involved with the LoSH animated series that as far as I’m *aware, is still in production.

[Shadowcat]

Angry fans buy things...until they stop buying things LOL

I’ve only dropped the Avengers titles twice since 1992, and that was during Bendis’s runs, and now with Aaron’s.

[Omega Alpha]

Yep, that's the entire fucking problem with Brevoort's strat, it does work, but only on the short term, because if you piss off fans long enough, they'll eventually quit, maybe not permanently, and definitely won't happen with all at the same time, but that still hurts the sales eventually.

Post-90's Marvel is even an example of this, after the entire industry crashed, part of the early 2000's actually had to make an effort in getting fans back, since Marvel was almost bankrupt, so they had to try to tell actually interesting stories instead of pissing off the three fans they had left, stuff like Ultimate got a lot of new readers, but then the same guys decided to go back to the Brevoort method and made Civil War happen, genius...

Civil War actually was a hit, and then AvX was also a hit, and then Civil War II and IvX...not at all. Hell, probably the biggest hit Marvel had in recent years, not just in sales at the time, but also long term-impact and acclaim was HoX/P10, which did the exact opposite of what Marvel did before- didn't pit heroes against heroes, built something intended to last, even with retcons didn't ask readers to ignore decades of stories, etc. I don't think Marvel learned the lesson, though.

[Kurolegacy]

Now, I can accept contradictions like this to an extent if the story gives a proper reason for this, but uh, Civil War II doesn't bother with anything, to the point Stark is insane enough to blame Carol and precognition on Rhodey's death, and then the last issue is like "Oh Tony kinda trusted you Carol, it's just those vague evil people from the future he doesn't trust!":





(Civil War II#8).

Best writing 10/10.

I know it’s not the topic of discussion but God these pictures remind me of just how badly Aaron botched the reconciliation of Tony and Carol in his Avengers. The whole thing basically amounted to Carol saying that she’s not going to apologize for almost killing Tony which flies to the contrary of how she’s feeling in this scene here. Sure Tony’s approach was terrible in CWII but how do you not even so much as feel remorseful about almost killing a good friend just because they got better eventually? Of course that seems to fall in line with Aaron’s feminist style voices that he gave Carol, Jennifer and Natasha at various points in the early part of his run.

[Frontier]

I know it’s not the topic of discussion but God these pictures remind me of just how badly Aaron botched the reconciliation of Tony and Carol in his Avengers. The whole thing basically amounted to Carol saying that she’s not going to apologize for almost killing Tony which flies to the contrary of how she’s feeling in this scene here. Sure Tony’s approach was terrible in CWII but how do you not even so much as feel remorseful about almost killing a good friend just because they got better eventually? Of course that seems to fall in line with Aaron’s feminist style voices that he gave Carol, Jennifer and Natasha at various points in the early part of his run.

But....But...Muh Strong Female Characters!

I remember when he had Natasha randomly make the Shiar Imperial Guard's issue with a pregnant lady with a cosmically powered baby about birth control or something.