Mary Jane Watson-Parker Appreciation 2022

[WebLurker]

What do you mean it 'didn't work all that well'? Slott's Renew Your Vows was well received across the board, cited by even some of his critics as being amongst his best work, and it led to a well received spin-off that lasted longer than it reasonably should have, and also included stories which made you question whether or not the marriage was a good fit for either of them (MJ and Peter endangering Annie by approving her as a superhero, or MJ initially hiding that she acquired the symbiote from Peter, even after it started corrupting her)

I actually liked the Venom story. It was a decent follow up to the original having Venom wanting revenge on Spider-Man (consequences of past decisions) and it integrated the family metaphor into the superhero plot (MJ's whole motivation in the first place was feeling like she's wasn't pulling her own weight and that was bothering her). So far as MJ hiding the symbiote, I think part of the idea was that she didn't realize it was Venom until it was too late and it sure looked like it was influencing her for its own agenda. I also didn't really see it as evidence that her and Peter's marriage was a questionable decision; MJ made a mistake and, while we're given an understanding how it came about, it's never presented as anything but. Even a solid marriage is going to have off days or times when one partner is bone-headed about something. MJ's sincerely remorseful over this instance and Peter forgives her. In context, they seem pretty functional, all things considered.

[Lukmendes]

Stern definitely was the best anti-marriage writer to write the relationship. Even during his ASM run he had that sweet moment where MJ and Peter were walking through the park reminiscing over the last time they were a couple, and she teases there may come a time where they can be one again. He didn't use MJ all that much in that run, but when he did, it mattered and put the two in a very good place, and fleshing out her origin gave Tom D all the keys to put in the ignition.

Stern's married himself and was the one to have Lois and Clark speak their wedding vows (which were reportedly his own verbatim), so it's no surprise he had a good handle on the marriage when he used it in his stories. They were always pleasant moments and MJ always helped Peter figure things out.

Being married doesn't necessarily means he'd be more competent at writing the marriage, after all, JMS was divorced when he wrote the marriage and that could easily be used to make both Spidey and MJ miserable, but it wasn't, and Wells is in a relationship with a famous woman, that could be used to give relatable situations on how it feels for Peter to be married with MJ, but what happens is, uh, MJ being useless and pathetic lol.

In this case we should be praising Stern for being mature, he doesn't like the marriage but writes it well if he has to, it should be default for a writer to be that mature, but unfortunately it ain't.

DeMatties was on Spectacular, but he bailed well before the Chapter One/Relaunch happened. His most memorable contribution around that period was kicking off Norman's 'Lex Luthor' phase, MJ beating Chameleon with the baseball bat, and setting up a new Jack O'Lantern mystery that he never resolved.

Yeah I know he was in Spectacular, that's why I said "ASM specifically", because he only briefly wrote it in clone saga by that point.

Didn't know Chapter One happened that late though.

I don't like the way MJ defeated Chameleon, all she did was keep swinging the bat which was enough to scare him off and then he ran away, I know he's not that tough in combat but, seriously? Fucking overpowered bat lol.

What do you mean it 'didn't work all that well'? Slott's Renew Your Vows was well received across the board, cited by even some of his critics as being amongst his best work, and it led to a well received spin-off that lasted longer than it reasonably should have, and also included stories which made you question whether or not the marriage was a good fit for either of them (MJ and Peter endangering Annie by approving her as a superhero, or MJ initially hiding that she acquired the symbiote from Peter, even after it started corrupting her)

To be fair, MJ didn't know it was a symbiote, Liz said it was some advanced tech shit, although, she should either have warned Spidey she's gonna talk with Liz, or have talked with him afterwards that she got some "tech" from Liz, regardless, she didn't intentionally pick the symbiote thinking she knew better, it's an understandable mistake.

'Renew Your Vows' was always a trick title, Peter and MJ didn't have a single maritial problem in that story and were air-tight, it wasn't about the marriage or the family, that was a bonus, the theme of the story was Peter coming to grips with breaking his no-kill code and 'renewing' his vow to adhere to that by defeating Regent and sparing his life despite all he had done to the world.

Renew Your Vows is a bait title, since it's supposed to make people think it's about 616 Spidey, it makes no sense with RYV's universe lol.

It's also Slott copying Doctor Who again, as It's no better than Steven Moffat claiming the series seven finale of Doctor Who would reveal The Doctor's name, only it turns out to be about a vow/promise he made in his own name.

If you're right about that and Slott was influenced by Moffat, it's a wonder RYV isn't a comple trainwreck lol.

Also, didn't he say he hates Parallel Lives?

Not sure about hate, but he does have a pretty dumb logic about Parallel Lives, apparently MJ knowing that Peter is Spidey since that early in his life means MJ loves Spider-Man and not Peter Parker, yeah.

[Matt Rat]

Renew Your Vows is a bait title, since it's supposed to make people think it's about 616 Spidey, it makes no sense with RYV's universe lol.

I just explained to someone how it did.

[WebLurker]

Renew Your Vows is a bait title, since it's supposed to make people think it's about 616 Spidey, it makes no sense with RYV's universe lol.

Dunno, outside of the original Secret Wars teaser, Marvel was pretty upfront that it was an AU series. Heck, I always took the title to be a meta one referring to it's context as a married Spider-Man story published in the midst of the OMD status quo being standard for years (not to mention Slott's then-current run not exactly being all that supportive of them in the first place).

[Matt Rat]

Dunno, outside of the original Secret Wars teaser, Marvel was pretty upfront that it was an AU series.

Slott was the one who said 'elements' of it would carry over into the main book, which he was right about. Regent was adapted into 616 the following year, and Slott implied the RYV Parkers were connected to 616 Peter and MJ. A few months later, the RYV Parkers got their own comic and Annie was made an important figure in the next mainstream Spider-Verse saga etc

[Frontier]

Man, Regent was a thing...that of course made it into the Slott Spider-Man cartoon .

[Kevinroc]

Man, Regent was a thing...that of course made it into the Slott Spider-Man cartoon .

At least Sony hasn't announced a Regent movie.

Yet...

[Matt Rat]

Man, Regent was a thing...that of course made it into the Slott Spider-Man cartoon .

Dematties wrote a couple of episodes of that show too

[Sr. Bungle]

Man, Regent was a thing...that of course made it into the Slott Spider-Man cartoon .

Thank God I stopped watching Spider-Man cartoons since the end of Spectacular

[WebLurker]

Slott was the one who said 'elements' of it would carry over into the main book, which he was right about. Regent was adapted into 616 the following year, and Slott implied the RYV Parkers were connected to 616 Peter and MJ. A few months later, the RYV Parkers got their own comic and Annie was made an important figure in the next mainstream Spider-Verse saga etc

Wonder how many of those were Slott's actual intentions for carryover and how many were people inspired by his work to expand with their own ideas?

Man, Regent was a thing...that of course made it into the Slott Spider-Man cartoon .

I don't think Regent was a bad concept in and of itself, just that Slott failed to make the character really work in the original mini.

[Frontier]

I don't think Regent was a bad concept in and of itself, just that Slott failed to make the character really work in the original mini.

Or in 616, really.

[WebLurker]

Or in 616, really.

Didn't read that one, but I do remember some of the jokes r.e. how Slott and/or Marvel had grossly underestimated how much readers liked the Parker family from the original and how much they overestimated the interest in Regent himself.

[Ursalink]

https://twitter.com/Marvel/status/1524125683823398915

I don't know what the Webs is Marvel doing, but if they dare to actually kill Mary Jane, I'm going to get even madder than when Marvel did the whole "Superior Spider-Man".

[Tonga]

I don't know what the Webs is Marvel doing, but if they dare to actually kill Mary Jane, I'm going to get even madder than when Marvel did the whole "Superior Spider-Man".

Do people here really think they're actually gonna kill her? Moira says "WHEN you WAKE UP I'll be wearing you.", she doesn't even say "if" so that means Moira still wants MJ to be alive. Also, I think Superior was actually pretty great.

[Ursalink]

Do people here really think they're actually gonna kill her? Moira says "WHEN you WAKE UP I'll be wearing you.", she doesn't even say "if" so that means Moira still wants MJ to be alive. Also, I think Superior was actually pretty great.

That's what I thought too (except for the Superior part), but it worries me how exactly Moira is going to "wear" Mary Jane. Last time she did, she killed Banshee and used his skin as a disguise to enter Krakoa. Clearly, to infiltrate on Krakoa, that's not going to work; because people will notice a skinsuit rotting.