I think the "outdated" stuff has more to do with his character archetype than anything else and the fact that he shares a mantle with a bunch of other characters so that automatically makes someone else "cooler", combined with the fact that he's the only GL these people can bash with no consequence since they're never taken to task for it. Besides who can take his "straight white maleness" as a legitimate criticism anyway when 99.9% of the popular characters in entertainment culture are straight white males. They bring that up because Hal is the only straight white male in the GL franchise who is an actual threat to their favorites. They don't go after Guy cause he isn't a threat to anybody. While Kyle is still a fan-favorite but I doubt he'd ever be used as the "main" GL again.
But yes, his sexuality really isn't a deal breaker by any means. I still don't get why that's so important for some people, it's like half of twitter treats Hal as the antichrist, while the other half treats him like a queer icon. lol It's hilarious.
Last edited by Johnny; 11-24-2022 at 08:59 AM.
It has more to do with the perceived current mindset of DC towards the character. If they're willing to turn him evil without even putting any effort into it in a DTV, what stops them from doing it in the DCEU or the comics again. You can't even do a proper adaptation of Emerald Twilight unless Hal is the main character since that's why it had an impact in the comics to begin with. If Hal was just someone we barely saw around anymore and suddenly he shows up as this bad guy, there's less emotional response to it since the audience is no longer invested in him. In the comics Hal still had redeeming qualities post-ET because that story was told in his perspective and he was still the main GL. In BMP he was a flashback character revealed as the "true" villain and chumped out for no other reason than to prop up the movie's main character. I don't really care it was an animated movie catered to a limited audience, DC doing this to him gives me no hope they plan to treat him any better in other media features, if he's even there.
Last edited by Johnny; 11-24-2022 at 09:00 AM.
Kyle also isn't white, though wasn't that a later addition? His original run made him come across as another white guy, just younger and "hipper" than Hal.
Yeah, Hal is subject to two extremes on Twitter. I know which extreme I'd embrace though lol. I side with Morrison's view, it's canon to me.
There is also the fact that the Anti-lantern was in a romance with Anti-Matter Sinestro. And I think Anti-Lantern was meant to be the Anti-Matter universe equivalent to Hal.
They did, but Top Gun was always Tom Cruise's movie. Hal isn't the only GL. With GL, there was some social media backlash when the 2011 movie came out because people thought they made GL white due to John being popular from the cartoon. It doesn't matter how inaccurate that assessment was, it got backlash all the same. The movie sucking and the character writing for Reynolds as Hal being obnoxious didn't help.
There would be less pressure in something like Top Gun to take an "outdated" archetype like Maverick and make it work, vs. doing it in a superhero movie where there is already an expectation for diverse Lanterns, with a big portion of the audience expecting the black man to be the lead. It's not fair to Hal, and if a chance was given it could lead to something good and popular. But from as studio perspective, just because Top Gun was a hit doesn't mean GL will be the same.
The way I see it, there's always a certain level of fan entitlement since Hal was done dirty and as a fan you believe he has to be done justice on the big or small screen and not skipped over or swept under the rug, but that's just not the reality of the situation. The entertainment industry doesn't work that way and if I was a studio executive with no emotional attachment to the character, I wouldn't think he needs to be done justice either. You go after where you think the money are and in this day and age you certainly wouldn't think they are with the Silver Age Lantern with the bad movie, even though he had the most successful GL run a while back. I think this is what I as a fan need to come to terms with if I wish to remain a fan going forward, otherwise if I keep thinking about how Hal "should" be or "must" be treated, it's never going to go anywhere. The fact is he was given a chance at the big time and it failed miserably, even though it was through no fault of his own. I can't expect him to keep getting new chances just because I happen to like the character. I still think Hal will always have a place in the DCU, just not the kind of place you'd think he should have if you became a fan during the character's peak.
Last edited by Johnny; 11-24-2022 at 02:33 PM.
Agreed, and it wouldn't be too bad to come to terms with if the last page of Morrison's run was his sendoff. I'd be perfectly content with not much Hal after that because that run would have retired him on a high note.
But then we get crap like Beware My Power, which just comes across as needless
I guess that really depends on how much one thinks the popularity of Hal Jordan at his peak, was the result of simply having a talented writer like Geoff Johns working on the title, or something about the character Hal Jordan himself that makes him popular?
Three different writers with issue number 1's (I have to check on Venditti) that broke six figures in sales, despite being consistently left off of DC's number 1 team book?!? Forget about the other Green Lanterns, there is simply very few superheroes that have that kind of sales power. .....Is it Hal, or the luck of good writers I don't know, but...
I do know that when DC or Marvel has attempted to replace a popular hero, (whether it be Johnathan Kent on the Superman title, or X23 taking over Logan) they tend to reverse course, because the brand begins to sink in popularity overall.
Now I like John Stewart, and I plan on reading his new series, and because it's written by PKJ, I will most likely read it longer than the Hal Jordan run, and I'm banking it will also be more successful than the Hal run, but am I worried that Hal will be permanently replaced by John Stewart, no....because despite being the premier GL for a generation raised on Justice League Unlimited, John Stewart just doesn't have historic track record of selling. Check the numbers of his two lead titles, and his lead in the Green Lantern Corps compared to other GL leads, the numbers just aren't there.
That's not a swipe at John Stewart, I like him, but that's just the way it is. Out of my top 5 favourite DC superheroes, (which Hal is not one) only one has ever shown any consistent long term sales power, unless your counting team books, and I can't do anything about it.
So yes, while Hal could have less of a role in the DCU at his peak, (Barring Kyle Rayner) I don't really see him playing second fiddle to another GL in the long run, and if he does, it would most likely be at the destruction of the GL brand at the comic sales level which we are already witnessing. (There currently is no GL title, and were getting GL Mini series)
Its rather sad how the GL franchise has fallen when 10 years ago they could support multiple ongoings, even a fucking Red Lantern comic that lasted 43 issues
The failure of the movie really did ruin everything
I think that in most cases,(certainly not all) it's more like the pendulum swinging back and forth from sales spike to sales spike rather than a "sink" in popularity. They know they can get a potential sales spike by upturning the status quo and introducing something new, (heck, I started buying Green Lantern because I saw Guy in "Legends" and I wanted to know what happened to that GL from "Superfriends") but they know 90% of the time it doesn't last, so they swing the pendulum back the other way for another anticipated sales spike as the IP gets "back to basics". Replacing Hal with Kyle, or Barry with Wally were definitely not intended to be short term, which is why it took so long for things to swing back, and I think that had more to do with editorial preference/long-term IP strategy than sales.
And the cycles just happen more and more often as time goes on anyway. I don't think Hal will ever go away, though he's caught up in the cycle, with wider circular arcs than the Trinity who have smaller, shorter arcs of going away then coming back.
Last edited by j9ac9k; 11-25-2022 at 02:34 AM.