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  1. #2731
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxStirner_91 View Post
    Yep, agreed. And the sooner the character is distanced from the other ****-for-brains EVS-aligned extreme of the fanbase, the better. I do not want to read thinly veiled US military industrial complex apologia in my GL stories. The sad part is the character John Broome and Gil Kane created is far weirder and more interesting than the shitty Maverick version written by Johns. So yeah, I'm absolutely game for a pansexual Hal, no problem at all.
    I'm so glad I'm not the only one that felt that way about Johns' version of Hal.

  2. #2732
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanlos View Post
    True! There is even a Morrison run with Liam Sharp! Before I get it I need to find out if the board's Hal-squad felt it was good or no.
    I loved it, but it gets progressively weirder as it goes on. If that brand of Morrison isn't to your liking, I'd stop after the conclusion of the Blackstars story. Season Two is just wild in terms of how big a swing both Morrison and Sharp are making.

  3. #2733
    Extraordinary Member HsssH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Honestly I barely even remember Billy Tan's art. While Tom Raney is... not Liefeld bad. That's more or less the biggest compliment I can give.
    I don't think that Raney's art was that bad, it just wasn't very suitable for GL story.

  4. #2734
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxStirner_91 View Post
    Yep, agreed. And the sooner the character is distanced from the other ****-for-brains EVS-aligned extreme of the fanbase, the better. I do not want to read thinly veiled US military industrial complex apologia in my GL stories. The sad part is the character John Broome and Gil Kane created is far weirder and more interesting than the shitty Maverick version written by Johns. So yeah, I'm absolutely game for a pansexual Hal, no problem at all.
    I should look for more Brooke & Kane.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    And I'd wager that Hal's right-wing American military-industrial complex apologia characterization is almost certainly behind a lot of people's dislike of the character.

    For better or worse, some of Hal Jordan's most well-known and seminal stories are O'Neil & Adams GL/GA stuff in which Hal is the kind of decent-hearted, but hopelessly consevative and out of touch white dude who would have consistently voted Republican until Trump, which was the exact opposite of the bohemian drifter stories that Broome & Kane were doing with Hal only issues prior.

    The further DC can move Hal Jordan away from that toxic right-wing bullshit, the better.
    Damn, now I want a Hal crossover with the 4th Doctor (Who).

    Quote Originally Posted by Refrax5 View Post
    I'm so glad I'm not the only one that felt that way about Johns' version of Hal.
    I weirdly came out if the Johns' run not liking Hal.

    I quietly think Guy got the best characterization during that era.

  5. #2735
    Astonishing Member Stanlos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    I loved it, but it gets progressively weirder as it goes on. If that brand of Morrison isn't to your liking, I'd stop after the conclusion of the Blackstars story. Season Two is just wild in terms of how big a swing both Morrison and Sharp are making.
    Oh okay so the season label was a built in part of what they were doing. That confused and I paused to find out more. So is there a season 1 that hasn't come out? Or is the one with no season marking the season 1?

  6. #2736
    Ultimate Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanlos View Post
    Oh okay so the season label was a built in part of what they were doing. That confused and I paused to find out more. So is there a season 1 that hasn't come out? Or is the one with no season marking the season 1?
    The Green Lantern Vols 1-2 and The Blackstars mini are "season 1"

  7. #2737
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I thought Morrison's run was okay but even as someone who has read most of their work I'm not much of a "Morrison" guy.

  8. #2738
    Astonishing Member Stanlos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    The Green Lantern Vols 1-2 and The Blackstars mini are "season 1"
    Ah ha! So five in total! Thank you so much!

  9. #2739
    Ultimate Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I thought Morrison's run was okay but even as someone who has read most of their work I'm not much of a "Morrison" guy.
    Same here. There are some big writers I certainly respect but I don't really consider myself that big of a fan of them. Morrison is one of them, Moore and Gaiman come to mind as well.

  10. #2740
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Somewhere along the lines, I became a Morrison guy despite initially rolling my eyes at how "overrated" I used to think they were (I probably have some really old posts here bashing them). Eventually it just clicked, and they are one of my favorite comic writers now, their DC work in particular.

    Their GL run gets typically self indulgent in the second season, so YMMV on how appealing that would be (even I have to be in a very specific mood when I read it). But Hal's characterization remains great throughout. Along with Clark and Bruce, they write my favorite Hal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Shaw View Post
    I weirdly came out if the Johns' run not liking Hal.

    I quietly think Guy got the best characterization during that era.
    Johns' run did its job when I first read it and made me a fan of the character. But it's been a while since I've read it, and I'm not sure that if I was first exposed to Johns' Hal now if I would be as taken with him. Johns' idea of what makes Hal a cool guy seems to unintentionally at times line up with the traits that make people think he's an outdated douche.

    Morrison, Waid and Darwyn Cooke are much better at the nuances of his character. But Johns struggles with nuance in general, I think his characters get more two dimensional as his writing career progresses.

  11. #2741
    Ultimate Member Gaius's Avatar
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    GL: TAS imo was the better, more refined, version of Johns "hot shot" take on Hal.

  12. #2742
    Extraordinary Member Mantis-Ray's Avatar
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    Ya know funnily enough I recently read the Johns run up to the end of the Sinestro War, didn't really found the issue with how Hal was portrayed aside from I guess him being a soldier

    Sure he's somewhat acerbic but ehhhh I didn't find him that much of a douche
    Last edited by Mantis-Ray; 11-29-2022 at 07:17 PM.

  13. #2743
    Ultimate Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mantis-Ray View Post
    Ya know I recently read the Johns run up to the end of the Sinestro War, didn't really found the issue with how Hal was portrayed aside from I guess him being a soldier

    Sure he's somewhat acerbic but ehhhh I didn't find him that much of a douche
    Imo - Johns really only wrote Hal as a douche in his "Justice League" book. It's still baffling to me that Johns did that - even if it was a younger Hal. And after the 5 year jump, he still wrote Hal as douchey - to the point where Wonder Woman wanted to punch his teeth in, leading to him taking the blame and resigning.

    As for Morrison, I really liked their characterization of Hal but as others have said the series was too self-indulgent, esoteric, and weird for larger audiences to connect to it. Which is a shame, because if the book had a more traditional narrative and reached more people, their take on Hal might've gotten more legs for other writers to pick up on it. (and also those new Guardians)

  14. #2744
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    Imo - Johns really only wrote Hal as a douche in his "Justice League" book. It's still baffling to me that Johns did that - even if it was a younger Hal. And after the 5 year jump, he still wrote Hal as douchey - to the point where Wonder Woman wanted to punch his teeth in, leading to him taking the blame and resigning.
    To be honest I remember everyone in the early part of that run being unlikable except for maybe Barry and Cyborg.

  15. #2745
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Shaw View Post
    I should look for more Brooke & Kane.



    Damn, now I want a Hal crossover with the 4th Doctor (Who).



    I weirdly came out if the Johns' run not liking Hal.

    I quietly think Guy got the best characterization during that era.
    Hal was one of my favorite heroes and I was over the moon when he came back in Rebirth, but the longer Johns' run went on, the less and less I liked or sympathized with Hal.

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