Jason Todd: Robin, Red Hood, Arkham Knight Appreciation 2022

[redmax99]

And the Subzero ripoff costume is back. Can DC make up their damn minds?

I mean we don't know what season it is maybe he changes outfits with the weather

[K7P5V]

And the Subzero ripoff costume is back. Can DC make up their damn minds?

Yeah, I don't really get it .

Better than the alternative, though. Remember the Morrison version... ?

[Jackalope89]

Better than the alternative, though. Remember the Morrison version... ?

Yeah... I get people really like a lot of Morrison's work, but Morrison REALLY messed up Jason's pre-Flashpoint character for the worse. And bad stories like Battle for the Cowl didn't help anyone either.

[Aahz]

BATMAN: LEGENDS OF GOTHAM #1

Written by ANDY DIGGLE
Art by KARL MOSTERT
Cover by CARMINE DI GIANDOMENICO
Variant cover by NATHAN SZERDY
1:25 variant cover by DAVID NAKAYAMA
$5.99 US | 48 pages | Variant $6.99 (card stock)
ON SALE 1/31/23

With Batman preoccupied, his deepest, darkest, most dangerous secrets are about to be auctioned off to the highest bidder. The guest list is strictly villains only, and the outlaw Red Hood fits the bill --putting him on a collision course with Batman's deniable black-ops team, the Outsiders! With Lazarus Island spawning wild-card superpowers across the globe, the stakes could not be higher. Jason Todd, Black Lightning, and Katana will have to put aside their differences to save Batman's legacy --and with it, the world. That's assuming they don't kill each other first!

I just realised that artist is the one from DCeased: Unkillables

[Dark_Tzitzimine]

After digging around, I found that in Gotham Knights, Jason gets an email from Isabel and keeps a picture of him and Roy on the Belfry.

[RedBird]

I loved seeing all the pictures scattered around the Belfry

The game is chock full of references and details for all the characters, in Jason's case, I genuinely did not expect the direction that the developers would go, but I'm pleasantly surprised. Some of those you can see in that email image.

Just to name a couple unexpected but wholesome stuff, minor spoilers but...
spoilers:

Emails from Clark, Roy, Isabel, a therapist (turns out GK Jason goes to therapy), messages from books stores, in fact there are a bunch of references to books and Jason enjoying reading, the devs even placed copies of Pride and Prejudice on the bookshelves in the Belfry. There's also plenty of indications in the game (again, like in that email above) that Jason is a good cook and really enjoys cooking. Just, lots of really wholesome stuff for Jason, opposite to the more dark vibe he gives off as Red Hood but that's why I'm glad to see they were able to implement these and still keep him pretty balanced and well rounded as a character.

end of spoilers

[RedBird]

Oh and I've got to give massive props to Stephen Oyoung, I'm absolutely loving his voice for Jason, it might be right up there with Jensen Ackles for me.

[Mantis-Ray]

After digging around, I found that in Gotham Knights, Jason gets an email from Isabel and keeps a picture of him and Roy on the Belfry.

I find it interesting despite how maligned the original Outlaws era is, it still gets plenty of references.

Goes to show ya people love interesting ideas even if the execution is fucked. I do at least appreciate that Roy and Kori have a non-Titans team in their resume.

[Zaresh]

A pity the game mechanics are so... ... ... meh. And that those designs are all pretty ugly, for my tastes, at least.
The lore in the game is absolutely delicious. And there're bits in their dynamics that change from character to character at several points of the game, as far as I've seen in some streams.

[Iclifton]

Is there really much of a difference characterization wise between Morrisons Jason and Winicks in Under the Red Hood?

[Jackalope89]

Is there really much of a difference characterization wise between Morrisons Jason and Winicks in Under the Red Hood?

Short answer? Yes.

Long answer; Morrison's Jason is a weird frankenstein-esque mashup of pre-crisis and post-crisis Jason (hence the random red hair), and Morrison threw out any sort of positive character trait of Jason's in favor of Dick.

Winick, while his Jason was still a criminal, Jason was various shades of grey rather than the "black and white" that Morrison went with. Jason did kill people, yes. But they were either scumbags to begin with, or broke the rules Jason set in place (like selling drugs to kids/around schools). And at the end of Under the Red Hood, a good part was about Jason wanting answers (not just the usual lip service) as to why the scumbag and mass murderer known as Joker was still alive, murdering innocents, grievously hurting others (Babs), etc.

And that's not even touching on Battle for the Cowl. Despite it being so well known, character wise, its absolutely awful for all involved.

[Zaresh]

Is there really much of a difference characterization wise between Morrisons Jason and Winicks in Under the Red Hood?

Yes, absolutely yes. I can get into the many, many differences they have in 10 hours or so (now starting my work shift). But yes. Morrison's Jason and Winnick's Jason are like night and day, with just some apparent similarities.

[Fergus]

Short answer? Yes.

Long answer; Morrison's Jason is a weird frankenstein-esque mashup of pre-crisis and post-crisis Jason (hence the random red hair), and Morrison threw out any sort of positive character trait of Jason's in favor of Dick.

Winick, while his Jason was still a criminal, Jason was various shades of grey rather than the "black and white" that Morrison went with. Jason did kill people, yes. But they were either scumbags to begin with, or broke the rules Jason set in place (like selling drugs to kids/around schools). And at the end of Under the Red Hood, a good part was about Jason wanting answers (not just the usual lip service) as to why the scumbag and mass murderer known as Joker was still alive, murdering innocents, grievously hurting others (Babs), etc.

And that's not even touching on Battle for the Cowl. Despite it being so well known, character wise, its absolutely awful for all involved.

Wasn't he taking over the drug businesses ? making him a drug dealer and a scumbag.
Didn't he get kids caught in the cross fire in his war? endangering them.
Isn't he letting Joker run around killing innocents, mass murdering and hurting others?

Seems to me Jason in UTRH was simply his lip servicing. All Morrison did was take away the contradictory lip service that Jason himself doesn't role model and put him in The OG Red Hood's canon accurate hood.

Morrison's Jason also continued the clearly defined niche that was set up for the character following his return. He was a Bat antagonist. A bat who operated under different set of rules from the batfam back from the dead to f*%k up their shit and put the fear of God in Gotham's criminal underground except the mass murderers of course.

[Aahz]

Wasn't he taking over the drug businesses ? making him a drug dealer and a scumbag.

He was basically forcing them to pay protection money to him instead of to Black Mask and to follow some rules.

Didn't he get kids caught in the cross fire in his war? endangering them.

He was basically forcing them to pay protection money to him instead of to Black Mask and to follow some rules. At least not in the books written by Winnick.

Isn't he letting Joker run around killing innocents, mass murdering and hurting others?

But that is mostly on Batman.

[Dark_Tzitzimine]

Wasn't he taking over the drug businesses ? making him a drug dealer and a scumbag.

That was his argument, that since crime couldn't be eradicated, the best next thing would be to control it. And he never denied the fact that made him a crimelord.

Didn't he get kids caught in the cross fire in his war? endangering them.

We never saw any kid getting endangered during URTH but he did say that anyone dealing to children was a dead man walking. And he made good of that promise by dynamiting the lab of two dealers that tried to keep dealing to kids.

Isn't he letting Joker run around killing innocents, mass murdering and hurting others?

One of the first things we saw him do in URTH was to track down Joker, beating him within an inch of his life, and then keeping him locked until he could arrange the final face-off with Bruce.

Seems to me Jason in UTRH was simply his lip servicing. All Morrison did was take away the contradictory lip service that Jason himself doesn't role model and put him in The OG Red Hood's canon accurate hood.

Morrison's version of Jason wasn't a character, it was a plot device that also served as a mouth piece for Morrison's meta commentary.

Morrison's Jason also continued the clearly defined niche that was set up for the character following his return. He was a Bat antagonist. A bat who operated under different set of rules from the batfam back from the dead to f*%k up their shit and put the fear of God in Gotham's criminal underground except the mass murderers of course.

Thing is, Winnick's Jason was supposed to be a one-time deal, since the point of the story was that Jason's approach was doomed from the start and would never actually fix the issues Gotham was going through, on the contrary, Jason's actions would only made things escalate as crimelords would try anything to retaliate. DC literally had no idea what to do with Jason after UTRH because they never expected people to actually like him.