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  1. #46
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    I've said before that I have no desire to read or follow a Superman that isn't Clark Kent/Kal-El but it's obvious that this is the direction WB and DC are going. I've essentially been told my thinking or feelings are the problem by TPTB and maybe they do need to move on from fans like me. I'll still be here when Clark comes back, but for now I'm out.

  2. #47
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    Yuuuuck. I mean, Batfleck and Cavill have been out for years, that's no surprise. But all this "Superman beyond Clark" stuff just pisses me off. The character is not and never has been broken or outdated. It's just that the people running these companies are so stunningly incompetent.

  3. #48
    Astonishing Member The Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    I've said before that I have no desire to read or follow a Superman that isn't Clark Kent/Kal-El but it's obvious that this is the direction WB and DC are going. I've essentially been told my thinking or feelings are the problem by TPTB and maybe they do need to move on from fans like me. I'll still be here when Clark comes back, but for now I'm out.
    Technically Coates/Abrams film is still Clark although a take on what it would be like if he was Black but I know what you mean. It'll take a while but I'm sure he'll eventually be on the big screen again. It could take years for that though depending on the new DCEU. Personally, I'm expecting the DCEU to do even worse. WW84 pretty much tanked all goodwill from the first WW movie, Aquaman had basically no pop culture impact and the sequel might not even release in China this time (first one made bank there), and their recent films (TSS, Birds of Prey, Shazam) all did just ok or straight up flopped. I think the odds of a full reboot within the next ten years is likely but damn it'll be a slog. Matt Reeves was smart when he refused to let his Batman be part of the mess that is the DCEU

  4. #49
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Kid View Post
    Technically Coates/Abrams film is still Clark although a take on what it would be like if he was Black but I know what you mean. It'll take a while but I'm sure he'll eventually be on the big screen again. It could take years for that though depending on the new DCEU. Personally, I'm expecting the DCEU to do even worse. WW84 pretty much tanked all goodwill from the first WW movie, Aquaman had basically no pop culture impact and the sequel might not even release in China this time (first one made bank there), and their recent films (TSS, Birds of Prey, Shazam) all did just ok or straight up flopped. I think the odds of a full reboot within the next ten years is likely but damn it'll be a slog. Matt Reeves was smart when he refused to let his Batman be part of the mess that is the DCEU

    You know there is a superpets movie with superman in it as support to krypto
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  5. #50
    Invincible Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    I very much doubt he has the power to force an IP (one he has nothing to do with) to do anything. Remember, he originally wanted (and even took a picture to drive the point home) Cavill to still be Superman when they fought. Cavill is also represented by The Rock's agent (and ex wife), yet that didn't make any dent in WB kicking him out. Johnson likely only has pull on how he as Adam look (similar to Hobs), but nothing else, no.
    I agree as of right now he doesn’t have the clout. If Black Adam is a blockbuster hit however… things could change.
    Pretty much. I'm pretty sure either black Clark or Val are Earth-2 Superman. Contractually WB needs to produce a Superman movie every few years. But the Superman they clearly want needs a bit more time to cook, so they're baking him in the background and putting black Clark and Val as appetizers.
    Do they still have to do that? Thought after MoS they owned Superman with zero obligations to the Siegel and Shuster families.
    I think Doomsday is dumb, but if you're going to start a story where everyone watching needs to quickly and clearly get that Clark is dead then you use the guy that literally everyone on Earth knows kills him. Lets you do away with Doomsday as a thing right from the jump too.
    I get the logic of it, I just would rather give that feat to Brainiac, give Jon a personal reason to hate so maybe you can have Jon face him as well done the line.
    Easily one of the dumbest mistakes I've seen. It CLEARLY should've been Jimmy.
    Glad someone agrees with me. Jimmy is Clark’s Pal! Should’ve been him but I guess I should just be happy it wasn’t Batman like Taylor wanted.
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  6. #51
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by titansupes View Post
    Yuuuuck. I mean, Batfleck and Cavill have been out for years, that's no surprise. But all this "Superman beyond Clark" stuff just pisses me off. The character is not and never has been broken or outdated. It's just that the people running these companies are so stunningly incompetent.
    I've been a Superman fan for over 30 years. I have every Superman comic book that's been published monthly since 1985. IMO, the best era of the character was from the reboot up through his death and return. After that, it's just been small pockets of good stories mixed in with a lot of mediocre and at times terrible runs. I've given up on everything at DC except Action Comics currently.

    However, I acknowledge fully that from the reboot up to his death & return, while the stories were solid and I still love them to this day, there's nothing there that's really adaptable to film outside the death arc, which is why DC and WB keep going to that well over and over again. It's insane to think that after 8 feature films depicting Superman, Brainiac has made ZERO appearances. But we've seen Lex, Zod, and Doomsday over and over and over again.

    If DC can't produce good, adaptable stories featuring Clark Kent as Superman for WB to utilize, which they clearly haven't, then WB is going to keep going down the reboot/origin/Lex/Zod/Deaths wells because that's all they know because that's all DC has for them. Think about what's been adapted from Clark's history to big screen versus what Marvel has done with their properties & stories. It's not comparable despite Superman having EIGHTY years of stories!

    Again, I understand I'm part of the problem and that for DC to move into a new era they probably need to move on from fans like me. I just don't think they'll do Jon or Kara more justice than they've done Clark. Clark's not the problem.

  7. #52
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Kid View Post
    Technically Coates/Abrams film is still Clark although a take on what it would be like if he was Black but I know what you mean. It'll take a while but I'm sure he'll eventually be on the big screen again. It could take years for that though depending on the new DCEU. Personally, I'm expecting the DCEU to do even worse. WW84 pretty much tanked all goodwill from the first WW movie, Aquaman had basically no pop culture impact and the sequel might not even release in China this time (first one made bank there), and their recent films (TSS, Birds of Prey, Shazam) all did just ok or straight up flopped. I think the odds of a full reboot within the next ten years is likely but damn it'll be a slog. Matt Reeves was smart when he refused to let his Batman be part of the mess that is the DCEU
    I have no problem with Clark being black, white, Asian, Hispanic, etc. provided the essence and history of what makes the character great for me remains in place. Sent from a dying planet, raised in Smallville, moves to Metropolis, becomes Superman. My understanding of the Abrams/Coates film is that while the character will be Clark in name, it's going to take great liberties with the source material.

    Like I said, I'll just move on for now. If Clark comes back, I'll go back too. I have too much love and investment with the character not to. But I refuse to allow WB to tell me Clark Kent is the problem.

  8. #53
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    Do they still have to do that? Thought after MoS they owned Superman with zero obligations to the Siegel and Shuster families.
    I don't know if it was ever a contract but I know that at one time a judge ruled that WB had to actively have a live action Superman film or a film featuring Superman in development to retain the film rights. Can't say for sure if this is still the case since MoS we've essentially had this occur.

  9. #54
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I agree as of right now he doesn’t have the clout. If Black Adam is a blockbuster hit however… things could change.
    Not even RDJ could tell Marvel what to do with anyone outside of Iron Man, and he's bigger than Adam ever will be. That's just not how this stuff works at this level unless they are directly attached to the IP.

    Do they still have to do that? Thought after MoS they owned Superman with zero obligations to the Siegel and Shuster families.
    As far as I understand, that's still in play especially with the copyright laws coming into question in a few years.

    I get the logic of it, I just would rather give that feat to Brainiac, give Jon a personal reason to hate so maybe you can have Jon face him as well done the line.
    I think they should just let Kara have Brainiac straight up. That seems to be the idea, and they could always change it so that Brainiac blew up Krypton in the end.

    They actually could use the idea from Future State where since Kara is more powerful and full blood, she's more global and cosmic like Captain Marvel, and Jon can only just about handle a city when he's Superman. That way Kara wouldn't even have to give her life in the end, but rather just graduate to Superwoman.

    Maybe even use PKJ's current run for her down the line? Though, likely without The Authority.

    Glad someone agrees with me. Jimmy is Clark’s Pal! Should’ve been him but I guess I should just be happy it wasn’t Batman like Taylor wanted.
    Taylor is just full of basic bitch ideas, huh?
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!" - The Digger

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  10. #55
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Best thing to happen to Superman IMHO

    I want him rebooted as the good natured All Star Superman, the Superman that inspires, I would even love it if they make his movies stand alone (which I know will never happen).

    Why can't we have our cake and eat it to, allow Coates to do his thing and give us a classic Supes too; I mean we all witnessed Spider-Verse the public can and will accept multiple versions of a character.

  11. #56
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    Best thing to happen to Superman IMHO

    I want him rebooted as the good natured All Star Superman, the Superman that inspires, I would even love it if they make his movies stand alone (which I know will never happen).

    Why can't we have our cake and eat it to, allow Coates to do his thing and give us a classic Supes too; I mean we all witnessed Spider-Verse the public can and will accept multiple versions of a character.
    The difference is that Sony and Marvel has much more good will built with fans and audiences than WB/DC does with Superman.

    Also, WB doesn't understand anything about Superman outside of his origin and that he dies, which is why they keep repeating those stories over and over and over again.

  12. #57
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Honestly, I have become so indifferent towards DC over the last 2 years that this news doesn't really bother me as much as it would have even 10 years ago. Everything they're publishing right now is so Batman-centric and boring that honestly if they want to let Superman fade away into limbo, maybe it's for the best.

    Conversely, I have gotten knee-deep into Marvel lately, more than I have in my 5 decades of collecting comic books. So as long as they keep rolling, DC can go belly up for all I care.

  13. #58
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    The difference is that Sony and Marvel has much more good will built with fans and audiences than WB/DC does with Superman.

    Also, WB doesn't understand anything about Superman outside of his origin and that he dies, which is why they keep repeating those stories over and over and over again.
    My dude, you're preaching to the choir.

    WB squandered all good with in film and more recently comics.

    I mean why can they not make a decent Superman film or a decent film!

  14. #59
    Astonishing Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    My dude, you're preaching to the choir.

    WB squandered all good with in film and more recently comics.

    I mean why can they not make a decent Superman film or a decent film!
    I go back to my second post in this thread.

    The issue is, DC doesn't produce good Superman comic books anymore. Really they haven't in many, MANY years outside of some sporadic arcs and Elseworlds here and there.

    So because DC can't produce good IPs for WB to utilize in a Superman film, WB keeps rehashing the same stories and characters. Then when those films fail, they blame the character instead of how they're using the character or how poorly WB is handling the character.

    Really DC/WB doesn't really understand anything outside of Batman, and even then they manage to screw him up royally from time-to-time. I've just lost all faith in TPTB at DC/WB in the handling of these characters.

  15. #60
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    I go back to my second post in this thread.

    The issue is, DC doesn't produce good Superman comic books anymore. Really they haven't in many, MANY years outside of some sporadic arcs and Elseworlds here and there.

    So because DC can't produce good IPs for WB to utilize in a Superman film, WB keeps rehashing the same stories and characters. Then when those films fail, they blame the character instead of how they're using the character or how poorly WB is handling the character.

    Really DC/WB doesn't really understand anything outside of Batman, and even then they manage to screw him up royally from time-to-time. I've just lost all faith in TPTB at DC/WB in the handling of these characters.
    Hence the constant demand of an evillllll superman

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