Stephanie Brown: Spoiler, Robin, Batgirl Appreciation 2022

[NOCTPHOENIX]

Enh, it’ll come back around again. These things always do. Once a fictional relationship hits a certain critical mass with fans and becomes an OTP in the eyes of enough people, there will always be future writers ready to go back to it. And this isn’t one of those rare Nightwing/Starfire vs. Nightwing/Oracle situations where there are roughly equal amounts of fans of each pairing. No one particularly cares about Bernard (or Ariana, or Tam Fox, or…). In the long run, Steph will always win that battle.

Well Twitter, tumblr and tiktok seem to be fawning over Bernard for some reason https://twitter.com/dominomasc

Same with tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/tag/bernarddowd and tumblr: https://www.tumblr.com/tagged/timber?sort=top, https://www.tumblr.com/tagged/bernard%20dowd?sort=top (like that tag as 1k followers)

But then again not sure how many of these fans actually READ.buy comics or really care about these characters outside of shipping

And there is a push for him in stuff like WFA, Gotham Knights and Titans

[WebLurker]

Enh, it’ll come back around again. These things always do. Once a fictional relationship hits a certain critical mass with fans and becomes an OTP in the eyes of enough people, there will always be future writers ready to go back to it. And this isn’t one of those rare Nightwing/Starfire vs. Nightwing/Oracle situations where there are roughly equal amounts of fans of each pairing. No one particularly cares about Bernard (or Ariana, or Tam Fox, or…). In the long run, Steph will always win that battle.

I think that is the question, though; has Tim/Steph reached "critical mass"? It might be the longest-established romance for Tim, but it's not exactly represented much outside his comics (unlike how Catwoman is "the one" for Batman and has been retold in quite a few movies and TV shows and was even the subject of a miniseries). Heck, Tim/Bernard is getting adapted into outside media and we're still waiting for Tim/Steph to do the same (not counting any Easter eggs).

(Purely anecdotal, but, when poking around online on the subject, I've seen plenty of Tim/Bernard fans and/or users expressing the opinion that they're glad Steph now has the space to be more than just Tim's love interest. Obviously, there's no way to know how many are buying or not buying and all that, but Spider-Man and Mary Jane they ain't.)

[NOCTPHOENIX]

I think that is the question, though; has Tim/Steph reached "critical mass"? It might be the longest-established romance for Tim, but it's not exactly represented much outside his comics (unlike how Catwoman is "the one" for Batman and has been retold in quite a few movies and TV shows and was even the subject of a miniseries). Heck, Tim/Bernard is getting adapted into outside media and we're still waiting for Tim/Steph to do the same (not counting any Easter eggs).

(Purely anecdotal, but, when poking around online on the subject, I've seen plenty of Tim/Bernard fans and/or users expressing the opinion that they're glad Steph now has the space to be more than just Tim's love interest. Obviously, there's no way to know how many are buying or not buying and all that, but Spider-Man and Mary Jane they ain't.)

Most of these "fans" don't care about Stephanie and just want her out of the way and are pretending to care. And she already WAS that in the original Robin series. There was a reason she got brought back after being "killed" and made Batgirl where she did that as well.

As to your first note well Olicity was represented to a wider audience more with Arrow and how popular that was more than Green Arrow and Black Canary yet they are still the pairing for both.

[ChangingStation]

The most prolific adaption of Bernard is Titans, (most of the others tend to amount to cameos or mentions,) and it's worth noting that the character has been changed substantially (while similar things happened to say, Selina, changing a supervillain is not quite the same thing). I can't talk for the quality though.

[WebLurker]

Most of these "fans" don't care about Stephanie and just want her out of the way and are pretending to care.

How do we know that they're just saying that and that they just happen to like the character differently? Heck, I like Steph and am pretty indifferent to her being Tim's girlfriend.

And she already WAS that in the original Robin series.

Yeah, no one's denying that.

There was a reason she got brought back after being "killed" and made Batgirl where she did that as well.

Missed out on the series and am waiting for reprints, but it was my understanding that she and Tim were on the outs in her solo (recall a bit that she became Batgirl after her told her that she needed to quit being a superhero and there was a running gag of her having a bit of a crush on someone else).

As to your first note well Olicity was represented to a wider audience more with Arrow and how popular that was more than Green Arrow and Black Canary yet they are still the pairing for both.

Yeah, I get it, that's an example of something that didn't go beyond its own bubble, but going "but Olicity..." is not a good argument; Batman, above all else, is a huge example of how the adaptations overwrite the source material, as Mr. Freeze, Harley Quinn, and Batgirl can attest to (or how much of Superman's bedrock did not come from the original comics or how the rules of the Spider-Man symbiote suit were written by the '90s cartoon). Just because one change didn't last doesn't mean that other changes will also disappear as quickly. (Also, it's a good bet that Arrow/Canary are a lot more iconic than Tim/Steph, so no wonder it's remained resistant to change.)

I don't see Tim/Bernard making the jump to the screen first as proof that they're going to be the OPT forever with Steph playing Black Cat to Tim's Spider-Man, if that makes any sense (or that Bernard is going to inherently be a Carlie Cooper-type, either). At best, it's just a brick in the wall of the possibility of Bernard replacing Steph "forever"; a step that would lead to that possible outcome, not confirmation of the outcome itself.

My thesis is that I'm skeptical that Tim/Steph have reached the critical mass of a ship like Superman/Lois Lane or Spider-Man/Mary Jane. If so, it would be possible that Bernard could get locked in place as Tim's default love interest and Steph remained defined as a separate character in the Bat-Family. Not saying that that will happen (the odds of it not are at least equal to), but I do find it interesting that DC is trying to make synergy with Bernard, esp. since it seems to have been the writer's idea rather than a corporate decision. Point is, putting him in the show sure makes it look like they want him to be a bigger deal than just a temporary twist and, since his assigned role is love interest primarily (unlike how Steph can also be her own lead character), logic dictates that that is the role he will remain in. (Long story short, why else put him in the show if he's not going to be around longer term?)

Does that make any sense?

[Jackalope89]

Will Titans even get another season with so many shows on HBOMAX getting canned?

[ComicNoobie]

So with Christmas coming up I had a question? How do you think Stephanie spends her holiday and what presents do you think she would like most? I can already think of one, waffles! Good ole waffles! When was the last time Steph had waffles?

[sunofdarkchild]

It's interesting how Steph's love for waffles became such a big deal when she has never been shown eating waffles because she likes them and wants to eat them. The waffles were always Crystal's thing that Steph just went along with. She never said she disliked them, but she always seemed indifferent to them. It was never more than the food she ate because her mother insisted on making it every morning.

[millernumber1]

So with Christmas coming up I had a question? How do you think Stephanie spends her holiday and what presents do you think she would like most? I can already think of one, waffles! Good ole waffles! When was the last time Steph had waffles?

Well, I think Steph likes spending Christmas with those she loves - this year, obviously, it's Cass and Babs! I think she would love some books, a new car that she would name something NOT Bondo (never forget Bondo!), and maybe some new weapons or armor.

It's interesting how Steph's love for waffles became such a big deal when she has never been shown eating waffles because she likes them and wants to eat them. The waffles were always Crystal's thing that Steph just went along with. She never said she disliked them, but she always seemed indifferent to them. It was never more than the food she ate because her mother insisted on making it every morning.

Well, we do start seeing her eating waffles near the end of her series as Batgirl, I think. I'll have to check. I think the thing was that it wasn't necessarily noted as her favorite food, but it was a prominantly named food in a beloved storyline that was explicitly just for Steph, as opposed to a much more obscure, never collected story in Tim's solo series where Steph was a supporting character.

[sunofdarkchild]

Well, I think Steph likes spending Christmas with those she loves - this year, obviously, it's Cass and Babs! I think she would love some books, a new car that she would name something NOT Bondo (never forget Bondo!), and maybe some new weapons or armor.



Well, we do start seeing her eating waffles near the end of her series as Batgirl, I think. I'll have to check. I think the thing was that it wasn't necessarily noted as her favorite food, but it was a prominantly named food in a beloved storyline that was explicitly just for Steph, as opposed to a much more obscure, never collected story in Tim's solo series where Steph was a supporting character.

The waffles start in the first issue of her series. Her mother wakes her up holding a plate, Steph notes that the waffles "right in my face," and then thinks of how waffles are her mom's new way of trying to bond with her. The waffles show up at the end of the first issue when Babs shows up in Steph's house and tells her to have some waffles. They're a fixture of the Crystal Brown scenes.

[ComicNoobie]

It's interesting how Steph's love for waffles became such a big deal when she has never been shown eating waffles because she likes them and wants to eat them. The waffles were always Crystal's thing that Steph just went along with. She never said she disliked them, but she always seemed indifferent to them. It was never more than the food she ate because her mother insisted on making it every morning.

Waffles are a important part of Stephanie Brown's overall history. Especially her Batgirl run, even if they are not stated to be her favorite. I'm waiting for a issue where she shares some waffles with Babs and Cass.

Well, I think Steph likes spending Christmas with those she loves - this year, obviously, it's Cass and Babs! I think she would love some books, a new car that she would name something NOT Bondo (never forget Bondo!), and maybe some new weapons or armor.

Yes! A new car NOT Bondo! That would be perfect. Even better if the car's radio station was stuck on one song that played over and over again to torture whatever criminal the Batgirls decide to capture. Also some new Batgirl/Spoiler-ish armor would be awesome. I would love a Christmas issue for the Batgirls to see them celebrate the holdiays. And Christmas waffles!

[millernumber1]

The waffles start in the first issue of her series. Her mother wakes her up holding a plate, Steph notes that the waffles "right in my face," and then thinks of how waffles are her mom's new way of trying to bond with her. The waffles show up at the end of the first issue when Babs shows up in Steph's house and tells her to have some waffles. They're a fixture of the Crystal Brown scenes.

Yes, and there's several more scenes where Crystal's present where Steph is clearly eating waffles for breakfast. However, in issue #24, as Steph meets Babs on the roof in the final scene, it looks like she's eating something before Babs hands her a coffee, and it might be a waffle. Not SUPER clear, but possible! Also in issue #7, it looks like Steph is sharing waffles with Damian in the cave as Babs and Dick argue below them. So I think it rubbed off on her a bit from Crystal.

[signalman112]

AW, Heart shape waffle.

StephanieWaffle.jpg

[millernumber1]

AW, Heart shape waffle.

StephanieWaffle.jpg

That is a great pic! I love Steph's expression a lot! Do you know who the artist is?

[Frontier]

AW, Heart shape waffle.

StephanieWaffle.jpg

This is adorable .