Cassandra Cain: Orphan, Black Bat, Batgirl Appreciation 2022

[The Cool Thatguy]

She's still very young in this version. Furthermore, just because she didn't renounce violence doesn't mean she wants to maim people.

She certainly wasn't a child, though.

And again, part of what made her change was her ability to read body language and see the trauma she inflicted. Hurting people, even severely, logically wouldn't be a new thing for her.

[Blight]

So question. This week's Detective Comics mentions Helena's last stand at the end of No Man's Land. So Cass's old origin is back it seems. So how does this "everything is canon" thing work?

[Lal]

So question. This week's Detective Comics mentions Helena's last stand at the end of No Man's Land. So Cass's old origin is back it seems. So how does this "everything is canon" thing work?

It's more or less that the creators can pick and chose what characters remember from their previous history. Or if there are contradicting histories - which is the relevant one for the story.

[Bruce Wayne]

So basically Morrison's hypertime.

[Aahz]

So how does this "everything is canon" thing work?

I doesn't work.

[LordUltimus]

Gonna do some self-promotion and post my ongoing Cass fic (available on multiple platforms) here. No spoilers on the premise:

https://forums.spacebattles.com/thre...batman.982906/

https://forums.sufficientvelocity.co...-batman.98935/

https://archiveofourown.org/works/36...pters/89806009

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/1402169...-0-gaNycGzNCiU

[Blight]

Weird Cass variation this week in Tec with the lack of bat symbol.

[ohfellow]

Weird Cass variation this week in Tec with the lack of bat symbol.

Yes, that's strikes me as certainly a mistake rather than a choice.

At least she has something useful to say. Steph only complains about the smell.

[Agent Z]

edited post.

[John Venus]

So question. This week's Detective Comics mentions Helena's last stand at the end of No Man's Land. So Cass's old origin is back it seems. So how does this "everything is canon" thing work?

I'm assuming the characters are just aware of both their pre-Nu52 history as well as their Nu52 and Rebirth history. They know their histories have been rewritten but still remember their old history like it was a past life.

[Frontier]

Maybe we can finally excise Orphan from continuity...

[Blight]

I'm assuming the characters are just aware of both their pre-Nu52 history as well as their Nu52 and Rebirth history. They know their histories have been rewritten but still remember their old history like it was a past life.

But that's the thing when it comes to Cass/Steph. The latter alludes to it in Robins, but we barely get any mention of the two in Batgirls. I'd think the topic of conversation would be a fascinating one between all three. Address the elephant in the room. Cass/Steph be all why did life hate us so in trying to set away from each other and this identity?

[Blight]

Maybe we can finally excise Orphan from continuity...

I wish it was buried and put six feet under, yet it just keeps coming back in unexpected ways. You'd think of all the identities Black Bat or Kasumi would be the ones that stick more but nope Orphan somehow is the one that sticks just because it lumps Cass away from being a bat and Batgirl.

[Lal]

But that's the thing when it comes to Cass/Steph. The latter alludes to it in Robins, but we barely get any mention of the two in Batgirls. I'd think the topic of conversation would be a fascinating one between all three. Address the elephant in the room. Cass/Steph be all why did life hate us so in trying to set away from each other and this identity?

In the case of contradicting histories, I don't think they remember everything about both timelines. Nightwing, for example, remembers being a police officer (and having a low degree, which I think was never canon?) but Bludhaven was never bombed and Blockbuster was never killed. So it's more of a pick and choose what you take from their pre-52 histories.

They do remember being Batgirls, but returning their previous full pre-52 histories could be a bit tricky, as Steph was college-age and Cass was about Jason's age. It would probably age them considerably and make Babs mentoring them redundant. I'm also not sure it would be in their best interest, as it seems that DC wants them to be the younger and less experienced Batgirls so it would be a fresh start. The Batgirls seem to be intended for younger audiences and a starting point for new readers, so I assume that's the reason they were age down.

[Frontier]

I wish it was buried and put six feet under, yet it just keeps coming back in unexpected ways. You'd think of all the identities Black Bat or Kasumi would be the ones that stick more but nope Orphan somehow is the one that sticks just because it lumps Cass away from being a bat and Batgirl.

Just really seems like a lack of self-awareness regarding the codename in favor or "well, we need something to call Cass if she's not Batgirl, so let's use that."