Thor Odinson, God of Thunder Appreciation 2022

[adey040812]

Ewing is usually an excellent writer, but IMO he wouldn't be a good Thor writer.

He subscribes to the whole 'Gods are stories' angle, which is interesting in novels, but doesn't work great in a world where Gods are flesh and blood people.

I know he’s a good writer, but his portrayal of Thor in IH just seemed a bit lacking, that’s all.

[kilderkin]

The thing is, Arron's Jane-as-Thor run is a pretty satisfying and compelling... provided you don't care too much about Thor, Odin at al. It doesn't do Thor and Odin justice at all, just throws them under a bus to make Jane more necessary, but lots of people didn't seem to care.

I had my problems with his run, but Jane was the thing he wrote best in it all in my opinion

I detest what he did with Thor and Odin, and some of the human based politics I thought didn't fit at all

But Jane on a superhero power trip had it's fun points

[Panic]

I had my problems with his run, but Jane was the thing he wrote best in it all in my opinion

I detest what he did with Thor and Odin, and some of the human based politics I thought didn't fit at all

But Jane on a superhero power trip had it's fun points

Part of that was that he seemed to have no problem with putting himself in her shoes, so to speak, and playing her as a wish-fulfilment hero, whilst Thor... he plainly didn't want to write him as someone to be looked up to. Though a little of that was visible in the God Butcher arc, mostly it seemed to hit right after that. I remember dropping out of the Malekith arc early because (a) I didn't like the art, but mainly (b) his Thor was incredibly unengaging and difficult to relate to. Really, when a writer can't make a hero someone who the reader doesn't want to be, doesn't sympathise with, then it's because the writer doesn't want to (imo). I wonder if Aaron hadn't read much Thor before the God Butcher arc, and when he did he just didn't like him?

[Frontier]

Part of that was that he seemed to have no problem with putting himself in her shoes, so to speak, and playing her as a wish-fulfilment hero, whilst Thor... he plainly didn't want to write him as someone to be looked up to. Though a little of that was visible in the God Butcher arc, mostly it seemed to hit right after that. I remember dropping out of the Malekith arc early because (a) I didn't like the art, but mainly (b) his Thor was incredibly unengaging and difficult to relate to. Really, when a writer can't make a hero someone who the reader doesn't want to be, doesn't sympathise with, then it's because the writer doesn't want to (imo). I wonder if Aaron hadn't read much Thor before the God Butcher arc, and when he did he just didn't like him?

At least in an "idealized" kind of way like he did with Jane, since Thor was meant to be more vulnerable, flawed, and struggling because he was a god character and that's the only kind of god character Aaron can relate too.

[Felipe Silveira]

Did Thor sales tank when Jane stopped being the focus?

No, sales have improved. In Jane Foster's day sales were supported by re-relauchs.

[Mantis-Ray]

The thing is, Arron's Jane-as-Thor run is a pretty satisfying and compelling... provided you don't care too much about Thor, Odin at al. It doesn't do Thor and Odin justice at all, just throws them under a bus to make Jane more necessary, but lots of people didn't seem to care.

Well that was the point.

Jane's run was supported by a mass influx of new readers so it was being read by a lot of people who largely didn't care that much over what happened to Thor and Odin.

To them Jane was the only one that mattered.

[kilderkin]

No, sales have improved. In Jane Foster's day sales were supported by re-relauchs.

Oh yeah, after the initial run it falters, but events affected it and it was bumped by multiple relaunches, it did sell well, but it wasn't the all winning book some propose

Perch has a good analysis of this, his channel may not be for everyone but his sales analysis videos are sound imo

[kilderkin]

Well that was the point.

Jane's run was supported by a mass influx of new readers so it was being read by a lot of people who largely didn't care that much over what happened to Thor and Odin.

To them Jane was the only one that mattered.

Which is fair enough

To me that's a good thing in getting new readers

My only issue was how badly Thor was written in so much as a depressed and ineffective character for so long

I have no time for that at wll

[Minerboh]

No, sales have improved. In Jane Foster's day sales were supported by re-relauchs.

Perch explains it in full detail here...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VEGWnwQC1w

[Mantis-Ray]

Which is fair enough

To me that's a good thing in getting new readers

My only issue was how badly Thor was written in so much as a depressed and ineffective character for so long

I have no time for that at wll

I'm reminded of a great conversation with a person who is a fan of Jane's run. We both agree that what the series needed was for Thor himself to get his own separate ongoing. If Thor had gotten his own ongoing book concurrent to Jane's run where he would actually develop as a character and regain his groove that would have fixed a lot of issues with the run.

Its pretty apparent that Aaron was most likely very protective of Jane. He didn't want to risk anyone stealing her thunder (heh) which is probably also why Beta Ray Bill only showed up in the Unworthy Thor mini. Like Jane's whole thing as "Thor" prolly would feel less of a big deal when you acknowledge there's another longstanding Thor out there with his own hammer.

Which is a shame Bill never appeared but then again I don't trust Aaron wouldn't have derailed him especially since unlike Jan, Bill largely has a positive relationship with the Gods especially Odin, who basically gave Bill his hammer and the ability to turn back into his normal state out of gratitude for rescuing his son.

[Frontier]

I'm reminded of a great conversation with a person who is a fan of Jane's run. We both agree that what the series needed was for Thor himself to get his own separate ongoing. If Thor had gotten his own ongoing book concurrent to Jane's run where he would actually develop as a character and regain his groove that would have fixed a lot of issues with the run.

Its pretty apparent that Aaron was most likely very protective of Jane. He didn't want to risk anyone stealing her thunder (heh) which is probably also why Beta Ray Bill only showed up in the Unworthy Thor mini. Like Jane's whole thing as "Thor" prolly would feel less of a big deal when you acknowledge there's another longstanding Thor out there with his own hammer.

Which is a shame Bill never appeared but then again I don't trust Aaron wouldn't have derailed him especially since unlike Jan, Bill largely has a positive relationship with the Gods especially Odin, who basically gave Bill his hammer and the ability to turn back into his normal state out of gratitude for rescuing his son.

I think the problem was Thor never really got his groove back until, like, the very end of the run. Even when he started using his name again.

[K7P5V]

I'm reminded of a great conversation with a person who is a fan of Jane's run. We both agree that what the series needed was for Thor himself to get his own separate ongoing. If Thor had gotten his own ongoing book concurrent to Jane's run where he would actually develop as a character and regain his groove that would have fixed a lot of issues with the run.

Its pretty apparent that Aaron was most likely very protective of Jane. He didn't want to risk anyone stealing her thunder (heh) which is probably also why Beta Ray Bill only showed up in the Unworthy Thor mini. Like Jane's whole thing as "Thor" prolly would feel less of a big deal when you acknowledge there's another longstanding Thor out there with his own hammer.

Which is a shame Bill never appeared but then again I don't trust Aaron wouldn't have derailed him especially since unlike Jan, Bill largely has a positive relationship with the Gods especially Odin, who basically gave Bill his hammer and the ability to turn back into his normal state out of gratitude for rescuing his son.

In agreement with you about Beta Ray Bill! Truly a heartwarming moment, not a dry eye in the house...

[The Cool Thatguy]

I think the problem was Thor never really got his groove back until, like, the very end of the run. Even when he started using his name again.

The problem was that Aaron, like Bendis on DD, had no idea how to end his run.

Among other things...

[Mantis-Ray]

Bill provides a very interesting counterpart to Gorr and Jane cause he is a mortal who managed to gain the powers of other Gods.

Some key differences though

His world was ravaged by demons and the devil Surtur. He was empowered by Odin. And interestingly while he doesn't worship Gods cause he finds the idea of worship "obscene" he takes a more existentialist approach to it, "If there is nothing but what we make in this world, brothers... let us make good."

He doesn't care that Gods suck, what matters is doing good and that is what defines him from someone like Gorr who just basks in his misery like a jerk

[kilderkin]

The points about a different ongoing are sound, I always felt like Aaron was writing journey into mystery and not a Thor book really.

Which imo are not exactly the same thing.

I'm also glad he didn't use bill, bill is for me a very difficult character to get right and one easy to get wrong.

Given how he wrote Thor and Odin I know which imo it would have been.

I also think Thor didn't get a strong enough redemption do to speak, Aaron even kept having a few jokes about Thor and his hammer issues in avengers post his Thor run.