It's time we acknowledge the true villains of the Krakoan era

[Saithor]

I think this thread is operating from a bit of a logical fallacy in that in the Krakoan era, the X-Line really aren't "superhero" books any more with "heroes" and "villains."

We're in speculative fiction territory now and these are stories of varying levels of machinations on the political, sci-fi/fantasy, philosophical, ethical, and even "religious" realms.

There are no simple "good guys" or "bad guys" anymore.

See that I don’t mind. My critiscism are execution based. It’s clear that Krakoa is not meant to be straight cut heroes but my critiscism is less over that and more from a continuity/characterization standpoint and also worldbuilding.

[Devaishwarya]

I think this just about sums up the divide in the X-Men fandom regarding the current era in some ways.

Yupp. Pretty much.

[RamaBird]

I'm in between. I would've like to have seen low level villains welcomed and given a new chance (thinking of the Hellions). Some villains are too far gone though, and they've been given new chances even though they are still obviously doing bad things (Sinister).

[Saithor]

I'm in between. I would've like to have seen low level villains welcomed and given a new chance (thinking of the Hellions). Some villains are too far gone though, and they've been given new chances even though they are still obviously doing bad things (Sinister).

I always took Sinister’s presence as yet another hint from Hickman that we shouldn’t trust the Quiet Council as a governing body at all, outside of the inherent autocratic nature of a group of self-appointed leaders where the only way to join is for them to vote you in and there’s no attempts at anti-corruption law. When you put the unrepentant Nazi in a group it’s usually a sign something is fucked up.

Actually on the Nazi Sinister bit, I did do some digging with the help of some others, and Erik definitely encountered Sinister in Asuchwitz, he knows him as a Nazi doctor he called Nosferatu but doesn’t know that was Sinister. Greycrow/Scalphunter though definitely knows because he was Sinister’s bodyguard at the time. I’m really hoping Gillen uses that.

[Astroman]

See that I don’t mind. My critiscism are execution based. It’s clear that Krakoa is not meant to be straight cut heroes but my critiscism is less over that and more from a continuity/characterization standpoint and also worldbuilding.

Fair enough. And Hickman definitely chose an execution that would be challenging on many levels. It was never going to work for *everyone's* tastes.

[Rev9]

I always took Sinister’s presence as yet another hint from Hickman that we shouldn’t trust the Quiet Council as a governing body at all, outside of the inherent autocratic nature of a group of self-appointed leaders where the only way to join is for them to vote you in and there’s no attempts at anti-corruption law. When you put the unrepentant Nazi in a group it’s usually a sign something is fucked up.

Actually on the Nazi Sinister bit, I did do some digging with the help of some others, and Erik definitely encountered Sinister in Asuchwitz, he knows him as a Nazi doctor he called Nosferatu but doesn’t know that was Sinister. Greycrow/Scalphunter though definitely knows because he was Sinister’s bodyguard at the time. I’m really hoping Gillen uses that.

Incredibly while the woman who made sure Krakoa is a reality is exiled and is now persona non-grata..the guy she had serious misgivings about upon Xavier recruiting him is still on the QC despite it being well documented that his treachery already once dealt a near death blow to mutantdom.I wonder is the council privy to those little morsels? Exodus' incredible restraint not to read Xavier's or Emma's memories and see Sinister's betrayal first hand is enviable.

[rcaguy]

That's certainly is a conclusion.

One I don't know how the **** you came to

But it is one.

Read what you posted.

[ZephyrSurf]

Read what you posted.

I did, nowhere did I say I didn't want them written about. You're not gonna gotcha me on my stance.

[rcaguy]

I think this thread is operating from a bit of a logical fallacy in that in the Krakoan era, the X-Line really aren't "superhero" books any more with "heroes" and "villains."

We're in speculative fiction territory now and these are stories of varying levels of machinations on the political, sci-fi/fantasy, philosophical, ethical, and even "religious" realms.

There are no simple "good guys" or "bad guys" anymore.

This actually began around the time when Claremont brought Rogue and Magneto into the fold. The problems really began when Claremont left and the others who came after him basically tried to turn the X-Line back into "superhero" books.

Which failed horribly.